That's some serious iron!
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That's some serious iron!
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"It's paradoxical that the idea of living a long life appeals to everyone, but the idea of getting old doesn't appeal to anyone."
Andy Rooney
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John,
You seem to be a few months ahead of me in the neander world. I just got my dovetail chisels and saw today, and I am already planning learning to cut M&T by hand next. Are you getting a tenon saw?
I am looking forward to reading your review of the new chisels.
Contributor
We, and I am sure many others, appreciate the clothes donations. We usually buy my shirts at the second hand stores. I tend to wear them until my wife thinks I'm not looking and tosses them or I turn them into rags. Even when I was making good money I seldom bought new shirts.Originally Posted by John Keeton
It is a hard decision for me to sell tools. I have a drawer full of chisels that are not all that good, but they do get used a lot when I want to spare the "good" stuff. The planes are stating to pile up beyond what is needed. It will likely be a while before being able to kick myself into selling them. Oh well, they will always be there if the money is needed.
I think there is a pack rat gene. My father surely had it, my wife and her folks have it. Our son seems to also be a victim.
jim
Contributor
For those of you who might want a pigsticker at a bit lower price, you can find them on eBay. I have a whole set of them, of different manufacturers. You can get them cheaper if they need a handle, and the handles are very easy to make.
Here's a 1/2" in good shape - 160341551856. And a 3/8" - 400055454308. And a 1/4" - 280358737088.
Mike
Last edited by Mike Henderson; 06-16-2009 at 1:41 AM.
Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.
Member
After about three years of accumulating hand tools, I still have not sold or even given away a single one. I'm just now getting to the point where I can see a nice tool for sale and be happy for someone else to have it.
“I don’t have a lot of tools because it doesn’t take many to make furniture.” - Rob Millard
[OP]
Contributor
Jacob, I am still a confirmed hybrid woodworker. Other than the Cosman dovetail saw, I don't seem to be drawn to the saws. I will probably make do with what I have unless necessity requires me to do something else.
Even though I have done some woodworking my entire life, it is only in the last couple of years that I have begun to acquire nicer tools. I blame SMC for my tool revival!!
As I approach retirement I decided to equip my shop so that I would not have significant additional expense when my income is limited. With that in mind, I have replaced nearly every major tool in my shop, and have made a concentrated effort to increase my skill level. In doing so, many of the tools are completely new to me - dovetail tools, for instance.
That said, I am also a minimalist. While I like good tools, and will not hesitate to buy them, I really want only those tools in my shop that I will use. I am also somewhat obsessive about efficiency - not sure how I reconcile that with handcut dovetails, and handplanes
In contrast to Jim's comments about chisels, for as long as I can remember, I used about 4 old chisels to do everything - and I mean everything. They were abused beyond belief. I threw them out (they were true junk) and bought a set of Narex that I will use for rough work. At $22, they were superior to any chisels I ever had! But, I also acquired a set of Pfeils to used to chop out dovetails, and the BS for paring.
So, for me, it isn't so much a conversion to neander, but a "filling out" of my skill set - or at least an attempt to do so. I still dream of some tailed tools, as well, and most use the "F" word in the titleI know that is sacrilege in this forum, and I apologize.
Jim, my occupation requires me to wear dress clothes, but my true wardrobe consists of 2 pair of "good" Wranglers that I save for going to town when my wife is with me so as to not embarass her, 4 pair of "really good" Wranglers that are worn out and feel great, and several henley t-shirts - short sleeve for summer, long for winter. Were it not for the necessity of going to the office, I would not have need for much else except camo for the woods! Even though I have worn a tie much of my life, I have sworn to haunt my family if they bury me in one!
Contributor
I hope RI offers a 1/8" chisel in the near future. I wonder if we got together as a group if JOEL would have RI make a special run.
Anyone else interested?
Eric
Contributor
I have an old 1/8" pigsticker but I find that any 1/8" chisel works about as well. When you're making really small mortises, the "height" of the chisel becomes important, as well as the width. If the maker made the height large to add strength, the chisel may be too big to do the work you want to do.
I have a 1/8" LN chisel which works well but I think almost any will do. You want the chisel to be short, not paring length.
