Save the Planet. Eat your Pet.

[Eric Larsen]

The die is cast, we may as well prepare for whatever is in store for us.

Are you suggesting we do nothing? Not even try? Surely if we threw our collective weight into devising means of scrubbing carbon from the atmosphere, we could come up with SOMETHING. It might be too little, too late, but at least we could say we tried. At the moment, all we can say is that we wrung our hands and passed the problem down to a newer (and hopefully more courageous) generation.

What bothers me most about this -- ridiculous stories about moose flatulence, eating pets, companies buying their way out of pollution laws -- is that we as a people do not seem to have the will to do anything about the problem.

My neighborhood is a perfect example. There are two people on my street who recycle. Why is that? Recycling is not mandatory in Las Vegas and there is no penalty for tossing cardboard, batteries, glass and plastic into a landfill.

Basically, unless the carrot and stick approach is used, people do not care enough to do the right thing.

Until "giving a [censored] about the planet" is turned from a partisan political issue into national issue (like winning the cold war)*, the US is doomed to lag behind the rest of the world as a dirty nation.

*In the 50s through 80s, everyone agreed we needed to win the cold war. Opinions differed on how that would best be accomplished. But very few Americans indeed thought we should just hand the planet over to the Soviet bloc.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Eric,

Who determines what's right?

[Eric Larsen]

Eric,

Who determines what's right?

We could pick a name at random out of the phone book. Put that person in charge. And we'd likely get more coherent pollution policy than what we currently have.

Remember the Sprint walkie-talkie ads, featuring firefighters as congressmen? "Ok, who wants clean water."


Really, it should be that simple.

Anyone out there want more polluted water? Air? Dirt? Anyone?

Want to relax pollution laws some more and let companies toss dioxyn next to preschools? Put lead back into paint and gasoline?

What's it going to take for people to step up and say, "I want a cleaner environment?"

Seems to me that 40% of this country is concerned that if we step up to the plate and demand a less toxic world, somehow Al Gore is going to magically be put in charge of the environment. Personally, I don't care if he is. At least he seems to give a [censored.] We have far too many people in this country who don't care one bit.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I would suggest a few things Eric:

1. In-your-face, distorted confrontational statements by either side on this argument will lead to nothing being done and will just further alienate the two sides.

2. Until both sides really want to treat the others with respect and sit down and come to a resolution, nothing will happen.

Do you want to pay 90% of your income to make such things happen if forced by the government?

Do you want to see a 400% increase in the cost of everything to see it happen?

The distorted accusations and claims by both sides results in turning off the majority of the average Joes and Janes out there.

The science being touted by both sides is not unbiased nor necessarily accurate. Prestudy bias on the part of the scientist and the financial bias forced by those paying for the studies results in poor, disreputable results.

There are probably some reasonable resolutions to problems but people would rather make wild, emotional caustic distorted accusations mistakenly thinking this is going to awaken the general masses. The results are the opposite.

[Eric Larsen]

I would suggest a few things Eric:

1. In-your-face, distorted confrontational statements by either side on this argument will lead to nothing being done and will just further alienate the two sides.

2. Until both sides really want to treat the others with respect and sit down and come to a resolution, nothing will happen.

Do you want to pay 90% of your income to make such things happen if forced by the government?

Do you want to see a 400% increase in the cost of everything to see it happen?

There are probably some reasonable resolutions to problems but people would rather make wild, emotional caustic distorted accusations mistakenly thinking this is going to awaken the general masses. The results are the opposite.

You mean like saying there will be 90% taxes and paying 400% more for everything?

We're doing jack-censored at the moment. I'd like to see us do more. This "let's wait/study some more/bicker" hasn't been working. Let's try something else.

[Ken Garlock]

Eric,

Who determines what's right?

I do, dang nab it.

First step is to start building more and more Nuclear power plants. There are too many fools running around yelling not in my back yard, or what do we do with all the radio active waste?
If the US citizenship can be forced to have medical care, they can darn well be forced to have have a nuc plant in the back yard!
The RA waste can be processed and reused as fuel, France is doing it now.
There are also techniques for cleaning up coal fired power plants, but they up the cost of a new plant by 20%.

Get your axx into the gulf of Mexico and the ANWR and drill for oil. It is plainly stupid not to be doing off shore drilling in the Gulf coast. What are we going to do, set back and let the Chinese and other countries take it all???

YES, yes, yes, there are too many people. And to boot, TV makes a it a great feat to bread like rabbits, just take a look at a couple of the current programs on cable TV. I am surprised that those women have time to get out of bed.

Vegans, and pita, I respect their right to demonstrate Darwin in action. Just keep to your own group of crazies.... Since the peta people like to parade their cause naked, they should be given parade permits for any weekend when the snow is at least 6" deep.

