Rough Spray finish?

[alex grams]

I am newer to spraying and have done a handful of projects. I own an earlex 3000 system, and am using Target's USL (the new formula EmTech 6000). I do about 2 coats of dewaxed shellac as a base, then about 2-3 coats of the Target coating. However, I am getting a slight eggshell/lemon peel texture on the spray with the Target coating. I am using the 1.5mm tip and tried several tests to get the right finish, however I seem to still get the small rough texture. I am still very happy with the finish, but not getting the exact results I want. I sand down with 600 between coats to smooth it some, but that doesn't seem to help a lot.

It seems when I put it on too heavy per coat on some test pieces I get a smoother finish, but that is risky though as if i do too much it can become milky in finish.

Counter to that, when i spray the shellac base (2lb cut) i get a great glossy finish. I give about 30 minutes between coats.

Any thoughts/ideas? Are my expectations too high for this finish? Should I expect to do some rubbing out? Should i try another tip size? Am i putting it on too thick per coat?

Thanks in advance.

[Jeff Monson]

Alex, whenever I get an "orangepeel" effect I will usually thin my material, I just sprayed some precat laquer and it wasnt laying down as smooth as I would have liked, so I thinned 10% and it helped. After 2 coats I also smooth out the finish with 320 grit and the next 2 coats are usually glass smooth.

[Prashun Patel]

I've found USL to go on orange peely, but to level very well - and that's with a cheap sprayer. Perhaps you're room is too hot, and it's drying before it gets a chance to level?

[alex grams]

The room is air conditioned to about 78-80 degrees. I will try thinning it some on a few test pieces.

[Don Selke]

Aalex: Have you tried to use any retarder? Target has a retarder that you can add to your finish to slow down the dry time. It allows the finish to lay down after spraying. I have to use retarder in all my water base finishes here in the desert SW, due to the dry air and very low humidity. If you give Jeff at Target a call he will turn you in the right direction.

[alex grams]

Well thinning it 25% did not seem to help much. It is at best a semi gloss, though it is less eggshell, just the finish isn't what I would describe as a gloss.

2 coats of shellac, light 600 grit sanding to knock anything down, then 3 coats of target 6000, and a semi gloss at best it seems. Giving a minimum of 30 minutes between coats (closer to an hour) in a 78-80 degree Air Conditioned space. The finish was purchased in May, so only 5 months old.

I will post the same Q on the Target forums, and if i get a good solution will share it back here. Though any more suggestions would still be appreciated.

[Mike McCann]

Alex

it sounds like you are spaying it too thin you need to put more on if you are getting a rough feel. it needs to go on thicker to be smooth.

[alex grams]

Mike,
I did put the second and third coats on heavier, even to the point I started to get a little hazing. However, now that the eggshell texture may be smoothed out, the finish is still pretty flat (like I said, semi gloss at best). As it was, I doubt I could put it on any heavier without getting runs, especially on a vertical surface.

Would drying too fast cause the finish to flatten? I don't see how it would be drying too fast, but something to explore. My AC exhausts near where I had some of them drying, but those didn't turn out any differently than the pieces that were not near the exhaust.

[Scott Holmes]

I see you are in Houston, me too, humidity will affect the water-borne finish.

[Eiji Fuller]

The only target product I have been happy with is the 8000. But the 8000 gives no depth to the finish so I have switched to Valspar Zenith waterborne pre cat laquer and conversion varnish and have been much happier with the look and how it sprays. The valspar has a much warmer look than I have seen with waterbornes. It is also much more affordable than the Target coatings.

[Rafael Carias]

The only target product I have been happy with is the 8000. But the 8000 gives no depth to the finish so I have switched to Valspar Zenith waterborne pre cat laquer and conversion varnish and have been much happier with the look and how it sprays. The valspar has a much warmer look than I have seen with waterbornes. It is also much more affordable than the Target coatings.

Eiji, I am surprised the Target stuff didn't work out for you. Did you try out the EM6000? It worked out quite nice for me.

BY the way, who caries the valspar water borne? I haven't seen it in any of the stores around here (I'm in Los Angeles)

[Eiji Fuller]

Ive tried the Target coatings EM2000, 6000, and 8000. The 6000 and 8000 spray out well but the 8000 sprays the best. The 2000 looks and feels good but sprays like crud. The 6000 and 8000 if use alone have no depth of finish. I wanted a waterborne to impart a depth and warm the wood like a solvent base.

The valspar zenith precat laquer has a warmer tone than any other waterborne I have seen. The EM2000 is nice too but I have recently run into problems spraying the new stuff that was shipped to me. I had to return 2 gallons of the stuff. What a hassle! The price point is really high for the Target stuff and has not been justified.

The Valspar is available locally for me (San Diego) at Vista paint stores and Dunn Edwards paint stores. I just have to say how much nicer it is to be able to go to the paint store to pick up the finish vs ordering online/phone and shipping.

[Jamie Buxton]

You might be holding the gun too far from the surface. Try holding it closer.

[Rafael Carias]

Ive tried the Target coatings EM2000, 6000, and 8000. The 6000 and 8000 spray out well but the 8000 sprays the best. The 2000 looks and feels good but sprays like crud. The 6000 and 8000 if use alone have no depth of finish. I wanted a waterborne to impart a depth and warm the wood like a solvent base.

The valspar zenith precat laquer has a warmer tone than any other waterborne I have seen. The EM2000 is nice too but I have recently run into problems spraying the new stuff that was shipped to me. I had to return 2 gallons of the stuff. What a hassle! The price point is really high for the Target stuff and has not been justified.

The Valspar is available locally for me (San Diego) at Vista paint stores and Dunn Edwards paint stores. I just have to say how much nicer it is to be able to go to the paint store to pick up the finish vs ordering online/phone and shipping.

Eiji san, pretty much every maker of water born clears (and paint for that matter) are "almost there". Once you are spoiled with the richness of oil finishes its hard to adapt to water borne, but what the heck, they come close enough to ditch fumes. Anyhow I hear a seal coat of de-waxed shellac can worm up the water borne top coats a bit.

Funny you should mention Dunn Edwards, I was just there the other day for brush covers and peeped the clear coat section while I was there and the only water born clear they had was the Deft stuff (not a bad product actually).

Look at it this way, at least you have work to complain about.

[Phil Phelps]

Orange peel is usually the result of too much pressure. Make sure your material is reduced, thinned, properly. Overlap by half, crisscross your pattern.