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Carl Maeda-San Diego
04-15-2009, 3:34 AM
Hello, I'm a long time reader here and a pretty infrequent poster.
I have been coming up with designs for a new workbench that has no vise or bench dogs. It will instead have T-Tracks routed into the top. The top will be 2 1/2" thick oak or maple.
I did some initial tests and when the T-Track is cross-grain, it is plenty strong, even at 1/4" thick. If the T-Track is routed with the grain, it looks like I need 3/8" at least so I'll probably make all the T-Tracks 1/2" deep for good measure.
Since with a T-Track, I can place a bench dog anywhere, I won't need a vise. I'll just have a T-Track on the benchtop edge where I can clamp things using 2 T-Bolts and some wood.
Everything looks ok but some of my friends are being naysayers. They think just because they never heard of anyone doing this, it must not be good.
I have it pretty well thought out. For example, to clamp thin pieces, I plan to make some wood fit into the T-track and protrude just a little bit. Then use the edge t-slot to clamp my piece to the workbench.
I think at 1/2" thick, the t-slots should hold up for a very long time.
I'm also going to build in a planing stop that slides into the t-track.
Can anyone see any problems with this workbench design? I think I thought everything out but I would rather see any problems now before I buy stuff.
Thanks!

Luke Townsley
04-15-2009, 8:53 AM
Hello, I'm a long time reader here and a pretty infrequent poster.
I have been coming up with designs for a new workbench that has no vise or bench dogs. It will instead have T-Tracks routed into the top. The top will be 2 1/2" thick oak or maple.
I did some initial tests and when the T-Track is cross-grain, it is plenty strong, even at 1/4" thick. If the T-Track is routed with the grain, it looks like I need 3/8" at least so I'll probably make all the T-Tracks 1/2" deep for good measure.
Since with a T-Track, I can place a bench dog anywhere, I won't need a vise. I'll just have a T-Track on the benchtop edge where I can clamp things using 2 T-Bolts and some wood.
Everything looks ok but some of my friends are being naysayers. They think just because they never heard of anyone doing this, it must not be good.
I have it pretty well thought out. For example, to clamp thin pieces, I plan to make some wood fit into the T-track and protrude just a little bit. Then use the edge t-slot to clamp my piece to the workbench.
I think at 1/2" thick, the t-slots should hold up for a very long time.
I'm also going to build in a planing stop that slides into the t-track.
Can anyone see any problems with this workbench design? I think I thought everything out but I would rather see any problems now before I buy stuff.
Thanks!

Unless the grooves you make go through the top, you will have a rat's nest of shavings and sawdust sort of like having a tool tray.

Carl Maeda-San Diego
04-15-2009, 10:52 PM
Oh yeah, the t-track will go through the top as well as the edges.

glenn bradley
04-15-2009, 11:24 PM
I had asked about this and got a few comments about the track getting bent from the occasional accidental over tightening. Eventually the track became quite a pain. I'll try to find the original responses. I went with dog holes and am happy but it seems that if you were careful, or used a real heavy track like Kreg's, it should work.

Carl Maeda-San Diego
04-16-2009, 1:54 AM
i was going to use a router to rout the t-track directly on the workbench. Instead of the usual 1/4" or so on the lip of the t-track, I was going to put a 1/2" or maybe even a 3/4" lip so I don't have to worry about the t-track breaking or bending.
I did a couple tests and it seems like 1/2" should be plenty.
I'm just not sure if I'm missing something.

James Carmichael
04-16-2009, 7:03 AM
I had asked about this and got a few comments about the track getting bent from the occasional accidental over tightening. Eventually the track became quite a pain. I'll try to find the original responses. I went with dog holes and am happy but it seems that if you were careful, or used a real heavy track like Kreg's, it should work.

Glenn,

From what I recall of a post you made on this same experiment, you found the t-bolts were no substitute for bench dogs and would not hold up as a planing stop. What kind of t-bolt fastener were you using?

I've pondered this design myself. I would definitely use the heaviest track I could get and epoxy/screw it in. I would also probably drill extra screw holes.

IIRC, A&I Supply sells a heavy track that uses 3/8" hex bolts.

I really don't see what advantage, if any, this would have over dogs, but I'd like to see pictures of your design. Maybe I'm being obtuse, but I don't understand why cross vs parallel to the grain would make any difference t-track strength. Is this referring to the holding strengh of the t-bolt, or the tracks ability to stay put?

Doug Shepard
04-16-2009, 7:32 AM
I used one of the LV T-track bits http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=51233&cat=1,46168,46176&ap=1 to cut the slots on this DP table
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=185091&postcount=3
You might be limited to the 3/8" overall depth that the bigger LV bit offers although you should probably cut the main depth groove with a straight bit or dado blade first. As long as the slot width is wide enough to allow the tapered part of the shank to fit, you could go deeper than 3/8 with the LV bit.

I can attest to this

Unless the grooves you make go through the top, you will have a rat's nest of shavings and sawdust sort of like having a tool tray.
being an issue just for the limited number on my DP table. I often can't slide the fence or attach stp blocks or holddowns without first vacuuming out the slots. That might get pretty tedious on the number of slots you've probably got in mind.

Carl Maeda-San Diego
04-17-2009, 12:08 AM
James, I'm going to rout out the t-track into the workbench top so I won't have a need for the metal t-tracks. This is why cross grain is stronger.
Yeah, I can see the problem about the slots getting filled with sawdust and shavings.
I'm not sure if I'd be willing to deal with that.

Doug Shepard
04-17-2009, 8:35 AM
I dont know if this would be feasible but maybe if you drilled holes from the bottom up and stopped at the T slot bottom, it would provide some escape for dust out of the track?? maybe 1/2" diameter or so, every 8 or 10" along the track ??
Just a thought.

Carl Maeda-San Diego
04-17-2009, 11:28 PM
That sounds like it might work... but I think I'll stick with a traditional design.
I use t-tracks for all my jigs so I really like them.
Now, on to finding some cheap hardwood to build this... I'll probably just end up buying some #1 Commons from wall lumber.

glenn bradley
04-18-2009, 1:08 AM
Glenn, What kind of t-bolt fastener were you using?

I was using Rockler's 5/16" track and bolts. It was OK till it got the least amount of leverage and then it was all over fast. I have an MDF top so routing the track in directly was not an option for me. Carl's idea of extra deep track milled right in sounds interesting. I think with some "drain" holes for debris it could be slick.