Raised panel jewelry box

[Paul Hathaway]

Hi. I am kind of new to this site but it appears to be the right one for me. I made a new jewelry box and would like some input as to the dimensioning I used. This box features a raised panel lid. It is made from padauk with birdseye maple to add contrast. The total dimensions are 12 1/2"w x 8 1/4"d x 5"h overall. After I built it, and the more I stare at it, I feel as if the lid is too "heavy" feeling compared to the base. Now I built this to showcase the lid(which worked) but now I feel it is out-of-proportion to the base. Any opinions to the look and feel of this box would be appreciated. My wife, mother, sister, etc. like it just the way it is. Maybe I'm being too picky? After I refine this first one I plan to sell a few of them at my local arts/crafts shows(when I feel it's good enough). I apologize in advance for my poor photography. Thanks for any and all comments!

Paul

P.S. The camera seemed to "bend" the box. The box is straight and square.

[Robert Canning]

I think its beautiful. If you want to you could add an auxillary base under the present one to beef it up and ground it. it's as easy as adding a trim style frame under the base. Some feet may do it as well I didn't build this one just random internet pic

[Craig T. Smith]

Paul, I likethe fit and finish of the box. However as Robert said maybe feet would pep it up some. As for the lid , it looks OK to me. But if the panel was thick enough you could carve some of the underside out. I've seen this before and I think it would lighten it up some. Just some thoughts. By the way Welcome to the Creek You'll like it here, Craig

[John Keeton]

Paul, I don't do boxes, so take all this with a grain of salt! Overall, I think the box works. Some suggestions would include mitered corners on the lid. With what you have, the wood movement will eventually give you a proud edge or recessed edge as the humidity and wood change. I would do a little "longer" profile on the edge of the lid that would thin the edge down a bit and lead up to the raised panel (table edge profile?). And, I do think some sort of leg would help in conjunction with a little softer profile on the bottom. Actually, I think the bottom is too "light" for the top, and even another layer added to the bottom to extend it a little and give more mass may help.

But, as I said, the box works, and you certainly did a nice job on it. The maple and padauk work well together.

Oh yeah - WELCOME!

[Paul Hathaway]

I too was thinking of another base. Either that or brass feet, although the 1/2" dia. brass ball feet probably won't add enough "weight". Thanks for the compliments by the way. This is exactly the kind of constructive criticism I was hoping for. I like this forum already!

[Jim Kountz]

Given your dimensions and looking down on the top your proportions are really close the the "Golden Rectangle" which is good. I personally like the box alot. I think it has a good stance and the wood speaks for itself. If it were mine Id start filling it with keepsakes and move on to the next project.
Well done!!

[David Keller NC]

"With what you have, the wood movement will eventually give you a proud edge or recessed edge as the humidity and wood change."

Paul - Depending on how you constructed the lid, you may or may not encounter this issue that John describes. If the joint is a mortise and tenon, the small width of the rails makes it unlikely that you'll wind up with the edge of one of them proud of the end-grain of the stile.

However, it is most common to make a mitered joint in the lids of this type of box for stylistic reasons - mainly so that one does not see end-grain.

Overall, it's a nice box, but I do feel you're right that the base is a bit thin. I would also suggest using a thinner kerf for your miter splines - it will make the box look more "delicate".

If you're going to do a lot of these, it might well be worth your $$ to buy a few of the box-making books (they're are at least 4 or 5 by Fox Chapel and Taunton in print). Not necessarily to copy one of the designs, but I always find it helpful to look at someone else's stuff to get ideas.

Nice box!

[Paul Hathaway]

Thanks for the reply David. Believe it or not I've read about a 1/2 dozen books on boxes. I've made 5 prior to this. This is the first one of this large style. I will probably stick with 1/8" kerfs next time, however I feel that these 1/4" ones actually work to some degree. I'm currently making some legs for this one. When I'm done this one stays with me for my watches. The next one will have a meatier base for balance. John also mentioned about the mitered lid. I'll probably experiment with that-good idea. The current lid was made using 1/2" cabinet making bits with undercutter, roman ogee style. Jim, if memory serves correctly I used the "golden rectangle" math and morphed it a bit to call it my own, due to it's size. If my legs don't work out I'm leaving it as-is to enjoy using. My next one will incorporate my changes and I'll be sure to post pictures for all to see. Thanks to everyone who took the time to offer up advice-much appreciated!

[Paul Hathaway]

O.K. here I go again. I have some photos of a carcass mock-up that I did in pine today. I milled some larger lower trim to balance the box. I think it worked. The lid overhangs the carcass by 3/8", and the lower trim stands proud of the carcass by 1/2". The trim is 3/4" h, the lid is 1/2" thick. I put a chamfer on the trim to make it look heavier than the top of the box. Also the overall height is 1/2" shorter than my other box. Please view the pictures and let me know if my balance issue has been addressed. The one picture is blurry but the scale is shown. Again, any and all opinions would be appreciated. Thanks!

[John Keeton]

Paul, I think David is right on the issue of the proud edge on the top. I didn't realize you used a cope and stick joint. That should be OK, but I still like the miters better for style.

