Lakeside Plane

[Jerry Murray]

I don't know where I got this plane, but have had it for a few years now and it's just sat gathering dust.

Anyway, it is a Lakeside R-7. I took it apart last night and started cleaning it up.

Any experience with this plane? It's pretty old, but looks to be in great shape.

[Jim Koepke]

I had a Lakeside #5 at one time. I was a good plane. I donated it to a friend for their use. They are a homeowner, not a wood worker.

Is the R-7 the same as a Stanley #7?

I think Lakeside may have been an early Wards brand.

jim

[Tomi Rosso]

I know this is old thread, but header is just right, so I continue to here.

I saw one Lakeside no.5 plane here in one place which is selling old stuff. My interesting was waked up, when I saw there was "Made in USA" casted at front. I made little bit seaching and find out that Lakeside was Montgomery Wards brands made by Stanley.

When these planes were made? Are those old or really old or newer that I could think? Is there any catalog of those in internet? If not at Lakeside planes then Wards generally.

I want to know little bit more about these and Wards other planes too. First when I noticed that Wards brand was some Jims posts where he is using his Wards Master 45. But that is almost all I know about those.

And if I become very interested, I go to get that plane with me next time.

BR,
TR

[Bill Houghton]

Although this is a bit of thread drift, I've got a Wards Master smoothing plane that's an excellent tool. I don't know if the Master series was consistently good or spotty; but, if you find one in the wild, don't just walk by it, but have a look at it.

[Jim Koepke]

Without seeing images of the tools it would be impossible to tell when they were made or to confirm they may have been made by Stanley.

My recollection of the Lakeside #5 I gave to a friend was it was built like a Stanley type 13 or 14. That has been almost a decade ago at this time.

jtk

[steven c newman]

Weren't the "R-" series by Rochester?

I do have a Master Quality from Wards.....same as a WW2 era Stanley. Decent enough little #3

My Wards #78 is also by Stanley.

Just like Ohio Tool Co. put a "0" ahead of their numbers ( like the 0-7 I have) Rochester used an "R-" on their planes.

[Tomi Rosso]

Okei, so there are no specific era when Lakesides or other Wards planes are made? I take some pictures, if I turned to go buy that plane.

Is that so, all Wards planes are not made by Stanley? Which manufacturers was made those?

[Jim Koepke]

Okei, so there are no specific era when Lakesides or other Wards planes are made? I take some pictures, if I turned to go buy that plane.

Is that so, all Wards planes are not made by Stanley? Which manufacturers was made those?

Most large retailers like Wards, Penny's, Sears et al would put the contracts for their tools and other stock out to bid. Whoever submitted the best offer would make them.

Sometimes different manufactures would have a separate name on their planes like Hercules for Sargent and Dunlap for Millers Falls. Not sure if Lakeside was a Stanley exclusive brand name or not. It may be the other names were also not exclusive.

The pursuit of money can make a business or its people do strange things.

jtk

[Dave Anderson NH]

Lakeside is one of the Hardware store brand names and there are actually folks who collect Lakeside planes to the exclusion of other badges.

[Bill Houghton]

Well, of course there are. There are people who collect dishwashers, after all...

[Glen Canaday]

Millers Falls also made much Craftsman, Fulton, some stuff for others like P&C, etc. They never made Lakesides. I thought those were always Stanley?

At any rate, they were meant for homeowners but are quite good enough for use in our shops. As for period, I *guess* around the 50's, pretty sure it was after WWII.

[bridger berdel]

I have a lakeside transitional plane that sure looks part for part identical to a stanley transitional I have, branding excepted. I have both lakeside and wards master chisels- the lakeside seem to be the "higher end" in terms of fit and finish. Both are excellent steel and quite well made.

[Tomi Rosso]

I made little more searching just at coffeebreak. I found a picture of later type Union from Don's webpage. Casted body looked identical.

That Lakeside had Union look a like twisted lateral. That gives me on imput to search Union pictures more. Don had picture of Union body with exactly same "Made in USA" at front and No 5 at back. No other markings on casting. No casted ring under knob. Frog looked at same from the back. Keyhole levercap. Lakeside logo at same kind of rectanle as Union is. Levercap looks quite much same, only name is different.

Would be interesting to see what is under the iron and frog. Does it looks after that also identical.

That could be quite reasonable if Stanley made all Lakesides. That spesific item could be made from Union parts.

[Jim Koepke]

I made little more searching just at coffeebreak. I found a picture of later type Union from Don's webpage. Casted body looked identical.

That Lakeside had Union look a like twisted lateral. That gives me on imput to search Union pictures more. Don had picture of Union body with exactly same "Made in USA" at front and No 5 at back. No other markings on casting. No casted ring under knob. Frog looked at same from the back. Keyhole levercap. Lakeside logo at same kind of rectanle as Union is. Levercap looks quite much same, only name is different.

Would be interesting to see what is under the iron and frog. Does it looks after that also identical.

That could be quite reasonable if Stanley made all Lakesides. That spesific item could be made from Union parts.

Stanley bought Union Plane Company in 1920. Not sure the Lakeside name predates that.

Stanley made some planes using a twisted lateral adjusting lever.

To the best of my knowledge all of the Union lateral levers use a disk to engage with the blade. Early models have the disk above the pivot rivet. Later models are below the rivet.

Stanley and others also used a bend in the metal to replace the disk. This is a less expensive way to make a lateral adjusting lever.

jtk

[steven c newman]

The "R" in the stamped number is what Rochester used on the planes they made.....so it would be a Rochester R-7 and #7 sized jointer plane.

