Hello Folks - New Member - TS 55 - ATF 55 or PC MAG325 works best with EZ Smart?

Hello Folks - I am one of many working to supplement my special Enron retirement plan living in Atlanta, GA. I have been reading your forums since Friday when not working with great gusto because this forum has a lot of meat in it if you look. lol.

I am keenly interested in the making the right decision from a short list of three for panel cutting only with the EZ Smart system. No, I am not going to sell my 12 inch smcs, ts or bs because they all serve a necessary purpose for me. The primary purpose is panels and more panels; the feature of ripping at least 5/4 - 6/4 but usually use the ts so panels is the name of the game.

If EZ Smart did not have the dual repeater and square repeater system I would already have a TS 55 and new tracks enroute but found this forum and frankly am thinking of getting and combining both the Festool and EZ Smart if practical to use Festool on both rails without a major missing on the EZ Smart. I know that many of you use EZ Smart and love it with all three saws I will consider so asking for your counsel.

My personal preference without taking into the EZ Smart for a cs is TS 55, then the ATF 55 E, and then the PC MAG325 in this order. Clean cross cuts with the least possible amount of dust are very important to me. Good plunge cutting with stops is important to me and safety - the riving knife on the TS 55 and the ATF 55 E makes it inherently safer than css without it. I am too much the perfectionist to be happy with tools that are almost the best.

I can put a Hock blade and chip breaker in Stanley or Groz hand planes and spend 8 hours tuning them and they will produce shavings that look as spectacular as my Lie Nielsen planes - but they so not feel as good working in my hand and are not as precise to adjust; and even thought Hock makes an excellent blade it will need to be sharpened quicker. All three will so the job well but one stands out as the best of the three. I want the best of the three if I can get it

My question to you folks that have been using the EZ Smart system is what will I give up with with each of the these so I can make the best choice for my shop. It may be that the ATF 55 works better with the EZ Smart system than the TS 55 with a depth of cut advantge of x inches and that the inconvenience of the missing new features on TS 55 (blade changes - riving - depth gauge etc.) are overcome by the advantages of the ADF 55 on the EZ Smart system, or maybe there are none? Perhaps the cuts are just good with a high quality blade on the PC MAG325 and that the dust EZ Dust modification puts it so close that the the difference is negligible and plunge capability and in place bevel capability of the Festools is not present. It may be that the PC MAG325 is the best saw priod for EZ Smart.

I want to buy before the end of May so please take a few minutes and give me your thoughts.

Thanks for sharing your expertise and observations.

Rodney,
You realy know how to stir things up don't you. Both the Festool and EDZ camps have had a number of heated discussions on SMC. Since I use neither I'll sit on the side lines and watch the fireworks.

Oh and if I hadn't said it welcome to the creek.

(this is Don, sitting in AZ looking down and shaking his head)

Awwwhhh Ohooooo........ Opps.


Hey sweet heart, bring the popcorn would you dear...... The action is about to begin.:D

LOL -

this is not intentional - I think both systems are very good but want the ability to use both guide systems depending on what I am doing. I want to be reasonably sure that I am not shooting myself in the foot buying the TS 55 and finding out later that the ADF 55 was a better choice for using with both systems.

Or even worse that the TS 55 is ill suited to the current EZ Smart Sysytem and that the ATF 55 is missing too many features to be a smart compromise in which case I end up with one Festool and 1 PC. .

Both guide systems offer advantages. ;) lol .......... and my wife says I am not diplomatic enough!

Rodney,

The TS 55 has many advantages, or rather improvements, over the ATF 55 - first of which is that the ATF 55 is only available as a used tool, since it is no longer being manufactured. I don't know if there any advantages of the ATF 55 vs the TS 55 on the EZ rail, perhaps Dino or Burt can clarify.

Bob

Rodney,
I have no idea of you situation or how involved you are getting into sheetgoods but if you are doing this as a part/full profession you may also want to consider a European Format Slider. I say this as not being argumentative but simply because many people here in the USA do not know about these machines or their capabilties. I am sure you will get many opinions on the guides saws from others.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rodney ORourke

Hello Folks

If EZ Smart did not have the dual repeater and square repeater system I would already have a TS 55 and new tracks enroute but found this forum and frankly am thinking of getting and combining both the Festool and EZ Smart if practical to use Festool on both rails without a major missing on the EZ Smart. I know that many of you use EZ Smart and love it with all three saws I will consider so asking for your counsel.

.

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Hi Rodney.
For the versatility and price-space-safety-mobility-ease of use speed and accuracy, the Dead wood Concept with the ez smart system or the Festool + ez smart system...is a very good choice.

You can go with either system and use the other to supplement your needs.
For panel cutting you need the "cabinetmaker" and the "SRK"
The SRK works with both systems ,
but the cabinetmaker, for now, only with the ez smart.

In your case...(a perfectionist) go with both systems and two saws.
The new TS-55 and the PC Mag 325. Use the MAG
for the first 3 full cross cuts and everything after that the TS-55.

On routing and M&T dado and the rest, you can use
the Festool rails with the SRK and the ez rails as a clamping
and positioning fixture.

Good luck.
But really you don't need much luck with your decision.:cool:
Both companies offer 30 day no hassle return policy. :cool:

Hello Bob / Paul / Dino

Thanks for your input gentlemen.

