Lie Nielsen or Veritas?

[Tony Shea]

Not that it's needed but I gotta throw my choice in.... LN 60 1/2 hands down. Just an incredible plane that feels as nice as it functions. I also own the 60 1/2R and feel this plane is just as nice especially for cleaning rabbets and tenon cheeks. The R is a bit more finiky to adjust the lateral of the blade but once set is not much of an issue until you sharpen. The R is a bit more versatile though. I use both daily and think the post about the person not liking a block plane is def missing something.

[Danny Burns]

Glenn makes a very important point here. Trying before buying is the best way to determine which of these tools will be best. The plane that feels like it belongs in your hand is going to be the right one.
Just a funny little aside… The block plane in my shop that fits best in my hand is an old #102 that I bought at The Restore" for $2.56.
jtk

I agree that if you get a chance to try the plane first, do so.
I like the LV low angle block plane, but find the LV standard angle block plane to be a wee bit too big for my medium cadet sized hands. So if I want to have a high angle cut, then I use the LA plane with a steeper beveled blade in it.

[Rob Lee]

Joe -

You have a lot of good advice in here... I'll toss in my 2 cents...

Firstly - you can't go wrong with either choice. There are differences between the two LABP's - and one will feel better to you. Ours is wider - so people with smaller hands will prefer the narrower LN version. Ours has a vertical tote option that let's you use it as a small bevel-up plane... which is a feature I really like. They really aren't the same planes at all.

Having said that - my favorite is the apron plane (ours or LN's). To me - it's just "right-sized" for single handed use. I use that plane far more than the LABP... (which isn't saying a lot, with the amount of shop time I get).

I would avoid the standard angle block planes (everyones!) - we make 'em primarily because people ask for them, and schools often specify them.

So much of what to buy depends on what you do too, and what other tools you have...

Cheers -

Rob

[Prashun Patel]

I'll throw in my 2c humbly in the wake of the advice you've gotten:

I own the LN102 and the LV Apron. I like both. One 'downside' of the Veritas if you use an eclipse style honing guide, the top of the blade is tapered, which means the sides of the guide can't clamp properly. It's not an issue if you use a Worksharp and don't mind sharpening via the underside port. If you prefer sharpening with a honing guide, though, get one that'll handle the blade.

In fact, I've since switched to the Veritas MKII honing guide which solved the problem (among others).

One other pc of advice: if you ever considered getting into the world of rehabbing old planes, then a Stanley 60 1/2 is a great place to start. They're ubiquitous in the used mkt, and you can make a great 'user' for probably half the price of a new LV or LN.

It's been my experience that the low angle 102's/apron-sized blocks are harder to come by, used. So, if you wanted both and wish to optimize yr $$, you might buy the latter new from LV/LN, and buy the former used from the 'bay.

[Jim Koepke]

Joe -

You have a lot of good advice in here... I'll toss in my 2 cents...

[snip]

I would avoid the standard angle block planes (everyones!) - we make 'em primarily because people ask for them, and schools often specify them.


Cheers -

Rob

I never enjoyed a standard angle block plane until an old, cheap and beat up #102 came along.

There have been a few very good standard angle block planes pass through my shop. Only the #102 has stayed. To me, most standard angle block planes are just bench planes without handles.

jtk

[Jim Koepke]

...

One other pc of advice: if you ever considered getting into the world of rehabbing old planes, then a Stanley 60 1/2 is a great place to start. They're ubiquitous in the used mkt, and you can make a great 'user' for probably half the price of a new LV or LN.

...

If you are going to go the used route, you may want to limit your choice to one made before WW II.

My thread on rehabbing block planes may be of interest.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...ocks&p=1246005

There is a little bit of information on the blade bedding area at the mouth.

To the best of my knowledge both the LV and LN planes have a larger bedding area at the mouth.

From my limited understanding of physics and resonance, having a larger bedding area will result in a more solid feel and less blade chatter. In a move toward economy, this area was reduced on Stanley planes to lessen the machining needed when making block planes.

In my shop, there are six block planes. Three of them are of the #60/60-1/2 size. One of those is the LN #60-1/2. I have considered selling the Stanley models. I would not consider selling the LN unless for some reason I could not longer use it and no one in my family wanted to take it.

I imagine my feelings would be the same with an LV equivalent. I took a very serious look at the DX60. I was afraid it would make my wife jealous.

jtk

[Jim Neeley]

LMAO, Jim... Nonsense... It'll go perfectly with the new gold-and-diamond jewelry you (didn't know you'd) bought her!!!

