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Thread: Running 2 Machines off 1 Circuit ???

  1. #1
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    Question Running 2 Machines off 1 Circuit ???

    I have 2 machine that I would like to run off of one circuit. One is a 30 amp planer/moulder the other is 40 amp planer. I work by myself so both machine will never be operated @ the same time.

    I'm thinking that if I ran wiring for 40 amps to a breakout/kill box to run the planer, could I also run a leg to the moulder via breakout box that is fused @ 30 amps? It would be my desire to kill the power to the 30 amp box when the planer is in use and visa versa. I was hoping that the disconnect lever would accomplish this for me.

    My shop has not been permanetly wired yet so it would be just as easy to run seperate circuits and I have room in the subpanel. I'm just looking to conserve a few circuits to grow.

  2. #2
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    Hi run the feeder out to a splitter then run to two disconnect switches, one of them fused at 30 amperes.

    If the machines don't move, I would wire them directly to the disconnect switches............Regards, Rod.

  3. #3
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    First I would ask, as the equipment sits, what controls and protection are included with the machine?

    If the machine has protection for itself and on/off controls as it sits, then the 30A fuses are not required. The fuses are to protect the building wiring not the machine. The wire from the panel to the 40A planer needs to be sized for the 40A breaker installed (or in general, the wire gauge must correspond to the size breaker) in the main panel. Any additional wires on the same circuit will need to be of the same gauge, so the 30A fuses will just be an unneeded extra expense.

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    I agree with Anthony. I know that every electrician will deride me for this, but I use the same plug on every 220 v machine I have and they all plug into the same 30 amp outlet (yes, just one). It's not as big a hassle as I originally worried it would be. I have yet to burn out a motor.

    Ryan

  5. The first thing that pops into my head is to confirm that these are 30 and 40 amp planers. That's 5 and 7 hp, respectively, which is OK, but should not automatically be assumed. Yes, you can run these both off a single circuit rated for the largest of the two.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Whitesell View Post
    First I would ask, as the equipment sits, what controls and protection are included with the machine?

    If the machine has protection for itself and on/off controls as it sits, then the 30A fuses are not required. The fuses are to protect the building wiring not the machine. The wire from the panel to the 40A planer needs to be sized for the 40A breaker installed (or in general, the wire gauge must correspond to the size breaker) in the main panel. Any additional wires on the same circuit will need to be of the same gauge, so the 30A fuses will just be an unneeded extra expense.
    Anthony, from what I have read in both owners manual and looking @ both machine there are thermal overloads only. Actually the the G1033 states not to overfuse the machine. Of course all the wiring will be the correct size for the intended breaker.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Christopherson View Post
    The first thing that pops into my head is to confirm that these are 30 and 40 amp planers. That's 5 and 7 hp, respectively, which is OK, but should not automatically be assumed. Yes, you can run these both off a single circuit rated for the largest of the two.
    The G1033 asks for a 30 amp circuit for a 3 hp motor. The Woodmaster 612 asks for a 40 amp circuit with a 5 hp motor.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Nelson1 View Post
    The G1033 asks for a 30 amp circuit for a 3 hp motor. The Woodmaster 612 asks for a 40 amp circuit with a 5 hp motor.
    If this is case, then these are the minimums for the circuit for each machine. There should be no problem running the G1033 on a 40amp circuit. Have you priced the cost difference for the a second 40A outlet wire and outlet pigtailed from the first versus running "30A" wire (10g I believe), breaker, and outlet?

    That made the difference for me between running 6 long 20A runs from my main panel versus one 100A long run and 6 short ones. I had everything but the wire on hand, so the cost difference in the wire made all the difference. The 6 long 20A 12/2 copper runs were cheaper than the 100A 0g Al run.

  9. #9
    Is there a NEC code number on this that you can refer me to? I have a similar question. I asked Doug Palmer about codes recently in a post but he doesn't pop up very often. Some codes make sense, some don't to me. Also on the net one never knows if the poster is just guessing or is certified. Most EE's know zip about electrical codes so I have no idea why some say they are a EE.

