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Thread: Woodworkers Journal Scam . . .?

  1. #1
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    Thumbs down Woodworkers Journal Scam . . .?

    Has anybody else received unsolicited, the first of a series called The Complete Woodworking Video Collection?

    This is the way it works, they send it and tell you IF YOU DO NOT WANT IT, just return it . . . .or discard it . . . I discarded it . .

    Well I don't want it and I don't think I should be responsible to get it back to them.

    Now for the best part, they send a dunning letter every month they call a reminder telling you to send money or send it back. Well the first letter that came with the DVD said either send it back or discard it . . . Well I looked at it, it was what I did not feel was worthwhile info, so I threw it away as they said I could. Now I am being inundated with reminders . . . .

    Time Warner has some really good CD's with the oldies, and this is exactly why I won't buy them . . . They never stop sending crap to you . . .

    I guess that is my punishment for being stupid enough to subscribe to WOODWORKERS JOURNAL MAGAZINE . . . . I like the magazine, but their business office sucks big time . . . I probably will not renew . . . I'm paid up through 2010, but I get a letter telling me I need to renew at least once a month . . .
    Last edited by Steven DeMars; 02-09-2009 at 9:10 AM.
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven DeMars View Post
    Has anybody else received unsolicited, the first of a series called The Complete Woodworking Video Collection?

    This is the way it works, they send it and tell you IF YOU DO NOT WANT IT, just return it . . . .or discard it . . . I discarded it . . . . . .
    If it was unsolicited you definitely don't have to pay for it, you don't have to return it and you don't have to throw it away.

  3. #3
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    I got that DVD in the mail yesterday. My current plan is to mail it back to them in their prepaid envelope. I don't play that game.

    I suppose I could just keep it, but I really do not need any more DVDs of any stripe.

    Doc
    If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate. ~Anonymous.

  4. #4
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    I have not received any literature or video tape on the Woodworking Video Collection.
    When I receive unsolicited items, then get a bill for it, I write back and inform them that I didn't order the item, didn't want the item and I do not want them to bill me again or I will contact my attorney. I never hear from them again.
    When dealing with Time Life items, I send them back unopened. Do that a few times and they get the message when they have to pay the postage.
    David B

  5. #5
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    I sent mine back in the pre-paid envelope they sent......

    ....I documented the return with pics! (I may still have the original letter here some place too!.....)
    I underlined "Please send no further DVDs" on the return card.

    I haven't got anything from them since - I returned the DVD on 01/01/09
    DVDpic.jpg
    Last edited by Mike Langford; 02-08-2009 at 11:49 PM.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven DeMars View Post
    Has anybody else received unsolicited, the first of a series called The Complete Woodworking Video Collection?... .
    Unless there has been some change over the last several years, anything you receive in the mail, unsolicited, belongs to you. I suppose the "honorable" thing to do would be to return it if they provide prepaid return packaging, but there's no requirement to do so. It's an unnecessary inconvenience and imposition that you do not have to accept.

    What to do about the dunning letters? You could fast track them to the land fill, you could sit down and write the company a reasonable and courteous response detailing your position on the situation which would likely be ignored by the office drones, or you could do what I've been known to do in similar circumstances: when you find one in the mailbox, write "Delivery refused, return to sender" on the envelope and drop it back in the mailbox unopened. Don't know what effect that has back in the office, but I've never had another one show up after doing that.
    Tom Veatch
    Wichita, KS
    USA

  7. #7
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    See post number 13 by Lee Schierer - McKean, PA in this thread:

    http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=93737

    If you do nothing, you may or may not get more junk from them. If you respond (returning dvd), they may sell your name as someone who responds. But his solution is classic.

  8. #8
    I got one of those a few months ago, from WWGOA. It said I could keep it as a free gift, so I did. I got a follow up letter last week. I'd hardly call it dunning, since it was pretty clear that I was under no obligation. They are just marketing their product with a free sample and a followup. Even though it was not requested, it was pretty good, so I don't see any harm.

