What do I really need to get started?

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Okay, I ordered this book today...[Malcolm Tibbets -the Art of segmented Turning].....most of you know I am fairly well equipped as far as turning goes...........my question .................What is necessary to get started in segmented turning? I have a good miter gauge for my tablesaw ......an Osborne EB-3, miter saws, and I have a disc/belt sander combo........and a Jet 16/32 plus drum sander..........

What about a press for clamping down rings......seems like somewhere in the memory banks I saw someone show a picture of one, but not sure they are necessary? I am a total newbie on segmenting, but I can't stand not making some of the beautiful things possible any longer....:eek:.......some of you segmenters.....HELP!

Malcolm Tibbets -the Art of segmented Turning should do it, i have skimmed it before, he is an expert

you will also need patience, 200 pieces is one thing, some of those things have over 1000

Brave soul. From what I have read you will need a lot of clamps. Patience above all else. Looking forward to seeing what you make.

Roger sounds like you have most of what you need buy yourself a couple hundred clamps and you should be good to go.
From what i have seen you do you should be ready to turn out some great looking pieces in no time can't wait to see what you do. just start out with a few basic pieces and go from there good luck. You may never go back to regular turning it is just another vortex

Prozac and Adderall

Sounds like you have most of the large tools, but a few little things that can be useful are:
Lots of large hose clamps. It is hard to find one over 8 inches, but if they are the same brand, you can connect 2 or more together. Don't get the cheap ones you get at the Borgs. They will strip out. Get quality clamps at a plumbing supply or good hardware store.

Rubber bands. Again, get the good ones. the cheap ones break on the sharp edges of the wood. Rubber bands can substitute for hose clamps on some rings, and are self tightening.

Lots of Glue. Both light and dark. Using the right color makes the seams hide better.

You don't need a press to start, but you may want to build one in the future. To begin, you can glue your rings and press them together on your lathe, using the quill for pressure.

Wax paper to keep your rings from glueing to your bench, but you knew this one.

Possibly some dyed veneer for very thin separator lines between rings/segments.

Patience, because there are a few parts of segmenting that are as exciting as watching glue dry... you know parts like watching glue dry.

Read Malcolm's book, and have it ready as a reference. It is excellent. Good luck!

Thank you Brian! Finally a serious list of useful items! I appreciate the encouragement from everyone.............excepting Dr. Keller of course............prozac....:eek:.......geez!:D

Roger, I am by no means an authority on segmentation. I have done one segemented bowl...a fairly large one. Did I do everything right? Who knows... But I do have experience with wood. And I do have experience with glue. Simple answer is that if you have a book that tells you what you need to know, and you have glue and hands, you will be just fine. Whenever we got a new guy in the shop that didn't "trust" glue joints (without screws or buscuits or splines or dowels or whatever) we gave him two pieces of wood about the size of your hands. Put glue on them and told him to hold them together for 30 seconds, set it down, and walk away. At the end of the day, we'd tell 'em to break the joint. Fun to watch is all I have to say.

Bottom line is that if you put something like Titebond II on the pieces and hold them in place for a little bit, you'd be hard pressed to get them apart if you wanted to. This, of course, assumes you have good joints. Gaps in joints are a deal breaker. Even end grain glue ups are remarkably strong. Maybe not in the sense of glueing up short pieces end to end and trying to turn a pool cue, but for segmented forms, you get glue joints both horizontally and vertically.

Again, I am far from an expert on segmenting. But in my limited experience with it, and with my knowledge of woodworking, and with your knowledge of woodworking, I feel confident in saying that you already have what you need.

IF, you don't feel like you have the strength, patience, or attention span...yeah, you can't have enough clamps. ;)

Hey Roger all you need is patience and another $1000. You will be set.:D



Sorry couldn't resist.

That's a cool post Mike.........glue......well, that one is not a problem.......clamps.........well, that one isn't either.......what is that old saying............"he who dies with the most clamps wins" :rolleyes: Anyway, I am looking forward to learning this technique and getting good at it. My love of flatwork tools can morph into my turning world with segmentation and I think artistry is in the design of the segments as well as the turning which is I guess the minor part in segmenting.

I plan to utilize some of my wood that has developed checks, etc. and cut boards from logs on my big bandsaw, and from time to time be able to utilize wood that would not be suitable for bowls any longer, but in the smaller pieces can be used for some nice turnings.

I think my biggest challenge will be finding the time to put into a project.......likely starting one will take a few weeks for me to get finished, as I might get an hour or two here and there. we shall see how it goes!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bernie Weishapl

Hey Roger all you need is patience and another $1000. You will be set.:D



Sorry couldn't resist.

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Bernie........another $1000 ....... :eek: .......you are killing me!