[Joe Leigh]

Well I thought I would post a follow up on this thread. I received a LN 102 for Fathers Day and it has totally transformed the way I feel about hand planes. In a word, amazing. Right out of the box it cut better than any plane I have ever touched, but I wanted to do this plane justice. I had a couple of waterstones I purchased years back when I thought I could hone my own chisels and maybe some cheap stanley hand planes someone had given me. I lost interest quickly after some disappointing results.
So after much internet research and countless Rob Cosman videos I picked up a DMT duosharp 4 x 10 coarse plate and a Veritas MarkII guide to flatten my King 1200 and 8000 stones. A whole new world. After a proper honing that little block plane was singing sweetly....endless lengths of translucent wispy shavings. I am hooked. I can't put this little block plane down. I find myself constantly reaching for it to tweak a joint fit or polish a freshly ripped edge, and the quality of the surface left behind is so incredible that the thought of taking sandpaper to it would be an insult.
So I'm sold. I'm already planing my next LN purchase, probably a #4 Smoother followed by a #6 or #7 a few months after that to flatten the top of a Benchcrafted Shaker Bench that I am currently building.
To summarize, I couldn't be happier or more impressed with this plane. Thanks to all for the comments and suggestions!

[Joel Goodman]

Welcome to the slope!

[Bill Moser]

Lie Nielsen and Lee Valley are both great. They even have the same first names.

And the OP's last name is ... Leigh ... something very fishy going on here

But seriously, for a straight-up block plane, it's hard to beat the LN 60 1/2. The 60 1/2R is also great for tenon cheeks, as someone else mentioned. I also have a LN bronze skew rabbet, and the LV left-hand version. Both are great for end-grain and tenons. I have an LN 102 as well, and 'm with Rob here -- it doesn't get much use.

From an aesthetic point of view, I mostly prefer the LNs. Lie-Nielsen's philosophy seems to be: take a known, solid design, and reproduce it while finding ways to subtly improve it. I also really appreciate Lee Valley's innovative approach to tool design. I'm finding the set screws for side-to-side blade adjustment to be really useful, for example.

[Bob Warfield]

Joe -

You have a lot of good advice in here... I'll toss in my 2 cents...

Firstly - you can't go wrong with either choice. There are differences between the two LABP's - and one will feel better to you. Ours is wider - so people with smaller hands will prefer the narrower LN version.
Having said that - my favorite is the apron plane (ours or LN's).

I would avoid the standard angle block planes (everyones!)
Cheers -

Rob

The more I read these forums the more I am impressed with this company. Mr. Lee shows real class almost every time he posts something.

Thank You,
Bob Warfield

[Don Dorn]

While not a block plane issue, I recently found the need and asked advise about large shoulder planes of which I am essentially unfamiliar. I already knew both companies were comparible in quality and have product from both. The responses confirmed both were equal in quality but most nudged me to the LV for the modern ergonomics. As a result of that advise, I ordered a Large Veritas just a few minutes ago. This is a great forum with tremendous knowledge. I also like Lee Valley as a company and appreciate Mr. Lee's presence here.

[Trevor Walsh]

I have a Veritas apron plane, It was cheaper, and has flat sides for small shooting chores. However the bronze LN 102 is damned sexy. I have heard that bronze needs to be kept cleaner, otherwise a greenish tinge may be spread on the work. I wound up getting the LV because I was ordering a few other things from them at the time. Other than that, complete toss up.

[Jeff Hamilton Jr.]

I can't resist throwing in my 2c's as well. Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with any brand or store and I'm not even that good at WW'ing! But, I do love it, love buying tools and enjoy participating in this forum. I have (happily) given Mr. Lee alot of my $$ in exchange for his products - including block, BU series, shoulder, router and other planes. Likewise, though less so, I've parted w/ duckets for a few LN planes as well. All are excellent, excellent tools. I have a LV low-angle block and think it outstanding (to answer op's Q).However, the reason I respond is in regard to a few comments about WR V3. While I don't own a block, I did order one of their #3's (the only size beside 1 & 2 not in my arsenal), just for the fun of it and to see how it compared from a quality standpoint. Unlike the apparent experience of a few others, what I found was that the V3 was VERY close in quality to both LN & my beloved LV. The sole is dead-flat, the sides a perfect 90 and the knob and tote are quite outstanding. It did take me a bit longer to flatten the back of the blade, but not inordinately so. The blade adjustment mechanisms were not "machinist perfect" like LV, but do operate very smoothly with little or no backlash.In short, if it were not for my long-standing loyalty to LV because they've treated me outstandingly well over the years (not insinuating that the others haven't!), I wouldn't hesitate to buy a block or any of their WC's other plane offerings.

[Harvey Pascoe]

I just received my LV standard block plane and last night put it up against my LN block. I'd have to say the LV is overall superior. Blade adjustment is so much easier, both from the standpoint of depth and skew. I had to fiddle with the LN for five minutes before I could get a perfect .002 shaving whereas with the LV it only took one attempt. The blade adjustment is extremely fine and accurate. First I used it to clean up the planer marks on a piece of cherry; smoothed it out perfectly in no time. Next I tried it on waterfall bubinga, a hideously difficult wood. While I cant say it handled it with ease, I was able to smooth it out quickly by going cross grain. then taking the lightest possible cut with grain. With the LN I could not easily get a sufficiently fine blade depth to do this owing to the 2/3rd turn of slack in the adjuster, whereas with the LV it is less than 1/4 turn. This is a superb tool and the one I will reach for most often.