The mock up base appears (to my eye) to be more angular, but the top has more curvature in the profile. Does that make sense?

What I envisioned was kind of a double layer bottom with a couple of profiles together, to provide a more detailed edge. I think the overall thickness of each is probably OK.

Just my thoughts - but then, I don't build boxes either!!

[Paul Hathaway]

[QUOTE=J

The mock up base appears (to my eye) to be more angular, but the top has more curvature in the profile. Does that make sense?
![/QUOTE]
Hi John. For the top I used a 3/8" cove bit, shaved off the edge underneath with a 1/4" roundover bit. I was never happy with that but, once you cut it-you own it! The bottom moulding was milled in 10 minutes just so I could get the "feel" for the size. On the next piece I'll try to match the top and bottom profile better to get something a bit more aesthetically pleasing-I'll have to experiment. And yes, David is right about the proud edge on top. That was done 3-4 yrs. ago-I finished the glue-up and ah-oops-the bottom was recessed and the top was proud! I decided to finish this box rather than pitch it in the trash. All that work. Now I'm simply ironing out the kinks and applying this knowledge to my other boxes. Thanks to you and the others who offer their help!

[sean m. titmas]

very nice work Paul. your box certainly has some character to it that makes it unique. however i think you will agree with me that it needs to be refined a time or two before it is ready to be considered "finished".

whenever i look at a piece to judge the level of quality that was put into it i always start by trying to find the standard dimensions that were used in the piece, in this case, the box. the higher the level of quality than the fewer standard sizes you will see. by standard sizes i mean, for example, a board thickness of 3/4".

by way of comparison take a look at the box that Robert posted and tell me if you can see any standard size lumber? there are none. now look for the same pieces on your box. i can see one obvious piece that is very standard looking. it is the frame on the lid. it looks just like a 1x2 stick of lumber.

if you can find a way to refine the frame to make it blend in with the panel more than it will have a seamless finished look just like the keyed miters joints on the box.

[David Keller NC]

Paul - I do make a fair number of boxes, and have made a number of ones similar to your design. To my eye, you've got about the right balance between base and top.

A couple of ideas - if you miter the top, I highly suggest reinforcing the miter with kerfed keys as you did the main body of the box. I learned this the hard way - miters don't have much strength, especially in the lid.

One other thought is that you might try a box with an integral, sawn-off captured panel lid. These lend themselves to the mitered construction really well, and as long as you're careful about bandsawing/handsawing off the top, the lid's guaranteed to fit and have a nice grain match.

[Paul Hathaway]

Quote: if you can find a way to refine the frame to make it blend in with the panel more than it will have a seamless finished look just like the keyed miters joints on the box.

Sean are you suggesting perhaps a different profile on the edge, or a different style lid frame altogether? Several people suggested a mitered frame. Perhaps that's a more pleasing look altogether? David, I've built several boxes with integrated lids. Very simple to make, however, I happen to like the complexity of this design a bit more. Thanks for responding to the balance issue-very challenging to me. I never would have thought box-making could be so involved until I built that first one. Now I appreciate the craftsmanship of all the nice woodworking that I see all the more. Especially when I know someone built it from scratch-not mass-produced from an overseas factory...

[sean m. titmas]

Quote: if you can find a way to refine the frame to make it blend in with the panel more than it will have a seamless finished look just like the keyed miters joints on the box.

Sean are you suggesting perhaps a different profile on the edge, or a different style lid frame altogether? Several people suggested a mitered frame. Perhaps that's a more pleasing look altogether?

yes, a different style of lid altogether will make the lid more refined and that will match the refined look of the rest of the box with the flush cut keys. the look of a frame and panel is more rustic whereas the flush miter keys have a sophisticated look. its not that the frame/panel look is wrong but it is competing with the keys to be the dominate style. pick one style, rustic or sophisticated, and than make all your details follow that style.

perhaps a lid that was completely smooth across the top with no raised panel profile and no profile on the inside of the frame will keep in line with the look for this box. at the point where the two different species of wood meet you could experiment with a few strips of alternating wood species or an inlay to act as a visual break between the lighter frame and the darker center panel. mitered cuts are a good idea too.

avoid the common edge profiles that are easily identifiable. an ogee and a bead & cove are easy to spot and identify but a custom profile that you make from a combination of two bits or a couple of passes with the same bit will create a profile that is unique to this box. since there is only a limited amount of edge to put a profile on it comes under much more scrutiny and is very easy to pick apart because so much time is spent looking at it. you can afford to put as much time and effort into the edge profile as you did for the rest of the entire box.

this is just the starting point. you can take this box much further along by refining a few more details and giving it a personality. here is a little bit of insight to how i go about designing a piece. befor i get started i come up with a theme for the project. it can be anything but no matter what you choose for the theme spend about 30 minutes thinking and developing this theme so that you have a strong mental picture of what this piece means to you. after that choose a picture/s that represents that theme and tack it to the wall next to your workbench so that it can guide your decisions as you work on the project. it may sound corny or a waste of time but i guarantee you that a project that was designed and built with a theme in mind will have a much stronger presence and unity of design as opposed to a piece that is full of internal conflict and competing design elements.

keep us posted of the changes you make.