New Year, new workbench -- mucho pics!

[Wilbur Pan]

Hi Jacob,

I'm using Douglas fir for probably the same reason you're considering: the borgs around here don't carry SYP 2x construction material. All the 2x material here in NJ is douglas fir. Actually, there is pressure treated SYP available around here, but I didn't want to deal with that stuff.

I think that SYP has been elevated as a workbench material for the wrong reasons. Chris Schwarz seems to like it for the following reasons:

1. It's cheap, and available where he lives.
2. It's stiff.
3. It's pretty dense.
4. It's cheap, and available where he lives.

He has an interesting take on the use of beech in traditional European benches. Beech is stiff (not as stiff as SYP or Douglas fir), dense, and cheap -- in Europe. It's expensive here, and hard to get, so for those reasons it's not a good workbench wood on this continent. Maple is stiff and dense, but it's expensive, so SYP wins out here. (Actually, maple is slightly less stiff and less dense as SYP, much to my surprise.)

As far as stiffness goes, Douglas fir is a hair stiffer than SYP. It's not quite as dense, but there are other ways to make sure your bench doesn't move besides mass. But most importantly, around here it's cheap, and available.

[Charles Bodner]

Wilbur
I was planning to build a Roubo-esque bench from HD 4x4 Doug Fir since they had it and price was reasonable. (I have been using a trestle arrangement of 2 4x4 DF glued together braced against the basement wall. In one direction it does not move at all.) I would use a 4x4 for easch leg. I was planning a leg vise. Any downside to just adding a couple of 2x4 DF to the leg vise leg as a lamination or just using 2 4x4 for that leg so it is wide enough for the leg vise?

[Bill Stoffels]

Nice job on the bench , I should have loaned you my LN #8 plane that would he helped you square her up a little quicker
Great job
Bill

[Wilbur Pan]

Any downside to just adding a couple of 2x4 DF to the leg vise leg as a lamination or just using 2 4x4 for that leg so it is wide enough for the leg vise?

Hi Charles,

If you are talking about taking the 4x4, which is going to be about 3-1/4" square after jointing and planing, and adding 2x4s to the side so that you have a leg about 5" wide and 3-1/4" deep, probably not.

My issue is that I wanted 5" square legs, and there was no good way to attach wood to the 4x4's I had originally planned on using to make a 5" square leg.

[Charles Bodner]

Wilbur- I was planning a Roubo-esque bench out of Doug Fir 4x4. For the leg vise leg I was thinking of just doubling the 4x4 on that leg, or adding 2x4 on each side, to make the width. Do you see a downside I do not see? Other than the loss of symmetry? Your way looks better, tand certainly far more stout, and the added weight is a plus, but I don't know that I want to spend that much more time and material.

[Wilbur Pan]

Your way looks better, and certainly far more stout, and the added weight is a plus, but I don't know that I want to spend that much more time and material.

Hi Charles,

FWIW, I had originally planned on using 4x4's for the legs on my bench, until I realized that doing so would give me a thinner clamping surface for the leg vise. I thought about gluing up wood around the 4x4 to build it up to a 5" square leg, which structurally would not have been good over the long haul. (I should point out that your glue up plan to make a 5" x 3 1/2" leg doesn't have this issue.) Then a friend of mine sent me an email pointing out some things I thought were really useful:

You're already saving an enormous amount of money by building (instead of buying) the bench....What is it, about 12' of wood - $24? I promise you, you will make mistakes much more costly that that as a woodworker. It's inevitable.

He also pointed out that since this is a workbench we're talking about, I would be using it every day I'm in the shop, and that I would always look at the legs and wonder if I had cut a corner in making it.

The next day I went back to the borg to get two 8 foot 2x12's, which is enough wood to make four 5" square legs.

As far as added time and material go in making up my 5" square legs, the additional cost of the 2x12's I purchased was less than $30. I really don't think that there was any additional time spent in milling and gluing up these 2x12's. With your plan, I still would have had to joint and plane the 4x4 and 2x4's and clamp and glue them.

The only real downside that I can see with making a 5" x 3-1/2" leg is that if you are going to join the legs to the top with M/T joints, you'll have to make adjustments to your plan, and you'll wind up with a "thinner" M/T joint. This might not make any difference structurally, since there are plenty of other workbenches out there with smaller legs. I do have the feeling, however, that if the guys making Roubo benches back in the day could have gotten away with smaller legs, they would have done so.