The Remington ones were by stanley. The twisted lever for the lateral was either a Union ( until Stanley used them all up after the buyout) or an Ohio Tool Co. made plane. Sargent also used the twisted lateral lever.

[Greg Wease]

A little history per PTAMPIA II:

The Lakeside labeled planes were sold from 1912-1950 and were made by Stanley and Sargent.
Rockford planes were made from 1900-1926 with markings like that on the original OP's plane. A division of H.C. Marsh Co.
Marsh/Rockford was sold to the Union Plane Company in 1924, which was already owned by Stanley at the time.

And Stanley used the twisted lateral on many planes made for other companies.

[Glen Canaday]

Stanley-made Siegleys also had the twist. I have a couple of the StS transitionals and they are twisted.

There are differences in the twists as well as the overall shape of the teardrop at the end, but I usually have trouble remembering whose was whose so I have begun trying not to put my foot in my mouth in public.

[Tomi Rosso]

The Lakeside labeled planes were sold from 1912-1950 and were made by Stanley and Sargent.
Rockford planes were made from 1900-1926 with markings like that on the original OP's plane. A division of H.C. Marsh Co.
Marsh/Rockford was sold to the Union Plane Company in 1924, which was already owned by Stanley at the time.

That's quite interesting. If I stick strictly laterals again, I look little bit pictures of Lakesides from internet and there are Sargent type and that twisted type what I was could found. Those were little bit different anyway.


To the best of my knowledge all of the Union lateral levers use a disk to engage with the blade. Early models have the disk above the pivot rivet. Later models are below the rivet.

I found another no 5 from ebay and that looks just like that Lakeside I was seen. Looks lot like Union and that dealer was included picture without cutter. There was Jim mentioned lateral with disk, below the rivet.

Now seems that I need to get that plane that I can look what body and frog looked like. :)

And have Stanley cutters, where hole is at opposite direction than cutting edge? How about Sargents? I have only one Sargent VBM 415 and in that hole is at upper end, not cutting edges end. Is that something do with plane age? Older versus newer? Or does other manufactures have different way of made cutters? My Union 4 have also hole like my Sargent.

348099

[Jim Koepke]

And have Stanley cutters, where hole is at opposite direction than cutting edge? How about Sargents? I have only one Sargent VBM 415 and in that hole is at upper end, not cutting edges end. Is that something do with plane age? Older versus newer? Or does other manufactures have different way of made cutters? My Union 4 have also hole like my Sargent.

348099

Union Mfg. Co. spun off their plane making in ~1917. After that the blades were marked Union Plane Co. So the blade in the image is 1917 or earlier. The lever cap may be a replacement. Not sure when Union started to emboss their name on lever caps.

Stanley patented the large hole at the bottom of the blade in April of 1892. My recollection is they lost a patent fight in a court battle.

jtk

[Robert Payne]

Steven,

I believe that the "R" designation is for Rockford, not Rochester. Rockford planes were made by the H.C. Marsh Company of Rockford Illinois (along with their better know Marsh planes) and sold many to firms like Montgomery Wards -- I have some with Lakeside blades in them. All of the Rockford bench planes had the R-# designation in their castings. In February, 1924, the Union Plane Company bought the HC Marsh Company and two years later, Stanley bought all of the Marsh line from Union and incorporated them into their line. Perhaps the most important part of that acquisition was the Marsh patents for the Picture Frame Tools (http://tooltrip.com/tooltrip9/stanley/stan-mbox/marsh-sw.pdf) which they sold extensively.

A very close friend and fellow woodworker Randy Osborne had the full collection of every Marsh and Rockford plane before he passed away in June 2010 -- After finishing the cabinet he had started, I exhibited the Marsh collection on his behalf at the MWTCA National Meeting in Louisville, KY late that year where it won two awards. I believe his widow sold the entire collection to a collector in Rockford a few years later.

348121 348122

[steven c newman]

348123
Union planes L-R: #3, #4, and a #5-A

348124
The #3 torn down(was made just before Stanley buy-out)

[steven c newman]

Appears that I did have a Lakeside plane come through the shop,once...
348327
Nothing real fancy about it..
348328
Cast frog....almost like a Handyman style
348329
Kind of different, though...
348330
It was just passing through....

[Glen Canaday]

Appears that I did have a Lakeside plane come through the shop,once...
348327
Nothing real fancy about it..
348328
Cast frog....almost like a Handyman style
348329
Kind of different, though...
348330
It was just passing through....

It looks like it passed through the kitchen for a bite before leaving.

[Tomi Rosso]

Sorry for late reply. I finaly got it. I don't say that so bulky and not well made. I think it look quite good.

349042

349043

349044

I still think it looks a lot like this. After that I am pretty sure.

http://timetestedtools.forumchitchat.com/post/information-on-typing-union-bench-planes-7539560

Scroll down when you see two disassembled planes.

Br,
TR

[Tomi Rosso]

I found quite interesting picture from Wards catalog at 1920. Not my plane, but still.

349069

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzJxodHACRRuUU5LMU1IQ3JpUFE/view

[Jim Koepke]

I found quite interesting picture from Wards catalog at 1920. Not my plane, but still.

349069

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzJxodHACRRuUU5LMU1IQ3JpUFE/view

Be careful following the link.

I just spent an hour looking through a catalog.

At least my wallet was safe.

jtk

[steven c newman]

Went through that catalog, too.....thinking about how many of those tools are like ones I have in the shop......the Stanley No. 358? the price back then is about what I paid for mine this past spring.....counting an extra saw or two...

Twould be nice to be able to buy a Stanley No. 55 at the price that was listed back then......instead of 10x that amount....