David Charlesworth's Plane Technique

Hi all. I am new to woodworking and have been watching David Charlesworth Lie Nielsen videos on precision planing. I think I want to adopt his technique for flattening boards, but I am confused on one point. In his videos he uses a Starrett 386-24 steel straight edge. This 24” straight edge works great in his video, but the board he is flattening is less than 24” long. So I figured he probably has longer straight edges he uses for longer boards. So I bought his books and he only recommends a 24” starrett 386 straight edge. So my question is how does he use his precision planing technique on boards longer than his straight edge? Anyone use his technique?

Thanks for any advice you can give!

I use it when I want precision and usually on boards I buy preplaned. The 24” straight edge I would think would work up to 48” boards easily. I’d want longer straight edges for longer boards but I’ve also found it easier to see out of squareness on bigger boards. I find his technique too fiddly for rough boards but a good place to finish up.

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Originally Posted by Brian Gambrell

Hi all. I am new to woodworking and have been watching David Charlesworth Lie Nielsen videos on precision planing. I think I want to adopt his technique for flattening boards, but I am confused on one point. In his videos he uses a Starrett 386-24 steel straight edge. This 24” straight edge works great in his video, but the board he is flattening is less than 24” long. So I figured he probably has longer straight edges he uses for longer boards. So I bought his books and he only recommends a 24” starrett 386 straight edge. So my question is how does he use his precision planing technique on boards longer than his straight edge? Anyone use his technique?

Thanks for any advice you can give!

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Howdy Brian, see you've been a member for a while but silent. Welcome to the Creek.

A string stretched between two points is going to be straight. In one of my posts a trick once posted by Stanley Covington was used. The idea is to make three blocks of wood to the same thickness. Take a shaving or two off of one of them to be the "test block". A string can be stretched over the other two at opposite ends of your work. Sliding the test block under the string will reveal any high or low points.

This book > https://lostartpress.com/products/eu...39679042355263

Does have some information about making your own straight edges.

Here is a post of mine making straight edges or winding sticks > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?290331

You won't see the images without becoming a contributor.

jtk

It is easiest to flatten a board using a straightedge that is as long as the board. Long straightedges we usually make from wood because long straightedges are quite expensive.

If you want to flatten a board with a shorter straightedge, you have to take multiple readings and deduce the contours of the board from these readings. This is often difficult for someone without much experience, so it can be frustrating. All in all it is probably a good idea to start with smaller boards.

We also use winding sticks on the surface of the board to measure twist. Winding sticks are usually made by the worker. They should be carefully made, but need not be at all fancy. Eighteenth Century cabinetmaker and mathematician Peter Nicholson gives a method for making winding sticks and straightedges in pairs in his book ​Mechanic's Companion.

I like black walnut or mahogany for winding sticks and straightedges; they are stable and nice to work with.

Years ago I made an 8’ straightedge from a piece of tempered Masonite . Just with one really accurate side . Other side is just square, so
no way to get them mixed up. Both sides are covered with white Formica ( the thick stuff ) glued with brown powdered ,mix with
water stuff. The business side edge is tapered down some. It took some time but is quite accurate. Price out an 8 foot straight edge !

Not being sure I've seen the second "better produced" video, don't think I have, but I've watched the first one quite a few times,
and it would be no surprise if it were merely half as good.

The first video titled Hand planing popped up online, before the whole copyright thing came into action,
though if you know Russian, and have an old computer or whatever, you'd likely be able to watch it.
I'm on a failing linux computer which could be riddled with spyware, not being sure if it were downloading that which jumbled up my keys,
or if it were a cup a tea to blame, lol.

Anyway, back to Charlesworth's hand planing video, which is still the best video on hand planing ever made, by a long shot, that is.

And/the answer to your question, couldn't find said bit to quote, but he mentioned for something four or five foot long, then think about making it a sheet of paper hollow.

There's lots to be gleaned from watching the video though, which isn't really mentioned, but instead demonstrated....but only for those who want to see.
So without knowing if you've been schooled, like you would have been with the first video, I'll have to give below the benefit of the doubt.
Presumably, you've been doing some stopped shavings, and practising hinging/pivoting with the straight edge.
Presumably, you've been made aware of there being no such thing as a straight edge, i.e it's purely theoretical, and we can only have plus or minus,
but you've understood the exercise in order to achieve David's definition of a straight edge,
Presumably, you've been made aware of Charlesworth's no compromises when it comes to a bump, i.e "I can do nothing with a bump"
whilst mentioning the square registering two completely differing positions, and more on topic, the mention of something flat sits on the bench.

