NEW! Friends of The Creek Directory Service, Check This Out

[Doug Griffith]

I'm not affiliated with this website but feel the need to chime in.

1. Sawmillcreek is a huge site yet I type in my businesses name in Google and it is not linked to FOTC. I've tried different keywords and ideas and not once does it come up with anything. If the two don't work together, I'm not sure there is really a point to the directory.

In your words "Sawmillcreek is a huge site". This is who the directory is targeted at. Also, Sawmill Creek has no control over Google. I randomly Googled "Waldron Instruments sawmill creek" and it came up #1.

2. Nothing is hotlinked. If I put in my website, it's not a link. It's just text in a different color. I have to ask, what is the point?

The title of the company is a hotlink.

3. There is no email option. Again, web based directory without a direct way to email is pretty pointless.

I'm sure this is a privacy issue. You can always send a private message to the Sawmill Creek member.

Overall, it's a nice little directory for the forum but as a business advertisement it's absolutely worthless.

Where else can you get this much exposure for the small amount it costs to be included in the directory?

[Scott Shepherd]

Ross, no disrespect meant, but your not moving up in searches has everything to do with your site and how's it's done, not with FOTC directory. In a quick look at your site, it's not search engine friendly at all. If you want to climb the ranks, you need to fix those things and then hope that FOTC can help with a little boost. Just linking from a popular site isn't going to rocket you to the top of any list. Search Engine Optimization has no magic button. It takes a combination of many things which all add together to create results. Linking to one site, or changing one thing won't do much of anything. What it will do is get you ahead of the guy that didn't do it, but SEO takes a lot of work, a lot of effort, a lot of time, and a lot of patience. Some sites get crawled by search engines several times a day. Some don't get crawled but once every few months. Depending on where your site is, you could make changes and see no results in the search engines for a month or more. Or, you might change things and see the changes next week.

In looking at your source code, your site need some serious work to help it go up in the ranks.

[Keith Outten]

Ross,

We are working on the FOTC Directory still. It is a work in progress and as such we will always be adding features or correcting things we have overlooked.

The hot link that is currently setup for your business name is being changed to your web address. Mike Null made this suggestion yesterday.
Aaron has recently added the capability for you to link to your FOTC record in your signature. This is a major change but you have to add the link and of course the more you post the more exposure your FOTC link with receive. We have recently provided instructions for you to get the link to your record that you can use in your signature and on your web site.

We are working on a whole page of SawMill Creek changes right now and some will have an impact on our FOTC Directory as far as exposure and function. It took several years for SawMill Creek to become the number one woodworking forum, it will take a bit more time for us to make our FOTC Directory the best source for information and list of services.

Doug and Scott have given you some very good sugestions concerning web site promotion. There are probably books written now about how to promote your web pages, it takes a lot of work. You could consider adding a link back to SawMill Creek, that couldn't hurt. We have recently searched Google to see if our FOTC links are being picked up and they are working.

Although we hope to eventually have a better means of promoting FOTC with the search engines, at some point, we need to start by improving the number of people here who will use the FOTC. We average over 40,000 woodworkers per day who visit The Creek, thats a huge audience of potential customers. We are growing big time, our December 2010 traffic just set a record that was over 30% above our December 2009 numbers. See my signature below and note the nine digit number of page views.

If you need more exposure contact me about a banner ad, last month our banner ad sponsors each received well over one million page views here. The cost is a little higher than 4 dollars and change per month.

[Ross Moshinsky]

I'm not talking about my website. I'm talking about the directory. Pick any business in the directory and using general keywords try to get the FOTC directory to pop up. If you're up to 5-6 very specific keywords, then it's not doing a great job. That's my point. If you're a business posting your name in the directory with hopes to actually result in increasing web coverage, this isn't working. I'm not sure there is a point to the directory from a business stand point if it doesn't increase exposure. This is all having to due with how the directory is setup and how it works with search engines.

For example: Do a google search for a product found in someone's signature. I did one for Scott's 'Copam Vinyl Plotter' and Sawmillcreek comes up as the THIRD result in google. It shows the strength of Sawmill Creek's web presence. That same strength should find its way over to the FOTC directory. You've obviously noticed my concern as that is why you are suggesting we add the link to our signature.

[Dan Hintz]

At the moment, I have to agree with Ross on this one. Also the suggestion to link to SMC from our business websites would only serve to increase SMC's ranking, not the business site ranking. I have no problem with increasing SMC's ranking, but I would hate to leave people with the impression doing so will help them directly.

[Scott Shepherd]

Ross, I clearly don't understand what you are talking about. If you search Copam in google, it comes up, but it doesn't come up in my FOTC, it comes in in a thread asking about the copam plotter. That's all SMC there. It comes up because their rank is so high in search engines.

Are you suggesting your listing as a FOTC should cause you to come to the top of any searches? If so, then it won't. Also, if it does, and everyone on the forum lists, then it will defeat the purpose completely.

I don't think you can use FOTC as any search engine results helper for your site. It might help your organic searches a little, but in general, I don't think you'll see huge results or improvements.

[Ross Moshinsky]

Scott,

My point is simple. You are a member of the FOTC. Go on Google and try to get your directory to pop up. How many keywords did you have to use to get it to show up? After this exercise, how effective do you think the directory is for drumming up business?

Now type in any non-unique key phrase from anyone's signature. See how quickly it pulls up a page on the forum. See the difference in effectiveness? The forum is much more search engine friendly. The directory, in its current form, does not play nicely with google.

[Scott Shepherd]

I think your expectations are set too high for the functionality of that directory. If you expect that to make your name surge in the search engines, I think you expected too much. In fact, how worthless would that be for people that did pay for it. If I spent $50 along with 200 other people, then I might very well be 200th on the google search, which is 20 pages back. So what would be my point of advertising with it?

I thought all along it was meant to have a directory where SMC members could turn to when trying to buy things or services. Kind of trying to "keep it local" so to speak. I thought that's what it was meant for. I didn't think it was meant to make people's names skyrocket to the top of google and other search engines.

Like I said, I'd pull my $50 out of it if it was putting everyone high up in google because I'd be supporting a system that was helping others get ahead of me.

[Aaron Koehl]

Ross,

The FOTC is a directory designed to allow SawmillCreek members to browse to find other SawmillCreek members with particular business interests. It also allows members the opportunity to associate their accounts with a business entity, which is otherwise not allowed here. Increasing your search engine rankings is only an ancillary benefit; but it is effective nonetheless. If you're trying to find West Hudson Industries in Google, however, you likely won't find it quickly--the business name is full of generic search terms. Having a link from the SawmillCreek FOTC does increase your chances of being picked up, however.

More to the point, if you're trying to find businesses owned by SawmillCreek members so as to do business with other SawmillCreek members, Google is extremely unsuited for this task. The FOTC directory, however, is designed specifically with this task in mind.