To really use a 1/8" pigsticker, you'd need to be cutting a thin, but very long, mortise. I suppose those exist, but I've not needed any.
Mike
[Added note: Here's some pictures of my 1/8" Ward pigsticker. First picture is the pigsticker. Second pix shows the width - just a bit over 1/8" and the third pix shows the height - almost 1/2" at the cutting end.]
Last edited by Mike Henderson; 06-16-2009 at 12:04 PM.
Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.
Member
John - I think you'll find that this is a superior tool that's well worth the price. I've a set of them, and have also had sets of antiques. In my hands, the Ray Ilses edges are far tougher - important when one is whacking on them with a 20 oz. mallet. The big hanlde size is also an advatage, in my opinion. It gives you a larger target for the mallet - which saves raising blood blisters on your hand from errant mallet whacks.Just received the 3/8" Ray Isles pig sticker from TFWW - ordered the combo with the 1/4", but it is on backorder.
I do have relatively small hands, but MY GOSH this is one hunk of tool! I have never attempted hand chopped M&T before, but want to see if I can add that to my skill list. From all the research I could do here on the creek, these should do the trick.
Now I just need one of you guys to come help me steady this sucker.... I reckon if I can just lift it up and let drop, the weight will sink it
A comment about flattening and polishing the backs. IMO, this is well worth the effort. The D2 steel is tough enough to stand up to heavy impact use with a narrow bevel angle. In combination with a polished and flattened back and bevel, these suckers are so sharp that they'll sink a good 3/8" into woods like mahogany, walnut, and cherry with even a moderate mallet whack. In my case, I had no issues starting with a coarse diamond plate and then progressing through 1000, 4000, and 8000 grit japanese water stones - they seemed to flatten and polish up about as quickly as A2.
Contributor
To really use a 1/8" pigsticker, you'd need to be cutting a thin, but very long, mortise. I suppose those exist, but I've not needed any.
Here is an 1/8" oval bolstered mortice chisel chopping a mortice for a drawer pull ...
I have a couple of RIs - a 1/4" and the same 3/8" that John has just received. They are really excellent, the best.
Here is a 1/4" RI flanked by 1/2" and 1/4" Wards ..
However I would say that RI are overkill, even for hard Australian timber. I have a bunch of vintage OBM chisels, mostly Wards and Sorbys. These are laminated HCS blades and, while not ultimately as tough as the D2 of the RIs, they are still fantastic steel and hold an edge a very long time in hard woods.
You can pick up the vintage ones cheaply if you are prepared to re-handle them. Quite easy to do (check out my website).
Still, if you want new and the best, get the RIs.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Contributor
I got a 7/16” and a ¼” pigsticker for a very good price off the bay. I wasn’t really prepared for how massive the 7/16” is from looking at the photos. I haven’t needed anything that big so I've just chopped out some practice mortices.
So this got me to thinking about the best steel for this type of work.
I generally prefer softer steel because I can make and keep a sharp edge so easily. I guess the older chisels are some type of O1 steel? Anyway I assume they are all softer than A2 or D2 steel. So I’m wondering if the extra hardness of some of the newer chisels is much of an advantage in heavy chopping operations.
BTW John, you have had your Narex chisels for a while now, what do you think of them?
.
RD
[OP]
Contributor
Derek, those Wards dwarf the RI!!Makes me rethink the title to this thread!
David, good comments on flattening the back. The 1/4" chisel is a few weeks out on backorder, and when it arrives, I will spend a bit of time with each of them towards that end.
Member
D2 isn't so much hard as tough.
Old laminated pigstickers' faces are HARD. I have a monster old 5/8" OBMC (actually from Ray) which I still haven't managed to make any impression on. Need to get out the grit and lapping plate - will be using it in earnest next month.
Contributor
John, first, the handles on the 3/16", 1/4" , 5/16" RI chisels are the same size, but smaller than the 3/8". (I don't have the larger sizes, so don't know about them).
Second, if you want a good mallet, consider the Good is Wood ones.
http://thebestthings.com/newtools/mallets.htm
They work great and are comfortable (I have small hands too).
Eric
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