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Thread: Will the oneway balancing system work on a woodcraft slowspeed grinder?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Posts
    733

    Will the oneway balancing system work on a woodcraft slowspeed grinder?

    Hi Creekers,

    I have a question. I have been testing my grinder and my tools bounce on the wheel. I have dressed the surface and dressed the surface of the wheels. It is pretty clean but I can still hear a loosely held tool "bounce" on the wheel.

    So I got online and looked at the oneway balancing system. I really thought it might help. But it said something to the effect of "the grinding wheel must have a 1" hole" then the bushings take it down to fit the 5/8th inch arbor on the grinder. I went back to the woodcraft website looking for the grinder and it is long gone. So I have no clue what the diameter of the hole in the grinder wheel is.

    Since that grinder was pretty darn popular for a long time I figured someone might have done this before me. So does anyone know if the oneway balancing system will work on the Woodcraft slow speed grinder? Or do I need to get new wheels if I want to use one?

    Thanks!
    Joshua

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Atikokan, Rainy River district, Ontario
    Posts
    2,464
    Easiest way to find out Josh is to pull a wheel off and measure


    Have fun and take care

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Bangor, PA
    Posts
    1,713
    I have one and it made my high speed grinder much smoother in combination with a dressing tool that makes the wheel round. A hand held diamond grinder will not do that unless it is keyed to a fixed object like your tool rest. If you own anything less, spend your money on the dresser first, then the balancer. If you balance an "out of round" wheel, it will spin quieter but your tool will still bounce. Then, after you shave it round, you will no longer be in balance.
    fmr

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Hampton, NH
    Posts
    181
    I would recommend getting the wheel dresser from Geiger. This should fix the problem of tool bounce. I picked one up at the AAW symposium and am very glad I did.
    Matt Newton
    IAFF Local 2664

    non illigitimi carborundum

  5. #5

    help solve your problem

    Hi Josh:
    I'd like to help solve your problem.
    First I recommend ditching any plastic bushings that came with the wheels and replace them with metal. I use and recommend headless press-fit drill bushings. Once you determine the inside dimesions of your wheel and axle diameter, you can order them from McMaster Carr.
    Secondly true your wheels using a high-quality truing device- not just a hand-held dresser.
    If you've got tool bounce it can almost always be solved by the two actions above. If you only use a balancing sytem you may only solve grinder vibration since you may be counter balancing for non-concentric surfaces of your wheels. If you do this, you will still have tool bounce.
    If you try what I suggest and it doesn't work you haven't wasted any money, because you will still need to accurately true your wheels before you balance them, but it may save you the expense of buying a wheel balancing system.
    There's been a lot of discussion on SMC about this. Search for "wheel truing" or "grinder vibration" and you will find a lot of success stories.
    I hope this is of some help to you.


    Don Geiger


    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua Dinerstein View Post
    Hi Creekers,

    I have a question. I have been testing my grinder and my tools bounce on the wheel. I have dressed the surface and dressed the surface of the wheels. It is pretty clean but I can still hear a loosely held tool "bounce" on the wheel.

    So I got online and looked at the oneway balancing system. I really thought it might help. But it said something to the effect of "the grinding wheel must have a 1" hole" then the bushings take it down to fit the 5/8th inch arbor on the grinder. I went back to the woodcraft website looking for the grinder and it is long gone. So I have no clue what the diameter of the hole in the grinder wheel is.

    Since that grinder was pretty darn popular for a long time I figured someone might have done this before me. So does anyone know if the oneway balancing system will work on the Woodcraft slow speed grinder? Or do I need to get new wheels if I want to use one?

    Thanks!
    Joshua

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Littleton, MA
    Posts
    67
    I followed the steps Don has outlined above. The Metal spacer and the Oneway dressing tool. The difference was was amazing. No tool bounce at all. No need for the balancing system either.

    As far as the hole diameter in the Woodcraft grinder wheels, mine were NOT 1 inch like the Norton's I have.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Goodland, Kansas
    Posts
    22,603
    Ditto what Don said. I did exactly what he described and my grinder works great now. Smooth and no tool bounce.
    Bernie

    Never put off until tomorrow what you can do the day after tomorrow.

    To succeed in life, you need three things: a wishbone, a backbone and a funnybone.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    NE Oklahoma
    Posts
    391
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua Dinerstein View Post
    <snip> So does anyone know if the oneway balancing system will work on the Woodcraft slow speed grinder? Or do I need to get new wheels if I want to use one?
    <snip>
    I purchased a WC slow speed grinder ~12 months ago and stock wheels have 5/8" arbor hole so the Oneway system won't work with these.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Collin County Texas
    Posts
    2,417
    Ditto Don's recommendation. Just the last week I installed bushings of 1/2 ID, 1" OD, by 3/4 long. Previously I had the One Way balancing system on my wheels. The grinder is a 6" Baldor 1800 RPM unit on which I got an excellent deal.

    I believe that just changing to the bushings gave me as good a balance as what I had with the One Way system. Not to bad mouth One Way, I like them and they make high quality products.

