SawStop + Hammer A3 layout?

I think I've settled on the core tools in this summer's two car shop build out.

a SawStop with some kind of outrigger support, a Hammer A3 41 and a 18bx (or used MM20) will provide the core tool cluster. I've looked at the various combos and sliders and while the budget could swing it, I think Imma go with this. I really want the 16" jointer capability and combos with 410 mm start in the 25k range. What I really want is a used Lab350, but alas.

So question: How do folks arrange a euro style J/P and an American table saw to get better use of shared infeed/outfeed support?

For reference, I have a whole side of the workshop allocated to just this, with an effective working area of around 20' deep and 14' wide with some spacing fore/aft. I'm planning on using the t/s outfeed as my main assembly table too, but puttin gin some height adjustment to lower it down for "assemble" mode.

On a combo you put the j/p and ts side by side but I'm not so sure how it works with the jointer separate from the TS. Right angles?
Obviously the planer part is at a totally different height.

If you have lots of space & lots of cash, why not look into a euro-slider rather than a conventional cabinet saw. I hear they're the bee's knees.

I was considering one myself, but they take too much space for my shop, so I got a SawStop PCS instead. It is a great machine.

I can't really think of any way that a J/P could share infeed/outfeed support with a table saw, regardless of the type of the latter. Most J/Ps have different levels for flattening than they do for thicknessing. My recommendation is for you to arrange them relative to workflow so they are convenient for you to bounce between them.

For my shop with a slider, the J/P is parallel to the slider's wagon because that places the operator position "in general" in the same space, but facing in the opposite direction. For a North American type saw like the SawStop, I might put the J/P in a similar position, but offset because the operator position for the cabinet saw is in front of the blade/fence, rather than to the side as it is with a slider. You can see my arrangement here:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...psyfsgydr5.jpg

So if the saw was a cabinet saw, I'd move that J/P closer to where I'm standing taking the photo, but in the same plane.

I have to agree that with the combined operations, you wouldn't really be able to share outfeed with a cabinet saw. I would place the jointer to the right of the extension table.

Jim, I have a quick question for you, how much space did you allocate for you're slider? It seems to me that you need about 16'x5'.

I have an A3 31 and a Ridgid Contractor Saw (not jobsite style). I'm pretty sure if I remove the fence from the A3 then it will slide right under the wing of my TS. If your TS outfeed can be lowered far enough then I could see it working as an infeed or outfeed for the A3 in either mode.

I have a basement shop, so my A3 is stored up against the wall and unusable in that position due to the equipment I have on either side. For infeed and outfeed support I have the extensions that Hammer sells, both the short and long versions. They work well enough for my needs.

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Originally Posted by Bryan Lisowski

Jim, I have a quick question for you, how much space did you allocate for you're slider? It seems to me that you need about 16'x5'.

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The 8'6" capacity wagon on my MM S315WD requires 19' for full throw. Without the outrigger (and without cutting down the rip fence), you're probably close on the 5'. I did cut down the right side table 16" so I could move the saw to the right an equal amount without coming up against the stairwell to upstairs. I did this to get more room on the left in my particular shop situation. The the outrigger, you need about 12-13' without a full 8' stick or sheet on the outrigger for crosscutting...a little more if you're just shaving the blade side edge. I have that space now while still being able to walk around toward my bench. It's the nature of my shop. I used to take the outrigger off when I wasn't actually using it, but don't have to do that any more. It's a great support for material I'm processing on the J/P, too. LOL :)

In that photo, the mat butting up to the saw is 4' wide so you can better estimate things.

Infeed/outfeed for the jointer function is fairly simple. For the planer function it's a pain in the patootie, because the planer bed moves rather than the cutterhead. As a result, there's really no good way to "share" infeed/outfeed with another tool. The best option for space saving would likely be to have the in/outfeed zones of the J/P crossing through where YOU will be when working at other tools. Since nobody will be occupying that space when you're using the J/P, it shouldn't be a problem.

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Originally Posted by Jim Becker

The 8'6" capacity wagon on my MM S315WD requires 19' for full throw. Without the outrigger (and without cutting down the rip fence), you're probably close on the 5'. I did cut down the right side table 16" so I could move the saw to the right an equal amount without coming up against the stairwell to upstairs. I did this to get more room on the left in my particular shop situation. The the outrigger, you need about 12-13' without a full 8' stick or sheet on the outrigger for crosscutting...a little more if you're just shaving the blade side edge. I have that space now while still being able to walk around toward my bench. It's the nature of my shop. I used to take the outrigger off when I wasn't actually using it, but don't have to do that any more. It's a great support for material I'm processing on the J/P, too. LOL :)

In that photo, the mat butting up to the saw is 4' wide so you can better estimate things.

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Thank you. I have always liked the idea of a slider, however they do take up a good bit of real estate, more than what I have at the moment.

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Originally Posted by Bryan Lisowski

Thank you. I have always liked the idea of a slider, however they do take up a good bit of real estate, more than what I have at the moment.

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Yes, it has to be planned for, but it's more approachable than one might first consider. I had to move my bench about 6" in one direction to accomodate full throw of the wagon, but that same space is usable for assembly when all the components are prepared. It's a thinking process. Of course, that doesn't take away from "spatial realities" and some shop spaces are not going to readily accomodate a full slider. They may be well served by one with a shorter wagon however if that works well for the type of work someone is doing.

I have both an A3-31 and a sawstop PCS. Both are near my garage door so I can push boards through the jointer and sawstop out the door and push into the planer from outside the door. This saves a lot of shop floor space. This is only a problem when it is raining, which is not much of the year in the central valley of CA.

Thanks for the responses!

John Clark (hi John) convinced me to buy his Hammer K3, so it looks like I'm going the double Hammer route. It has the 78" throw, so I'm happy I have a better plywood handling solution. I'll try to post photos as I get further into the summer.

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Originally Posted by Bryan Lisowski

Thank you. I have always liked the idea of a slider, however they do take up a good bit of real estate, more than what I have at the moment.

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That depends upon what size slider you purchase, I have one that will crosscut 49", that's as large as I need and it doesn't take up any more space than a cabinet saw.

I would never go back to a non slider now, even a small one is so much better than a non slider.................Rod.

I picked up a3 31 last wednesday: used it saturday for the first time. It is awesome but it is shorter than my sawstop by a bit.

Felder has short infeed and outfeeds for the planer function as well as extentions for the jointer. I would suggest getting it home and figuring out what you need before you go buying them though. My 31 has a good amount of jointing length and the 41 has even more. space is at a premium in a 2 car garage. I have mobility with most of my machines so that I can move around when needed.