    Our house had wiring down by a licensed Pro that I had worked with in Ca. Flew him in just to check the work since there is no code or inspectors here. So now when I buy a new machine I just plug it in if the breaker and wire are sized properly. I am a bit suspicious this is not the thing to do on some machines. I like motor fuses in a disconnect box on some machines because it makes sense to me but can't find out if that even meets code. As a note" motor fuses" are a very special fuse only for motors. Ground fault plugs were mentioned here. Our bathrooms etc have them but not anything else. Would it be a good idea to install them in the shop? NEC seems to require them now in the whole house. Years ago I bought a NEC book but was lost real quick.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Rowland View Post
    Is there a NEC code number on this that you can refer me to? I have a similar question. I asked Doug Palmer about codes recently in a post but he doesn't pop up very often. Some codes make sense, some don't to me. Also on the net one never knows if the poster is just guessing or is certified. Most EE's know zip about electrical codes so I have no idea why some say they are a EE.

    Our house had wiring down by a licensed Pro that I had worked with in Ca. Flew him in just to check the work since there is no code or inspectors here. So now when I buy a new machine I just plug it in if the breaker and wire are sized properly. I am a bit suspicious this is not the thing to do on some machines. I like motor fuses in a disconnect box on some machines because it makes sense to me but can't find out if that even meets code. As a note" motor fuses" are a very special fuse only for motors. Ground fault plugs were mentioned here. Our bathrooms etc have them but not anything else. Would it be a good idea to install them in the shop? NEC seems to require them now in the whole house. Years ago I bought a NEC book but was lost real quick.
    No disrespect Aaron, but what the heck are you talking about?

  11. #11
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    Aaron, you may to overthinking this. The reason both your machines specify such large amp circuits is so the breaker won't pop due to start up current. If the machines have internal overload protection that is all you need to do- plug them into the 40 amp circuit. If you don't believe the smaller machine is protected, you want a cutoff box with a time delay fuse that allows for the inrush but protects against prolonged over current. A 20 amp time delay would be appropriate for the 3 hp and 25 or 30 for the 5hp-assuming single phase. Dave

  12. #12
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    As David indicated, the G1033 states that it shouldn't be connected to larger than a 30 ampere circuit.

    If the manufacturer provides specific overcurrent protection information, it supersedes code requirements.

    In this case the G1033 will require a fused disconnect switch, with 30 ampere fuses.

    My 4 HP jointer/planer and saw/shaper have a similar requirement for overcurrent protection to not exceed 20 amperes.

    Regards, Rod.

  13. #13
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    I think I understand the confusion with Aaron and part of David's questions. The NEC (typically, because I don't know all the NEC sections) covers building wiring requirements not the requirements for the wiring of equipment. The UL regulations come into play for the wiring and safety systems pertaining to equipment. There is some overlap when the equipment is to be hard or direct wired to the building, as in the case of large AC units, heat pumps, and large equipment typically where plugs are not feasible or pose a hazard.

    So Aaron's statement of "disconnect box on machines...but can't find out if it meets code" likely stems from it not being an NFPA code, but a UL reg.

    P.S. As for us EEs, we say we are EEs because that's what the diploma says. It's not our fault that power engineering is now only a 2 credit power work course instead of a hands on class. There are a lot of non-electrician non-EEs that know the codes. So it works both ways. (just funnin' with ya)

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Hellmer View Post
    I agree with Anthony. I know that every electrician will deride me for this, but I use the same plug on every 220 v machine I have and they all plug into the same 30 amp outlet (yes, just one). It's not as big a hassle as I originally worried it would be. I have yet to burn out a motor.

    Ryan
    I'm set up exactly the same way except for my two three phase machines that are hard wired.
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  15. #15
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    Thanks for clearing that up for me Anthony. Whew thought I was losing it for a minute! At this point I think I'll run 8/3 THHN or the non PVC equivalent jacketed in the flexible conduit to a plain Jane junction box. Run two feeds from that box. One to a fusible box the other to a outlet box with a dryer/welder outlet. The woodmaster has something that resemble one of those 2 plugs. From what I have seen on the internet I can feel my wallet getting bout $300 bucks lighter. Now I have to go see my local electrical supply house.

    I really was hoping to be able to kill one of the box while the other was in use, but it an unnecessary expense in a one man shop.

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