    I got my bushings at McMaster & Carr. They were around $8.50 each and I needed two. Yes, the price is rather steep, but they don't wear out, and a pair will last longer than the grinder of its user.
    Best Regards, Ken

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Mooresville,N.C,Race City,USA
    Posts
    396

    Woodcraft Slow Speed Grinder

    I read this post especialy Don's comments and decided since I was not happy with the way my grinder was performing and now I'm back up stairs with some questions.I have the woodcraft and mine has black splined plastic arbors that don't appear to want to come out easily.What kind of effort does it take to get them out.I found the drill bushings if they do ever come out cause now my wheels have a side to side wobble which is coming through as a vibration.
    Second question,what kind of wheel,brand and color do most use on whatever grinder they have unless speed determines a particular wheel.I have the 80 and 120 white wheels that came on the grinder.
    Thanx,Greg

  11. #11

    Plastic bushing removal, wheel selection and mounting procedures

    I donít have the Woodcraft grinder, but I offer the following:
    It is possible the bushings are glued in, but maybe not. To test this: remove the wheels and using wooden dowel of similar diameter and a small hammer, lightly tap the bushing and see if it moves. If it doesnít; donít force it.

    If you arenít able to remove the bushings, you will need to decide whether to re-use the existing wheels or buy new ones. I would first try using the wheels you already have as long as they are greater than 7.5Ē diameter. In this case remount the wheels and true them with a good wheel truing system as described earlier.

    If you decide to replace the wheels, many have had success with the Norton 3X wheels I purchased from Packard. They can be purchased with a 1Ē hole. I used bushings that were 5/8Ē i.d. X 1Ē o.d. X 1Ē long.

    As far as the grit is concerned, many turners benefit from having two different grits. In these cases I think and 80 and a 120 would be good choices.

    When mounting wheels you may notice some side to side wobble. To minimize this:
    1) mount the wheel to the axle and snug the securing nut.
    2) Rotate the wheel by hand and observe the amount of wobble. If it is more than you want:
    3) Loosen the nut and rotate the wheel on the axle to a different position and re-snug the nut. Test the wobble again. If it still isnít satisfactory:
    4) Remove the wheel and flip it 180į.
    5) Re-snug the nut and test again.
    6) Go through this process until you find a position that result in an acceptable amount of wobble. If you donít:
    7) Locate a point where wobble is at its maximum and use pieces of paper (not metal) to shim between the edge of the cup washer and the side of the wheel to counter the movement. A little bit goes a long way, so start with one piece and build up if necessary. Iíve had success using paper dots that have adhesive on the back (available from most office supply stores).

    Be sure to tighten the nuts when you get done and replace the guards. The recommended torque on the nuts is 5 to 7 ft. lbs. If you donít have a torque wrench in this range: hold the wheel still with your bare hand and use a wrench to tighten the nut. When the hand you are holding the wheel still with hurts, youíve applied enough torque. My point is: donít over-tighten the nuts.

    Whenever you get the wheel wobble taken care of, then true both wheels using a good quality wheel truing system as discussed earlier.

    I hope this information has been useful.

    Don Geiger

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Mooresville,N.C,Race City,USA
    Posts
    396

    Woodcraft Grinder

    Don,
    Thanx for the info.I've tried alot of what you mentioned.I shimmed the wheels last nite after putting an indicator on the shafts to make sure they were straight.It took alot of the wobble out but I did not reverse the wheels yet.I have the whole oneway system so truing them is not a problem.I'm gonna try the 3X wheels from Packard and see if they aren't an improvement.By the way,tapping the bushings with a dowel told me that it was not coming out easily.I did not want to break the only wheels I have so I let it be.Well I guess it's off the the Packard website.
    thanx,Greg

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Posts
    733
    Well I did a bunch more research last night on the grinder. I finally found a detailed review on an other site. It has a 7/8th inch hole in the wheels. I will forgo the Oneway balancing system for now and look for some bushings at McMaster Carr or somewhere. I just searched and found these:

    http://www.mcmaster.com/#drill-bushi...liners/=7y6sib

    They appear to be the right press-fit drill bushings. I think I will order some steel ones. Are these the ones that Don and others were suggesting or do I need to look for something else?

    I will eventually replace the wheels but right now the wheels are still basically an 8" diameter and they are in good condition. I just want to reduce bounce.

    Also I have the Oneway dressing jig. I bought it when I got the rest of the the wolverine setup. I have never used it. I have been using a t-style diamond dresser I bought at woodcraft when I got the grinder. I didn't realize that there would be much of a difference.

    Thanks,
    Joshua

  14. #14

    bushings and dressers

    I use and recommend the headless press-fit drill bushings. These are made to very close tolerences and have extremely paralell surfaces. I purchased mine from McMaster Carr. They are under $10 each. If you order from McMaster Carr they will arrive the next day.

    All of the hand held type of dressers (Tee, stick, etc.) are only intended to remove matal particles that have been imbedded in the surface of the aggregate (called de-glazing). Unless the device has a controlled depth of cut that can be advanced in micro increments, it will not true the wheel. With my dresser the instructions emphasize discontinuing using use of hand-held dresser and use the wheel truing system exclusively. My experience has been that if you true the wheel and then go back to using the hand-held system, the wheel will become out of round in pretty short order. An additional benefit to using a wheel truing system exclusively is: you can actually take less material off and maintain your wheels in better condition than you can with a hand-held.

    I see a dramatic improvement in the condition of the bevels on my tools after using the wheel truing system. The bevels are smoother and the burr is finer. This is becaise it levels the aggregate across the witdth of the wheel.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Tonawanda, NY
    Posts
    50

    Wheel Vibration

    I have Don Geiger's Wheel Truing Solution and it is some of the best money I have ever spent. His system is so much easier to use than the Oneway system. Nice clean round wheels makes grinding and sharpening so much easier.

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