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Thread: Best HVLP system?

  1. #16
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    I often use latex in my HVLP. You do need a 4 stage machine, and I add 2 oz of water and 2oz of floetrol per quart. Does a good job.

    Though a little slow, you could use it to paint a house. You would need a remote container to hold more paint than the quart attached to the gun. Using a large nozzle, you can lay down quite a bit of paint, and it is still easier than doing it by hand. Also, a good reason to justify the cost of the machine

    However, an airless is the way to go. MUCH faster.
    George
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  2. #17
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    I don't know for sure, but I'd think that if you watered down house paint to get it through a HVLP you'd void the warranty. Paint wasn't meant to be reduced that far. For fifty bucks, why not rent an airless?
    Phil in Big D
    The only difference between a taxidermist and the taxman, is that the taxidermist leaves the skin. Mark Twain

  3. #18
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    The only dilution is the water, and it is not that much. The floetrol is just a viscosity reducer.

    The airless is a lot more than $50, you could not finish it in one day, though it would be less work.
    George
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  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by George Brown View Post
    I often use latex in my HVLP. You do need a 4 stage machine, and I add 2 oz of water and 2oz of floetrol per quart. Does a good job.

    Though a little slow, you could use it to paint a house. You would need a remote container to hold more paint than the quart attached to the gun. Using a large nozzle, you can lay down quite a bit of paint, and it is still easier than doing it by hand. Also, a good reason to justify the cost of the machine

    However, an airless is the way to go. MUCH faster.
    George, I'm intrigued. I own an airless system that overs prays to an extent that I could never use it outside, unless my neighbors want their house, windows, shrubs, and car painted as well.

    If I can use the HVLP outside, it is, indeed, justification for buying the noise-reduced Fuji system.

    Cameron Reddy

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cameron Reddy View Post
    George, I'm intrigued. I own an airless system that overs prays to an extent that I could never use it outside, unless my neighbors want their house, windows, shrubs, and car painted as well.

    If I can use the HVLP outside, it is, indeed, justification for buying the noise-reduced Fuji system.

    Cameron Reddy

    Just charge them for a custom paint job

    I guess it depends on how close your neighbors are. Whatever over spray, or really just mist, that comes off is dry by the time it gets anywhere, so it is really just like dust. Outside, the breeze would probably dissipate it very quickly.

    If things that you don't want to get paint on are really close, I guess you'd have to worry, but anything a little further should not be a problem. Granted, I did not do a whole house, but whatever I sprayed outdoors, did not seem to carry any distance. Or maybe that's why the neighbor was washing his car so often .

    There is a significant over spray with airless units also.

    A noise reduced one would be nice. Outdoors is not too bad, but indoors, it is very loud.
    George
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  6. #21
    In regards to the acrylic trim enamels (waterborne) just about every manufacturer I have talked to have said the thinning up to 10% is no problem. 2 oz water per quart is less than that. We usually suggest 3-4 oz water and 3-4 oz Floetrol to spray Ben Moore Impervo and SW ProClassic (waterborne acrylics) through turbines and they work fine assuming you have the correct nozzle. We suggest 1.4mm-1.5mm for fine finishing of furniture where speed is not an issue, and 1.8mm-2.0mm where speed is required (walls, etc)

    In regards to Floetrol, it really isn't a viscosity reducer as it's pretty thick, it's more of a flow out additive that negates some of the effects that adding water has on a typical interior waterbased paint.

    Also keep in mind that you should never use a standard latex wall paint for furniture as it doesn't have the necessary durability for furniture.

    An HVLP turbine isn't something I would want to use for walls or a house (airless is best), but it will work, albeit slow. For the home woodworker doing furniture and other projects that use thinner materials (decking stuff, fences) it is still a good all-purpose option.

  7. #22
    I've been studying a bit. I'm still thinking of using a HVLP system for my woodworking and occasional house painting by adding a 2 quart off-gun pot. Everyone has agreed that HVLP isn't to best tool but I'm pretty sure everyone has been considering their experiences with 4 stage systems.

    And now I've discovered 5 and even 6 stage systems that produce not 8 psi but up to 11.5 psi. That's nearly 50% more powerful. They are a lot more expensive, of course, but I would at least like to know what is possible.

    The problem is I that I haven't been able to find any reviews of these more powerful systems. You guys know anything about them?

    The 9969 is 10 psi and I've seen it for $1200. The Titan 115 is about $1400 and is 11.5 psi.

    Notable features:

    1. Because of the power of these units, an add on compressor is not necessary to run the 2 qt. pressure pot (another $245).

    2. The units have two power settings. One (low) that runs at 4 stage power and high for 6 stage power.

    3. The guns are modified with larger internal chambers and passageways.

    Six Stage Systems:


    http://www.spraytechinc.com/portal/u...11,301161.html



    http://www.titantool.com/portal/us_c...titantool.html

  8. #23
    I've used my HVLP to paint exterior latex for railings and shutters. Even though HVLP doesn't give much overspray its not as if you don't have to mask and shield carefully.

    Those 5 and 6 stage machines sound good but I know nothing of either of them personally.

    If you're painting a new house or a barn then its fast and easy to use airless to get a lot of paint applied. If you are spraying a house with established landscaping and detailed trim its probably better to go back to brush and roller.

    It takes a crew to mask and protect and lots of time that same crew could roll and brush almost as fast. Crappy apartment buildings get sprayed. Spray a nice house the same way and you will have a nightmare on your hands. Homeowners have much higher standards than landlords.
    Last edited by Henry Ambrose; 04-28-2010 at 8:24 PM.