Finally, all convicted child predators should be castrated and made to wear it around their necks. There should be a national automatic death penalty for the murder of a child conviction. Judges would have no choice!

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Eric,

I don't want to get political but look at the states that have enacted the strongest environmental laws and then look at their current and past financial status. Then look at the comparative cost of living in those states.

To make the types of changes without looking at the current and future costs of those changes would be irresponsible.

It's just as irresponsible to say you don't need any changes because of the costs involved.

There has to be some reasonably negotiated options that would help resolve those issues.

Again....I'm not taking sides in this....I'm just pointing out that I, as an individual, am tired of the bickering, partisan, distorted, absurd positions that groups, political and otherwise, have been taking for the last few decades. I have quit watching television news shows as it is impossible to get unbiased reporting and instead get "editorial commentary" because I am obviously incapapable of deciphering the truth if the news organizations just reported the facts.

[phil harold]

Eric,

I don't want to get political but look at the states that have enacted the strongest environmental laws and then look at their current and past financial status. Then look at the comparative cost of living in those states.

Take this one step further

Countries

Manufacturing has moved to to 3rd world countries because

1. environmental laws
2. labor safety laws,
3. unions
4. cheaper labor

And remember that
"Capitalism and democracy dont mix well"

[Mitchell Andrus]

Finally, all convicted child predators should be castrated and made to wear it around their necks.

You meant a sign, right? :0
.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Take this one step further


"Capitalism and democracy dont mix well"

Phil,

I'll disagree. It's only when either party exerts or pracitices extremism and becomes too selfish.......to greedy.......to narrow minded and tunnel visioned...........

[phil harold]

Phil,

I'll disagree. It's only when either party exerts or pracitices extremism and becomes too selfish.......to greedy.......to narrow minded and tunnel visioned...........

And there is none of that in the States?

large portion of third world countries are not democratic states

I wonder why?

[Ken Garlock]

You meant a sign, right? :0
.

Yes, but let the sign be a tattoo on the forehead.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

And there is none of that in the States?

large portion of third world countries are not democratic states

I wonder why?

Phil,

I never said there wasn't any of that in the States.........far from it.

I have never even tried to indicate anyone person or groups was free from any blame or to be blamed.

I'm just saying this.

1. Extremist..in your face.....spewing of ridiculous absurd accusations doesn't sell to the masses and can hurt your cause when employed.

2. If you can't show respect to all the interested parties in a confrontation, you will not be shown respect and no viable negotiated deal will happen.

3. It is irresponsible to try to win a cause without investigating and trying to mitigate the resultant financial effects.

4. It is just as irresponsible to deny that these problems are occurring and to ignore them because of a perceived financial hardships.

There is surely a reasonable way to address these problems but until the extremists on both sides of the issue realize that they aren't in the majority and they must learn to negotiate a REASONABLE approach to solving these problems, the problems won't be solved.

[Bob Smalser]

What bothers me most about this -- ridiculous stories about moose flatulence, eating pets, companies buying their way out of pollution laws -- is that we as a people do not seem to have the will to do anything about the problem.

Or.....lighten up and go peddle this new religion to those who can't think past their nose about unintended consequences. The evidence of a disease versus natural cycle is hardly "settled science", and the cures may be worse than the disease.

Wind farms are just one small example of many.

- Are we really gonna plow up thousands and thousands of acres of pristine, fragile desert ecosystems for concrete pads and service roads?

- How difficult, expensive and lengthy a process will it be to condemn the thousands of acres of private property necessary for all those new transmission lines necessary to bring that electricity to population centers?

- How many threatened and endangered migratory birds and bats will be killed annually by all those propeller blades?

- Besides oil tycoon Boone Pickens, who today have positioned themselves to gain financially from such a massive national investment?

- What ever happened to that wind farm planned offshore from the Kennedy estate in Massachussets?



"We live in a time when the methodology of science is suspended. Reactions to human-induced global warming based on incomplete science can only be extraordinary costly, will distort energy policy, and will make the poor poorer...in the case of the effect of CO2 on climate, is to have the courage to thoughtfully do nothing."

Heaven and Earth: Global Warming, The Missing Science, Ian Plimer, Professor of Earth and Environmental Science, University of Adelaide, 2009.

[Gary Herrmann]

Quoting part of the quote from Bob's original quote. Um, yeah...

"The eco-pawprint of a pet dog is twice that of a 4.6-litre Land Cruiser driven 10,000 kilometres a year, researchers have found."

Now, I guess I could go out to the garage and hug my Tundra, but it will just sit there and the metal is kinda cold.

Instead, I'm going to join the fam in the den, watch some college football and decide which labrador to rest my feet on, while the cats prowl the sofa table behind the couch.

AND, I'm gonna have a fire too.