If you look into things a bit more, then the teachings or lessons could be considered as such, in a sort of guaranteed basic methodology kinda way,
then it's up to yourself what you want to do with your bench.
Some of the suggestions mentioned and not...one could indeed take things up as continuation of the principals mentioned,
like for instance, the portion of the bench was flattened for the video, why?
There's no planing of long timbers filmed, though perhaps there was a demo for the audience.
Attachment 517410

I got a great head start by watching Charlesworth's video, whilst also another video from Cosman,
in which you can get basically the same show as the pre utube, (the insightful stuff, that is) but without the finish
i.e hinging on the bench instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGuGFGAQTxE

So if you make your mind up about that, then onto making two straight edges, in order to double the error, by pairing them.
(None of this is mentioned in the video BTW)
The three plate method in engineering, or some such phrase can come into play.
This pair of timbers are parallel in length, checked with a vernier calipers (without reading any numbers)
And you can step things up a notch by getting an angle poise lamp, and mounting it like Cosman also.
Attachment 517411

Just be sure, should you use up said timbers for something, that if planing up timbers thereafter, then don't go too far without planing up a second
matching timber, as there's preference regarding the work in how flat, or indeed what profile you might want your bench to have.
For instance, I like some crowning, though not over 1/64", probably half that throughout the length of the bench, for my work...
That being planing up similar components as to what you see above, since I reclaim mostly door components from tropical timbers,
this ensures that I don't nip off too much off the all important ends. (being as conservative as possible)
With such a crown, it does make something a lot stiffer pivot about, but it's rare that I'd be edge jointing that much,
like for instance edge joining 4" thick slabs for a workbench.

Attachment 517412
I've since gone all out and bought a level, which I checked and it turns out to be fairly good, tested with longer beams of suitable timber.
The angle poise lamp is not often mentioned, but makes things a lot easier compared to hinging or burnishing as per the Cosman vid.
Attachment 517413

Once you get to this stage worth noting, you might as well learn how the cap iron can be made work,
since if planing long lengths accurately, then you won't be wanting to turn the timber end for end,
so the three rules apply there.
This is the icing on the cake in regards to such use of the bench as a reference,
i.e not having to change direction around knots, and having a single planing stop at the end,
planing in rows as per Charlesworth, with no doe's feet necessary, nor vices which trap and bow the timber either,
but with a plane which won't tear out.
Such setup of a hand plane was unknown to all at the time, and still kinda is to most.
Took another David to make this widely known and proven, as nobody believed Warren above, for seemingly yonks I might add.
Folks likely thought he had it easy, or was just being a troll or whatever,
Not being sure if I can recall piccies, not to mention not being able to see behind the paywall, so can't suggest Warren's post,
but just noting most folks who mention/give the impression, that they have fully that down, don't.

So to complete this in a nicely packaged round up, I suggest you only look at Derek's posts after 2012, or the other David,
and learn not to break the three of those rules, as you'll fail otherwise. (there's plenty of money made, by not showing this)

I've pointed that out to a newcomer before, i.e the shaving influenced by the cap iron, straight shavings not curling up...
who promptly done all he could to "improve" things, and stopped the cap iron from working as it should.
It doesn't seem like he realised the value of that, i.e tearout elimination, with no excuses...yet.

The truth is in the shavings, and you won't find that by watching any of the gurus, even Charlesworth, who's made the best planing video there's ever been,
and mentioning this seems to upset most.
Funnily enough, the mention of the lack of knowledge of the cap, take Charlesworth for a real good example, folks get real offended about that...
yet speak of the methodology of what Charlesworth actually mentioned, and those same folks offended earlier have no problem attempting to find fault with near anything said.

So that might explain why said person chose to play it safe and improve things, as per the same as the 99% of folks in the dark, intentionally or otherwise.
even without any suggestion of being offended whatsoever, it's very clear to see.

I think that will do ya, learn what those three rules are if you wish to progress,
and don't even think about making improvements to the plane, until those three rules are understood,
That being...
no.1: No tight mouths,
no.2: At least 50 degrees on the cap edge to straighten the shaving,
and no.3: No rounded corners or cambers which disable the cap iron from getting close enough to the edge, for your panel and also smoother,
i.e not set beyond 1/32" & 1/64" respectively.

All too technical and so on most will say, but then again were talking about Charlesworth level precision here,
with Charlesworth level explanation and demonstrations, what's head and shoulders above the rest, (all of the rest having bad habits)
combined with the fact he was the most honest cabinetmaker ever filmed, so it can be all learned in a day or so.

All the best
Tom

Most of the parts requiring very high precision are fairly small and a 24" straightedge will cover them. But you can check a 3' or 4' board with the 24" straightedge by checking it at multiple places. With experience you can get pretty accurate, the trick is knowing what the small errors mean and how to correct them.

If you are just trying to learn how to plane, then work on shorter and smaller boards. 18 to 24" is good to start with. The difficulty and time required increase in a non-linear way as you get longer/wider.