  9. #24
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    Airless for latex on a house is the best tool. However, if you want a sprayer for woodworking, and ocassionally want to use it to paint your house, it will work, though slower. Now if you've got the money, buy BOTH

    I've sprayed latex indoors on a wall without getting any on the ceiling, no masking either. Just held up a cardboard at the top of the wall to stop any overspray. It worked fine, actually better than cutting in with a brush. I'm not a very good painter

    I haven't seen the air assisted airless, something to look into.

    EDIT:

    Looked at the air assisted airless. Not bad. BUT, looks like it would waste a lot of paint that is left in the machine and needs to be washed out. Even my hvlp spray gun wastes some that I have to wash out, though I've been able to reduce it to less than 2 tablespoon's worth. With the airless, the hoses and pump would waste quite a bit. Would not be worth setting up for a small job.
    Last edited by George Brown; 04-28-2010 at 6:52 PM.
    George
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Jewitt View Post
    In regards to the acrylic trim enamels (waterborne) just about every manufacturer I have talked to have said the thinning up to 10% is no problem. 2 oz water per quart is less than that. We usually suggest 3-4 oz water and 3-4 oz Floetrol to spray Ben Moore Impervo and SW ProClassic (waterborne acrylics) through turbines and they work fine assuming you have the correct nozzle. We suggest 1.4mm-1.5mm for fine finishing of furniture where speed is not an issue, and 1.8mm-2.0mm where speed is required (walls, etc)

    In regards to Floetrol, it really isn't a viscosity reducer as it's pretty thick, it's more of a flow out additive that negates some of the effects that adding water has on a typical interior waterbased paint.

    Also keep in mind that you should never use a standard latex wall paint for furniture as it doesn't have the necessary durability for furniture.

    An HVLP turbine isn't something I would want to use for walls or a house (airless is best), but it will work, albeit slow. For the home woodworker doing furniture and other projects that use thinner materials (decking stuff, fences) it is still a good all-purpose option.
    Jeff, I have been using Floetrol for decades. It's a great product for brushing latex enamels. I haven't burshed acrylic enamels, but I would imagine it would work as well. Unless Floetrol was reformulated, the manufacturer called it an "extender". It really aided in smoothness when brushing and it greatly helps laying out, or reducing brush strokes. It was never intended for a reducer. I used to try it back in the seventies when Sears dictated the color of their signs and I was spraying cut out letters and masonite substrates with latex. I never saw a helpful difference back then. They have changed the wording in their directions, but I'm not sure it really helps. Personally, I don't know why anyone would want to try and use a HVLP to spray latex on walls in their home. You can do a better, faster, and cleaner job with the proper roller cover and brush.
    Phil in Big D
    The only difference between a taxidermist and the taxman, is that the taxidermist leaves the skin. Mark Twain

  11. #26
    Phil,

    Have you tried using a 5 or 6 stage HVLP with a high-capacity gun?

  12. #27
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    No, Cameron, I haven't. I probably won't either. I'm not going to up grade anything in my shop. I've been around over four decades and this isn't something that I need. I want everyone to benefit from the latest technology in tools and materials and I'm sure many new items are available that I personally have and will miss. That HVLP you posted is certainly nice. I'm not knocking it, but if it were me and I was a hobbiest, I'd invest my money in a spray booth. It seems that you are really interested in painting your house. You know you can rent an airless system fairly cheap. You won't be painting for another 8-10 years if you do a pro job. Painting a house is a walk in the park "after" you work your tail off on the prep. Keep researching and reading, you need to do what's right for you. Good luck.
    Phil in Big D
    The only difference between a taxidermist and the taxman, is that the taxidermist leaves the skin. Mark Twain

  13. #28
    Phil, I get the impression you were offended by my comment. I'm most sorry about that. Not intended, to be sure.

    What I'm trying to find is someone who has actually used one of these new high-powered systems and has an opinion one way or the other.

    I know that folks who have used 4 stage systems do not recommend painting a house. Some, such as George, have used HVLP systems with success in limited house painting. But I don't think even George has used the newer 5 and/or 6 stage systems.

    I own an airless paint system that I used to paint my garage and much of my great room. It was totally unacceptable for painting outside, unfortunately, as there was way too much overspray and blow back. Paint went everywhere.

    A HVLP system with limited overspray and blow back would seem to be just the ticket if, that is, it has the ability to put down enough paint.

    Further, it would seem to me, totally inexperienced in exterior house painting—mind you, that an HVLP sprayer that can put down enough paint would be a godsend for someone trying to use a roller to cover the many surfaces presented with siding's overlapping boards. In other words, painting multi-faceted siding is not as easy as painting a nice and flat interior wall, or so I assume.

  14. #29
    I am also interested in any feedback on use of the newer 5 & 6 stage turbines. I am not a pro but do shoot a fair amount of finish - a couple of gallons of WB poly in a weekend is not uncommon.

    I have a 16 year old Titan 3 stage HVLP & it has done a lot of work over the years but the gun is starting to go and parts no longer available. So, I can get a new gun or use this an the excuse to upgrade my system. The only things I don't like about my current setup are the poor latex performance and the PITA of production work with a quart cup - to tiring, hard to get inside case work and stopping every 15 minutes for the messy job of pouring finish from a gallon can really chaps me.

    So it seems my choices are - 5/6 stage turbine unit with 2.5 gallon pressure pot to hold my gallon cans OR air-assisted airless (A-A A)system.

    cost aside what is the groups recommendation? does A-A A produce as fine a finish with WB Poly/dye/shellac as a high end HVLP turbine/gun? any advantage of A-A A vs HVLP?

    from my research so far it seems that A-A A does not heat the air which impacts the flow-out of some finishes, is a better choice for latex and can layout more finish/unit time..

  15. #30
    Woo Hoo, Erik! GREAT questions!!

    Something like this?



    Or this?


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