In a way, Roger, an hour or two here, and an hour or two there will work great. That gives you time to do some glueing up and letting it sit and set until you have more time. My thoughts about segmenting have always been that it is easier for the person with flatwork experience that got into turning than vice versa. Segmentation is a wonder blend of the two diverse fields of woodworking. One of the advantages of segmented turning is that you are glueing up dry wood, so you don't have to go through the roughing out and re-turning procedures that you do with green wood. BUT there is a LOT of time spent in piecing together a blank. Not to mention designing it. There IS a lot less waste, though... ;) Unless you count the chips you made, planing, jointing, table sawing... :D

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Originally Posted by Mike Cruz

and you have glue and hands, you will be just fine.

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I think Mike's reply is really good. I've done only a small amount of segmenting and never anything very elaborate. But the one thing I found goes back to the line I quoted from Mike, segmenting is really messy. Get yourself a work surface that is easy to clean the glue off of, like a large sheet of heavy glass. And get used to having lots of glue on your hands and everywhere you wipe them.

Roger, you might want to put www. segmentedwoodturners.org on your reference list. Very informative. Good luck.

Charlie

good morning roger: I have been segmenting for many many years. You are heading down the slippery slope!! The first book I always recommend is Woodturning with Ray Allen, by Nish. The reason is that this one has a large section that shows you how to build, piece by piece, the wild featurebands! It also has quite a few projects (and they are not sissy ones) with all the measurements for you. Also a great gallery of pieces to get your juices flowing!Attachment 228881
Now as to tools, you can use an arm powered mitrebox if you have one. it will need a very nice blade. You can use your osbourne, but it will be hard to hold your wood strips and you may get kickback..maybe not. I use an incra with a sled, but I used a mitrebox for years. I would really suggest you don't rely on sanding to achieve your angles. Get it right when you cut it, and you can ignore the sander. I use a Freud 55.00 blade and it cuts well. One does not need a 100.00 blade. Your biggest hurdle will be the precision needed for PERFECT joints. You can't fudge here at all. they will show & look awful.
Hose clamps & i use a chuck for weight if I need it, but I rarely do. Just cinch up the hose clamp and whack the pieces down with a mallet if you have to. Your pieces should be all the same height, tho, and should flatten easily as you cinch up the row. Almost forgot..use good quality kiln dried wood/lumber...
If you have questions, Roger, send me a pm..I'll be happy to help. The piece I showed above was cut on a mitrebox and is 800+ pieces with my own original design. Give you something to strive for!!!

Thank you for that information Michelle............and btw, good mornin'! I look forward to getting started, once I get Malcolm's book here and get it read...........I have a few boards laying around that are cutoffs from other work.........mostly red oak, but I also have a bit of mahogany, walnut, and of course pine............I will get some melamine for my glue-up surface, as it can be wiped clean easily [thanks Curt!] ...........I think I am going to get addicted with this, Michelle! :eek:;)

malcolm's book is good, but ask your local library to get the book I suggested. Malcolm's is , in my opinion, not a beginner's book. Reading both won't hurt. He also has videos if you are flush. Having been addicted to segmenting for decades, i am pleased you'll be suffering the same with me. Misery loves company!!!

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Originally Posted by Charles Drake

Roger, you might want to put www. segmentedwoodturners.org on your reference list. Very informative. Good luck.

Charlie

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Did that last evening Charles............might even have to become a member [there's another $25!] but no doubt worth every penny!

Roger, I'm going to say this as a caution from theory, not from experience. Those with experience can either support my caution, or refute it...

I would be carelful combining woods of very dissimilar density, like pine and oak, becase it may be difficult to A) get a good clean even cut, B) sand without gouging the soft stuff, and C) "control" the movement of the pieces...during the glue up stages and over time. Not really sure how much C would come into play, but I can imagine A and B could make life a lot more difficult on you.

Again, not talking out of experience with segmenting, but out experience with woodworking in general and in theory about turning it.

Yeah Mike, I will watch about using pine......I just mentioned it because it came to mind as something I have on hand.....segmented should be hardwoods........and kiln dried, from what I see others with experience saying........I may try to air dry some small boards over a year or so, but that will be just to utilize the wood I have that has cracked some........I am not one to waste precious resources.

you can make vessels from pine..just make it all from pine. i've seen it done successfully

Roger, you may already have this information, but I have found this article to be helpful. I often refer to the tables in 3-4, 3-5, and 3-6 and just thought you might find them of use.

http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/fpl_pdfs/ch03.pdf

As a flatworker, I am sure you are aware of this, but equilibrium is probably the most important characteristic of which to be aware. The actual moisture content of the wood is only part of the formula for a good glue up. For that reason, even if it is dry, you should store all the wood to be used for a project in the same environment for at least 3-4 weeks and have good air circulation around it - longer if you can.

As I said, I am sure with your years of experience this is elementary, but it is offered more for the sake of others that may view this thread. Good luck on your diversionary journey!!!

John, that is good advice for ANYBODY...regardless of experience. It is easily forgotten, but necessary, info...

Great resource John..........I saved that file for future reference, and yes all wood needs to be acclimated properly and if one air dries wood it should be stickered correctly and checked periodically with a moisture meter in several locations.........thanks for the information.

I don't know if this is a diversion or a detour..........but I am going to give it a try and see what I can do with it among some other things.