The only other question is whether you think there's a chance you'll be looking at the legs of your workbench a year from now wondering if you should have spent the extra $30. If so, I'd make the bigger legs. At that point in the future, you will have spent an extra $2.50 a month for those legs, and you'll probably be using your workbench for a lot longer than that. If you think you're going to be happy with your plan, then that's fine, too.

[John Keeton]

Wilbur, this bench is really coming along. I have checked in from time to time, and appreciate the pictorial.

One question - what are you doing up at 3 am????? Are you on shift work? Or, just get excited about your bench project and need to be working on it

[Wilbur Pan]

Hi John,

I wish I was working in the shop at that hour.

I was on call last night, and was waiting for the ER to call me about one of our patients that I sent there. There's nothing like looking at woodworking forums to pass the time while waiting for a phone call.

[matt braun]

Wilbur, this bench is really coming along. I have checked in from time to time, and appreciate the pictorial.

One question - what are you doing up at 3 am????? Are you on shift work? Or, just get excited about your bench project and need to be working on it

John,
As a fellow central-Kentuckian, I have some questions for you. What type of wood do we generally find at Home Depot and Lowes in this part of the country (Douglas Fir or pine, what type of pine)? I can't find untreated 4x4's at Home Depot. Are they there somewhere? (I'll be checking Lowes eventually, but haven't yet.)

I don't completely know forum protocal yet. If it would be more appropriate for me to ask these questions in a private message, let me know so there's not a next time.

[John Keeton]

Matt, a PM probably would work better in this case as this thread is not current, and the person to whom the question is posed (me) may not revisit the thread. Were it an active thread, then the chances would be better. Since I had viewed this thread previously, it did catch my eye.

If you are doing a bench, then buy southern yellow pine at the borg. Most framing wood beyond a 2x6 is available in SYP. The other stuff we have is usually spruce or white pine - neither of which I would use on a bench as it is too soft.

As to the 4x4, I doubt you will find anything that is not PT, but then, if I were doing a bench, I would get the 2x material and turn it edge up. That is what I did on mine. Take 2x8s, rip in half to get you a bit over 3.5 inches. After flattening, you should end up with 3.5 finished.

[Wilbur Pan]

To say that this thread isn't current is quite the understatement.

10 months later, I finally got around to finishing the joinery for one pair of legs. I had cut the mortises before, but I finally cut the tenons and drilled holes for drawboring.



I'm going to use double mortise/tenons to attach the top to the legs. Here you can see the hole for the leg vise screw to pass through. In the previous picture you can see the slot for the parallel guide at the bottom of the leg.



I'm sure I'm going to lose major hand tool cred points here, but the holes for the leg vise screw and the drawboring were drilled using a combination of a drill press, cordless drill, a 3/8" brad point bit, and a hole saw. Why? Because overall I kind of suck at precision drilling.

A picture of the dry fit. The side that I'm working on will actually be the underside of the workbench top.



Not much exposition here, as Chris Schwarz already has written all you need to know about drawboring.

It's amazing how much you can do if you have a long weekend when (1) you're not on call, and (b) said weekend does not involve eating large amounts of turkey or Santa bringing presents for the kids, in which case you also have to deal with visiting relatives.

[harry strasil]

Well, it took me 9 years from the time the log was cut till the bench was done, took delivery of the dried timbers on Feb 9 last year, did the final vise on Sep 1. 09.

It was worth the wait!

After all Noah didn't build the Ark in a day.

All good things are worth the time to do it right!

[Al Navas]

Wilbur,
Great job! This will be a wonderful bench!!! Do they allow the use of chisels/hammer/mallet in between patients? Or maybe the noise is too much, right? There is a thought...


Jr,

Glad to spot you here - I am looking forward to your traveling shop during the Kansas City Woodworking Show!!! My video camera is getting itchy, for sure.


Al

[Gary McNair]

Very nice - I enjoy working with kiln dried Doug Fir although it has a tendency to splinter easily - what glue are you using?

[David Gendron]

Wilbur, have you tought of starting a thread about japanese tool use? it look like you use them a lot and know how to use them, it would be fun to have a little "show. on what they are and how to use the different saws and planes!
Your bench will be a great one!