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I've been using the carbide lathe tools to make peppermills, but I'd like to start using a spindle gouge. My peppermills don't have any fine details, just sweeping curves. I sometimes use exotic woods that are pretty dense. What size and shape gouge would be a good fit for this?
That's kind of a loaded question.
For long sweeping curves, a SRG (spindle roughing gouge) can be used for all but the finer details.
Spindle gouges come in many different widths, flute shapes and grind angles. There is almost an infinite combination to be had.
that's just a very small idea of whats' in store once you start looking into gouges and of course, it's very much a personal preference as to which is "best"
Edward, kind of said it all. You can get a range of spindle gouge sizes say from 1/4, 3/8, 1/2 and with a fingernail grind be able to do almost anything. I personally find the 3/8 likely to be the most used sizes but that's just me. Don't forget that a (sometimes dreaded and maligned) skew can do a lot of details. There is also a gouge called a Detail gouge that is similar to the spindle but has more metal under the flute which helps with vibration problems.
Call Doug Thompson of Thompson turning tools. He is a turner and tool maker.
This is one of those ask five turners get 12 answers kinds of questions. I wouldn't worry about it too much at this point. Get a medium size, run of the mill, gouge (maybe 1/4" or 3/8"), put a non-extreme fingernail grind on it and start using it. Plan on wasting an inch of it learning to sharpen it-- I think Alan Lacer has some good videos on that. No need for fancy steel for that part of the tuition! When you get good enough with it to figure out what it can't do then worry about more tools of different shapes and different grinds to tackle problems you can't solve with the B-flat ordinary gouge. You may find you go quite a while without needing a second tool. If you make small coves you'll need a smaller gouge at some point, your SRG, as noted, will do a whole lot of the work for you, especially on smooth flowing forms, and can be a finish tool when presented with a shearing angle. I own a couple of bigger spindle gouges, but almost never use them, 3/8, 1/4, and a smaller one, not sure of the size are my go-tos For the work you describe I'd use a skew, but that's a whole 'nother story.
An excellent question to take to a local woodturning group if you have one. There likely you would have an opportunity to try different sizes and nose shapes before making a decision, and likely will find a few members who turn spindles of various sizes and shapes if not pepper mills.
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Originally Posted by roger wiegand
Thanks. I do have a radius skew, but I haven't used it much. Might be time to learn.
I am more of a bowl turner than anything, but I do some spindle work. There are 2 kinds of spindle roughing gouges. The standard used to be forged, so made from flat stock and heated and bent to a flute shape that is half round. Some are now milled from round stock. The other SRG is a continental style which has a ) shaped flute. Generally forged as well. They were favored by the old bodgers who made spindle chair blanks and would set up out in the woods. Both of these tools will let you get more of a sheer/high angle cut which leaves a cleaner surface so less sanding is needed. You can also get very nice surfaces by using peeling cuts with a skew. For your shapes, you would not be able to do it with a skew that is ground straight across. You would need more of a 1/4 round profile. Learning to use a skew will give you the cleanest surfaces, once you learn to use them. I think the video by Allan Batty is one of the best on You Tube. Most carbide tools are not made to cut at a shear angle, and are generally used as scrapers. Scrapers will leave a coarser surface needing a lot more sanding, even in my hands, and I use scrapers a lot. I can use my scrapers on edge to get that 45 or so degree sheer angle for cleaner cuts. Key is to use the lower 1/3 of the bevel edge, and NEVER go above the middle/center line. The Hunger carbide tools are cups, and are designed to cut at a sheer angle. Sheer scraping also leaves a very nice surface. Bowl gouges also work well. Then, there are detail gouges, which have a shallow flute like the continental detail gouges. They are mostly for detail work like beads and coves, and are more pointed than the continental spindle gouges. Lots to experiment with.
robo hippy
Scott, hard to tell from your question if you have any experience with traditional turning tools. Apologies if anything below is mansplaining.
Especially when learning to use gouges for spindle turning, I think a wider radius flute makes it easier to smoothly make long radius cuts. In addition, the blunter the grind (i.e., not swept back, but more straight across as is typical for roughing gouges), the easier it is to avoid catches while becoming accustomed to using gouges. I think the recommendation for a 3/4" roughing gouge is a good one. . .but this takes you at your word that you're not doing any detailed profiles as the roughing gouge is only intended for broad sweeping cuts. If you're already using carbide to make them, then any details the roughing gouge isn't suitable for, you can do with your existing tool.
If using gouges is new to you, strongly suggest cruising Youtube to find some tips on how to use a gouge. When I started turning (on my own, with no instruction) I was actually using the roughing gouge as a scraper, pushing it straight into the wood instead of using the bevel to guide the cut. The former leaves a much rougher surface, and the tool looses its cut quality more quickly.
Switching from carbide to traditional tools introduces the need to sharpen, so there's more to this than just buying a spindle gouge. Most gouges aren't sharp enough to work well as purchased (sellers assume you are going to sharpen them), and even if they are, they won't stay that way very long.
Most dense exotics respond very well to negative rake scraping, which is also good for addressing any shortcomings in the finished surface coming off the gouge.
Best,
Dave
Since you work more often with exotic and dense woods, I'd say a mid-sized gouge, something around a 1/2-inch spindle gouge would work. It will give you the control and the room to efficiently remove material.
As for the shape, a fingernail grind or a long grind are great options. This shape has a versatile cutting edge, which is perfect for transitions on curves. The fingernail grind gets into tighter spaces better and allows for better sweeping cuts.
If you can, I'd also recommend opting for high-speed steel (HSS) gouges if you haven't already. They tend to hold an edge longer than standard carbon steel, which is better for harder, exotic woods.
Good luck!
Even though I have one, I don't think I'd recommend going the roughing gouge route at least at the start. A 1/2" spindle gouge is a more versatile tool and it can rough anything you are likely to encounter. I've heard Raffan say the same thing about roughing gouges on videos. If your budget doesn't protest and you like tools, then buy both.
Thanks for the info. I ordered a 1/2" spindle gouge from Carter & Son Toolworks.