Bob I can get a good ATF 55 - like new - but was concerned about given up all the features on the new TS 55 and see you think the same way. I got the impression somewhere that the TS 55 had a shortfall with either the square or 2 arm EZ Smart Repeater.

Paul on European Format Slider do you mean on ts like the Laguna, Hammer K3 or Rojek PK300v etc. A link would help me if this is not what you meant. Thanks.


Dino - what is the reason you reccomend for perfection the MAG325 for the first 3 full cross cuts and everything after that the TS-55? Does the TS 55 have a shortfall with the current EZ Base mounting with either the EZ Smart Square Repeater or 2 arm EZ Smart Repeater and is dust collection compromised usiing the EZ Base? I want to be sure I am working EZ'er :confused:

Thanks guys

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rodney ORourke

Hello Bob / Paul / Dino


Paul on European Format Slider do you mean on ts like the Laguna, Hammer K3 or Rojek PK300v etc. A link would help me if this is not what you meant. Thanks.


Thanks guys

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Rodney,
If you are looking into sheet goods you will be best served with a 8.5 ft to 10.5ft slider (they go up to 12 I believe) This gives you the full rip capacity of a full 8 to 10ft sheet. My slider also replaced my CS for all solid stock processing ( I use 60/40 solid wood) not limited to but including: ripping, straight line edging, all croscutting, mitering, compund miters, beveling..... The crosscut fences also allow lengths of up to 10ft on many saws.

I am not sure what models on the companies you mentioned but I do believe Laguna has some sliders (manuf by Robland) and Rojek has some of the bigger sliders as well. Also check out MiniMax/SCM, Felder, Knapp, Casolin, Casadie, Martin, Altendorf.... and the list goes on and on. What you basically are looking for is a "T" shaped base foot print saw as these will give you the longer sliders. Check out some of my past posts here as I have tried to explain these types of saws the best I can.

They do cost a bit and are not for everyone but if you are doing this as a business it is worth a look at. If you are only doing occasional sheetgoods or are strictly doing this as a serious hobby either type of guided saw system will work well. I liked & choose the Festool system (I no longer have the saw) because I use all of their others tools: sanders, jig saw, routers, drills and dc vac both with and without their guide system.

Hello Paul -

Super lead list - thank you! :D

Rodney

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rodney ORourke

Dino - what is the reason you reccomend for perfection the MAG325 for the first 3 full cross cuts and everything after that the TS-55? Does the TS 55 have a shortfall with the current EZ Base mounting with either the EZ Smart Square Repeater or 2 arm EZ Smart Repeater and is dust collection compromised usiing the EZ Base? I want to be sure I am working EZ'er :confused:

Thanks guys

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Rodney.
After your first 2-3 full 48" cross cuts, (square) all other cuts are
30"-34" max. You need the longer reach of the PC MAG 325 and after that the convenience of the plunge saw.

Edit to add. The above observation isn't true for all people.
The best way to find out what tool works better for YOU is to try the tool.
I can cross cut full length with the ATF but easier with the PC Mag 325.


When I use the ATF-55 with the cabinetmaker or the repeaters,
the entire system works better-faster and easier.
Make your cut and move the guide rail with the saw on it and without the need to bring the saw back,( pass the wood) in order to move the rail.
With the ATF you don't have to worry about the saw-guard.
Few other benefits on the ATF that I like:
Dust control. Variable speed (think of aluminum and plastic's)
Depth stop ,good selection of good blades and a precision plunge.

If you like to have the ultimate system:
Go for the new TS-55 with one or more Festool rails. (depth of cut- bevels)
Go fro the F-SRK (works on the Festool and EZ rails)
Go for the ez rails with the cabinetmaker and a PC mag 325.
and the most important item to complete the system.
A good material support system.
Think of the Smart table top kit on the MFT.

The idea is to go the safe route.
If you go all Festool or EZ-Festool and you find any limitations...
...We love challenges.

Rodney,

One thing I recommend highly is to get the long guide rail if you buy the Festool.

I have two shorter ones and when they are joined they are quite sturdy, but the raised "track" that the saw rides on is not consistent from one to the next to such a degree that my saw will stop when it gets 1-2" into the 2nd rail. I had to adjust the saw quite loose on one rail to get it to cross the transition between the two. This weekend was the first time I had used two joined together and had to make several tapered cuts 85" long, and even with the "bump" in the rail the cut was smooth.

But if you're gonna spend $$$ you'll feel a lot better if you don't have to deal with this, it didn't make me happy.

Even on my ATF55 the dust collection is very, very good, and the TS55 is supposed to be better. Another big plus on the TS55 is the abilty to plunge without removing the riving knife.

Also, keep in mind that Dino makes a SRK for Festool rails, I bought one and it has worked well so far (only one project:o )

Good Luck,

Pete

Hello Dino & Peter & Paul -

Excellenr and very helpful posts. Thanks guys.

Peter, the Festool package is in progress but I am confident my supplier friend will work something out with me so I can adjust my deal per your valuable input.

Dino, I sent you an e-mail and appreciate your guidance on combining the two systems which sounds awesome; even if it is a bit high-end for the pocket book of a 62 year old former Enron employee. lol. The price escalated pretty fast when I started adding the little bells and whistles to both systems that makes them worthwhile.

Paul, I am saving your posts for in my plan book for the next ts system. Thanks, your time was not wasted here.

I feel good about moving ahead on the systems.

Many thanks to everyone that took their time and experience to help me here