Shaper question

A few months ago, I mentioned on here that I had some projects in the works which would involve a lot of raised panels. Long tired of making them on the table saw (cove method), I asked about the merits of router and many passes versus a shaper. Of course, the consensus here seemed to be "get a shaper". Thats fine - I like tools.

Well, I have been obsessed with hunting Craigslist for good, used shapers. Twice I just missed out on a powermatic. Other than that, these seem few and far between. Budget is of course a concern, hoping to stay under 500 or so for the machine. 220V would be a little problematic, since I would have to run an extension cord from the oven, but doable.

My question - there seems to be a glut of mid 50's Delta "HD" shapers (Model 43, I believe) around here for a good price. The machines look great, large tables, enclosed base. However, they are all just 1HP and 1/2" spindle. Should I continue waiting for a bigger machine, or blow my shaper budget on one of these? As always, thoughts are much appreciated.

Not familiar with the model numbers. Sorry. If you can find one with two speeds instead of just one and you are wanting to cut a fairly small panel raise ,like many kitchen cabinet doors have...you might be fine,especially if it also has changeable spindles. Check on that, some have that feature and have been separated from the spindles. But I would only use one of those small machines with steel or Tangtung tooling,not the harder to spin carbide.

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Originally Posted by Jake Elkins

A few months ago, I mentioned on here that I had some projects in the works which would involve a lot of raised panels. Long tired of making them on the table saw (cove method),

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It doesn't answer your question about shapers, but, here's a different table saw method that I came up with and have used on several projects that works quite well. Raised panels on a table saw

i would research the tooling you plan to use. you can always use a reducing collar to 1/2". avoid tall knives such as a 3" crown for example; too much spindle whip.
and you'll have to make several passes on the work piece so as not to over load the machine. all compromises in order to keep the price down.

If you can find a Jet JWS-18HO, it will suit your needs. It comes with a 3/4" and 1/2" spindle, and it has 1 7/16" spindle travel ... less then that will make it difficult to get the cutter positioned correctly ...

It has a 1 Hp motor, that I have not found to be lacking at all. It runs on either 110 or 220, and it has a reversing switch.

They are no longer available, but you can find them used well within your price range.

If you are looking at a Delta 43-505, I would wait ... it is more like a router in a table than a real shaper.

With shapers bigger is better. A .5 spindle isn't much farther ahead than a router, however a delta HD shaper can take up to a 1" spindle. Also mechanically the 1.5hp delta hd's are the same as the later 3hp versions.

This is my 3hp delta the day I brought it home.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...psrdrctx5i.jpg

And just for fun my 5hp 1.25" spindle compared to the delta 3/4". http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...pst6c20svb.jpg

Once ypu get one you realize Shapers are awesome..

You can wait.....but it may be a very, very long wait. Finding a "bigger machine" for "under $500" in usable condition is incredibly optimistic. Now I've gotten some really great bargains on used machinery over the years, but that's just really hoping for a lot. Even a small shaper is better than a router IMHO so I'd grab one of those Delta's your seeing and make some dust. You may be able to replace the spindle and get a 3/4" on there which will get a lot more work done. A 1hp while not ideal can be adequate. Keep in mind these machines were originally designed with those 1 - 1-1/2hp motors in mind, and while over the years they have put larger motors and spindles on, the size of the bearings has not gotten larger.

good luck,
JeffD

Of course I agree with the remarks about larger shapers , and more importantly Op does. But there are lots of things that can be done on the small ones. Years ago the large shapers were more "mill" machines and the "shops" had the smaller ones. With the steel collars and grindable steel knives the machines worked pretty well, and for the less frequent big knife jobs they farmed them to the mills. Size of shapers can be like TV screen size. If you have to have one bigger than your friends ....rent a "drive in"

Keep saving, raise budget, keep looking. You can raise panels with 1 hp, slowly, but in the same foot print you can fit a lot more shaper. I looked for over 2 years before finding one locally that fit my needs. I owned a 3HP delta for years, 3/4" spindle, those raise panels just fine. I moved up and on, but its not necessary to get a decent performance. Only issue with those old used delta's is parts chain, few things are available should anything specialized ever fail.

Id stay way from the little LD "light duty" 100 series, as someone said above it's not much more than a router. The 2XX & 3XX series referred to as HD or "heavy duty" are a much better hobby/entry level machine. The older ones came standard with a 1hp but the newer (70's and later) came with a 3hp or 5hp as an extra. The HD will use a 1/2" or 3/4" spindle with the later ones also took a 1" spindle. All are capable of raising panels, but I'd stick with a 3hp or larger and 3/4" or 1" spindles and cutters if you're new to shapers. Cost wise a HD on average go for 300-500ish around here. Once you go to a real shaper you'll never look at a router in the same light... it's a whole new level. Better cut, longer cutter life and a lot faster!

Mike

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Originally Posted by Mel Fulks

Of course I agree with the remarks about larger shapers , and more importantly Op does.

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Originally Posted by Peter Quinn

Keep saving, raise budget, keep looking.

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Thanks everyone for the guidance. I will follow advice and wait for a good one to come along. I won't be able to do much WWing until the tundra defrosts, so I will have some time. Good to know that in desperate times, one of these Deltas would work in a pinch. Thanks again.

There are 3/4"X1/2" bushings that allow you to use 3/4" cutters on 1/2" shaft. You don't need a new spindle.

I guess it depends a lot on where you are and how much space/power you need. If you live in US border state it may be worth looking at something like this:
( http://www.kijiji.ca/v-power-tool/ca...ationFlag=true ) - at 1.4 canabucks per dollar his asking is not
that far out of your range - and the K-351 is a nice machine (although he's had that ad running for a very long time and that raises questions )

Note that craigslist is relatively little used in Canada, kijiji has the market clout.

P.S. I would not recommend the smaller shapers - my own very (and I mean very) limited experience says more power, and more weight, are both better - easier, safer, quieter.

I have a 1/2 hp delta shaper that is very similar to the one your looking at. It is 35 years old and other than a new belt has no issues. I bought it new.

It has a 1/2" diameter shaft and like I said previously bushings allow 3/4" cutters.
I've made block paneling, entrance doors, bank board room trim and 4X7 door. With extension tables attached, it has been more than adequate. Mine will rotate clockwise or counter clock wise.

A larger machine will require more shop space.