Just to add another thought about levels of precision - how straight does the piece longer than 24” need to be? If you are jointing two pieces to glue them together, check them against each other. If it is the edge of a table or dresser, and it looks straight, then it is straight enough.

Glue joints are the only situation I can think of where a really long straight edge needs to be more precise than you can judge by sighting down the piece. If you don’t trust your eye you can lay out a piece of paper, trace the edge, then flip it over and re-trace it. This will double any error. You can also use this technique to make your own straight edge if you decide a long one is helpful.

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Originally Posted by Brian Gambrell

Hi all. I am new to woodworking and have been watching David Charlesworth Lie Nielsen videos on precision planing. I think I want to adopt his technique for flattening boards, but I am confused on one point. In his videos he uses a Starrett 386-24 steel straight edge. This 24” straight edge works great in his video, but the board he is flattening is less than 24” long. So I figured he probably has longer straight edges he uses for longer boards. So I bought his books and he only recommends a 24” starrett 386 straight edge. So my question is how does he use his precision planing technique on boards longer than his straight edge? Anyone use his technique?

Thanks for any advice you can give!

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That bar is a calibrated reference edge, accurate to ±0.0002" per ft. It's certainly overkill for woodworking, but it's not insanely expensive and it has other uses in the shop, when lapping plane soles, for example.

Anything longer and the weight, size and price increase significantly. Also, juggling a large straight edge on a workbench and the risk of dropping it or just stabbing your work with it makes them not ideal for this kind of work. A straight edge made of wood is probably a more sensible route.

Is a reason given in the video or book as to why a 24" straight edge is enough?

What kind of precision planing? for joints or surfaces or both? When joining two edges some precision is needed. When flattening a board, precision is also needed but not to the same degree as with an edge meant for joining.

The bar in the middle is the 24" one, imagine handling the larger ones.
Attachment 517475

Thanks everyone for the information. I always learn a great deal from the posts on this site.

@Tony Wilkins – Thanks for the input

@Jim Koepke – Yeah, I joined several years ago, but having limited space caused me to postpone my interest in woodworking. I recently moved into a home where I now have room, so I am re-pursuing my interest. I will definitely pick up the book you recommend. I really enjoy Lost Art Press and have about a dozen of their books so far (including By Hand & Eye). I also became a contributor, so I can now see images. Thanks for the advice.

@Warren Mickley – Thanks for the advice. I’ll pick up that Lost Art Press book as well. Looks like a good one.

@Mel Fulks – Interesting! Seems like a good option.

@Tom Trees – Thanks for your insightful post! You have given me a lot to think about. I have watched David Charlesworth’s other video on planning you mentioned as well as his video on sharpening. Working on reading his out of print books now. I’ll check out the Cosman video you recommend. Thanks again!

@Robert Hazelwood – Thanks for the advice. I’ll do that. I just ordered a 24” Starrett straight edge.
@Ben Ellenberger – Thanks for the insight. I am very curious on the paper trick you mention. I’m not sure I follow. How does that work?

@Rafael Herrera – You make a great point. I think I will just order the 24”. Thanks for the insight.

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@Ben Ellenberger – Thanks for the insight. I am very curious on the paper trick you mention. I’m not sure I follow. How does that work?

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There are a few ways to do this. One easy way is with a long piece of paper. Lay it out on a flat surface with a pin at either end. Hold the straight edge under test to one side of the pins. Draw a line along the edge of the straight edge with a sharp pencil. Flip the straight edge over to the other side of the pins. Draw a second line along the edge. The two lines should be parallel, a pin thickness apart. Inward or outward bumps are twice the error of the straight edge.

jtk

I reckon its worth finding that said video, I checked and it's still there,
(for those with more computer knowledge about these things, regarding torrent sites, and trackers, which I'm clueless about)
Just to be clear on things, I've mentioned specifically that very Cosman video,
(as none of Rob's other videos demonstrate the same use of the bench, unless you wish to seek the stuff not on Youtube)

So if you do watch it, then you'll note the bad habits, which you won't see from Charlesworth's videos.
i.e Charlesworth had much emphasis on the importance of the perimeter of the work, hence planing in rows
and certainly not wiping out the all important registering area of the edge...
and that's regardless of whether one uses the bench for reference, or indeed using winding sticks.

Screenshot of the bad practice @12:35 of said video, so you'll have to ignore that bit,
and take note of the hinging/pivoting, pressing on the corners, burnishing of the high spots instead...
whilst you'll also have to take into account the lack of the angle poise lamp,
(an easily movable one like the one Rob uses on his Scandinavian bench)
which makes things much easier.
And also worth noting a batten for a planing stop is a must have, rather than a bench dog, if one is deciding to give that method a try.
Attachment 517496

All the best
Tom