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Thread: Forget Cermark and Plaster of Paris, try this

  1. #1
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    Forget Cermark and Plaster of Paris, try this

    This flask, made of stainless chinesium, was sprayed with Dry Moly then rastered at 3% speed and 100% power, air assist and two passes. $7.00 for a spray can. Photo taken with webcam. No weird angles to alter the photo; it's a straight on shot.

    No amount of Glenfiddich Scotch was harmed in the marking of this hip flask.

    I just thought I'd share, since the SC has been so good to me.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Greg Bednar; 04-01-2011 at 10:30 PM. Reason: additional setting info
    Life and death don't bother me. It's that little period of time in between that bothers me.

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  2. #2
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    Greg
    Please say April Fool before I go out and invest in Dry Moly :-)
    Ed

  3. #3
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    No April fool joke - this is legit.
    Life and death don't bother me. It's that little period of time in between that bothers me.

    Epilog Mini-24 40w with Rotary, Flame Polisher, CorelDRAW Graphics Suite X6, Wacom Bamboo Pen & Touch, EngraveSoft, Windows Vista 64-bit, extremely small Hadron Collider

  4. #4

    Ok....

    OK....So what are the particulars? Brand, your prep/process, etc. I know you've got everyone's interest! please share!

    -bc
    Bruce Clumpner
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  5. #5
    So Greg, what ever made you try a lubricant to mark metal with your laser?
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  6. #6
    Very cool. I assume that you are actually sintering the molybdenum metal with the laser? It melts at 4750 degrees, so maybe there's something else going on. That makes you wonder what other materials might work like that.

    I will be experimenting to see if selective laser melting is possible in stainless steel or titanium powder with my new YAG laser. It would be very cool to be able to do 3D models in that fashion. It would take some fancy interfacing with a computer to actually have it all work, but it would be a wild ride.
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  7. #7
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    Bruce and Dee

    Ok Bruce, you want particulars.. The brand of the dry film moly lubricant is “Sprayon LU200”. I purchased it locally at a bearing shop. It should be available everywhere. The prep and process was simple.

    1. Purchase flask at World Market
    2. Place flask onto laser bed and manually focus. I split the difference between highest and lowest marking area on the curved flask.
    3. Remove flask from bed and start the prep.
    4. Use Isopropyl alcohol – 70% will do (NOT DNA)
    5. Saturate cotton ball with alcohol and clean parallel to the brush marks on the flask.
    6. Spray two coats of moly held about 4 inches from the surface. This particular brand is nice since it has a fine spray cap like Krylon. Very, very nice flat spray pattern.
    7. Allow lubricant to dry thoroughly!!
    8. Place flask onto laser bed. I kept my flask closed.
    9. Pick your artwork and send it to the laser with appropriate settings, in my case it was 600 DPI, 3% speed and 100% power, air assist ( yes I said air assist ) and two passes.
    10. Remove flask from laser and place in cleaning tub.
    11. Spray liberally with “Krud Kutter,” let sit for a couple minutes and use one of those sponge backed scrubbers usually reserved for removal of baked on food from dishes. ( I liberated mine from the kitchen and when asked if I saw it, I lied! )
    12. Again, use the scrubber in a parallel motion with the brush marks on the flask.

    Dee, - I have to be honest and say that after scouring the Internet, I came across a fellow named Jelle who works in the Netherlands who used it to mark his tools. He discovered it contained a high level of molybdenum disulfide with the usual carrier agents. The particular brand I used contains: Acetone, Butane, 2-Propanol, Propane, Heptane, and Mineral Spirits. Hence the “allow lubricant to dry thoroughly” warning.

    I thought if it was good enough for a stainless wrench, it should be good enough for a stainless steel flask. And it was!

    So I can not in all good conscience take credit for the discovery, just the share since I don't think Jelle is a member of SC. So thanks Jelle. His original blog post can be found here at
    h t t p : / / b l o g s . f a b f o l k . c o m / j e l l e / ? p = 3 6

    I hope I don't get spanked for the link.