    George Vondriska, the guy in the video, has written numerous articles for the magazines and has become a fairly well known figure in woodworking. I believe WWGOA is pretty much his brainchild. I seriously doubt he intends to scam anybody and tarnish his reputation. WWGOA does seem like a shoestring startup though, and I'm pretty sure the video I received is the only one produced so far. I'm sure he's trying to use the first video to raise capital for producing further videos.

    I hope it works. I think if he's smart he'll drop that overly agressive "book of the month club" strategy. If the videos are good people will seek them out and buy them. I know I will. As for the free gift, I think they give people a chance to return it since some will be too paranoid or suspicious to keep it or throw it away. I'm sure it goes straight into the trash once they get it back, or into another mailer.

  9. #9
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    Smile I agree . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Keehn View Post
    I got one of those a few months ago, from WWGOA. It said I could keep it as a free gift, so I did. I got a follow up letter last week. I'd hardly call it dunning, since it was pretty clear that I was under no obligation. They are just marketing their product with a free sample and a followup. Even though it was not requested, it was pretty good, so I don't see any harm.

    George Vondriska, the guy in the video, has written numerous articles for the magazines and has become a fairly well known figure in woodworking. I believe WWGOA is pretty much his brainchild. I seriously doubt he intends to scam anybody and tarnish his reputation. WWGOA does seem like a shoestring startup though, and I'm pretty sure the video I received is the only one produced so far. I'm sure he's trying to use the first video to raise capital for producing further videos.

    I hope it works. I think if he's smart he'll drop that overly agressive "book of the month club" strategy. If the videos are good people will seek them out and buy them. I know I will. As for the free gift, I think they give people a chance to return it since some will be too paranoid or suspicious to keep it or throw it away. I'm sure it goes straight into the trash once they get it back, or into another mailer.
    I think it's the "Book of the Month Club" thing that irritated me . . . I actually like the magazine . . .

    P.S. Please move this thread out of here . . . .
    Support the "CREEK" . . .

  10. #10
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    You are probably writing those letters to a computer. No obligation to pay for any stuff you didn't ask for. Time Warner is not a group I want anything to do with,or ANY book of the month outfit. They will hound you to death.
    Last edited by Glenn Clabo; 02-09-2009 at 12:56 PM.

  11. #11
    I kept the DVD, watched it, and then threw it in the trash. It was mainly introductory material, would be great for someone just starting out, but probably 95% of this forum would not learn anything new.

    I didn't send it back, because I don't want to encourage this type of marketing. Also, I don't want them to know that they have a "live" person at this address. As someone else said, if you respond or acknowledge this in any way, you are opening yourself up to more spam. There is a loophole in the no call list that says if you do business with someone, they can telemarket you. Therefore, I'm not giving them any kind of excuse. I don't know if that is their aim or not, but I feel it is best to just ignore this.

    As far as being honorable, they are the ones that spammed thousands of people with a DVD they didn't ask for in hopes of collecting a few bucks. If you return the DVD, it's going to be mailed to someone else that didn't ask for it.

  12. #12
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    If you really want to discourage this sort of behavior, take the business reply mailer, and stuff it with anything you can find that's heavy. The business involved has to pay for the "business reply" mailing based on its weight.

    I can't find the site now, but one individual got so fed up with MCI sending things like this that he shipped them an old tire - that was what it took to get him off of the mailing list.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randal Stevenson View Post
    See post number 13 by Lee Schierer - McKean, PA in this thread:

    http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=93737

    If you do nothing, you may or may not get more junk from them. If you respond (returning dvd), they may sell your name as someone who responds. But his solution is classic.
    Here is the link Lee and David above referred to. Very funny: http://www.vertical-visions.com/_tem...id/index2.html
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  14. #14
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    I was going to say, fill that envelope with AOL cd's.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Padilla View Post
    Here is the link Lee and David above referred to. Very funny: http://www.vertical-visions.com/_tem...id/index2.html
    Just to clarify, I have used this method only to the extent that I sent all the literature, envelope etc back to the company via their postage paid envelope. It gets your name off their mailing list pretty quickly. I don't advocate sending bricks or old tires to companies. They'll get the point with just their envelope full of stuff. Or write "REFUSED" in big letters across the mailing adress and drop it in a mail box, that way you don't even have to open it.
    Lee Schierer - McKean, PA

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