    As usual – please use all I have shared at your own peril,........ uh risk that is.
    Last edited by Greg Bednar; 04-01-2011 at 11:48 PM.
    Life and death don't bother me. It's that little period of time in between that bothers me.

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  8. #8
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    You guys know this is the same stuff (molybdenum disulfide) that re-loaders use to lubricate bullets... you can get 5 oz of it for about 15 dollars. Mix it with some isobutyl alcohol and airbrush it on. I have to admit... when I learned what cermark was I looked for lab grade molybdenum powder and fount that it was really expensive. Never thought to look for something that would break down during heating and liberate pure molybdenum.

    On a side note I would be careful of this stuff I think by adding heat to this molecule it would peel off the sulfur side and the sulfur would almost certainly bond to any free water and make H2SO4... sulfuric acid, and you run the same risk as having HCL that comes from the PVC and vinyl in your machine. It may also void your warrantee, just saying...

    Aaak I seem to be rambling again...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Bednar View Post
    [*]Purchase flask at World Market[*]Place flask onto laser bed and manually focus. I split the difference between highest and lowest marking area on the curved flask.[*]Remove flask from bed and start the prep.[*]Use Isopropyl alcohol – 70% will do (NOT DNA)[*]Saturate cotton ball with alcohol and clean parallel to the brush marks on the flask.[*]Spray two coats of moly held about 4 inches from the surface. This particular brand is nice since it has a fine spray cap like Krylon. Very, very nice flat spray pattern.[*]Allow lubricant to dry thoroughly!![*]Place flask onto laser bed. I kept my flask closed.[*]Pick your artwork and send it to the laser with appropriate settings, in my case it was 600 DPI, 3% speed and 100% power, air assist ( yes I said air assist ) and two passes.[*]Remove flask from laser and place in cleaning tub.[*]Spray liberally with “Krud Kutter,” let sit for a couple minutes and use one of those sponge backed scrubbers usually reserved for removal of baked on food from dishes. ( I liberated mine from the kitchen and when asked if I saw it, I lied! )[*]Again, use the scrubber in a parallel motion with the brush marks on the flask.[/LIST]
    Or, wipe with dna, spray with Cermark, wipe with a wet sponge, write up your invoice. For me, the time it would take to go through all of your steps would pay, many times over, for the miniscule amount of Cermark that I use. Although I greatly appreciate finding an alternative to work with, the time taken to prep, apply, dry, laser and cleanup is not worth it. Considering I laser Cermark at 100% power and 15% speed, one pass, your 40 watt laser should be able to do it even faster, can't believe it takes 3% speed and two passes - sorry, not worth the trouble.
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  10. #10
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    Well I think you have made a fine mark on the item, finding alternatives which are much cheaper are a good thing for all laser engravers, keep up the good work.
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  11. #11
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    Thanks Tristan and Frank. When I get some scrap stainless steel, I'll increase the speed settings and see the speed limits of making a lasting mark. I didn't want to do my recommended 40/100 speed and turn the flask into, well,...... a crap looking flask. Thanks again.
    Life and death don't bother me. It's that little period of time in between that bothers me.

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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Bednar View Post
    No amount of Glenfiddich Scotch was harmed in the marking of this hip flask.
    Maybe not harmed, but how much was consumed?
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Walters View Post
    Maybe not harmed, but how much was consumed?
    Can you believe it? Not a single celebratory shot!! I must be slipping. Thanks for the wake up call.
    Life and death don't bother me. It's that little period of time in between that bothers me.

    Epilog Mini-24 40w with Rotary, Flame Polisher, CorelDRAW Graphics Suite X6, Wacom Bamboo Pen & Touch, EngraveSoft, Windows Vista 64-bit, extremely small Hadron Collider

  14. #14
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  15. #15
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    $22 per can? Wow .. I saw it somewhere for $60 for a case!

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