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Thread: canoe

  1. #1

    canoe

    I have a fiberglass canoe, with wood seats and wood around the top lip. This top piece has rotted out, due to neglect and weather. Will post a pic latter for clarification. My question what wood do I need to use to replace this piece? second is what is the best way to finish this wood?

    I want to try to fix this canoe. It was given from a friend that passed away, as a wedding gift. It was starting to break then in 2000, And I just let it go due to no knowledge if it could be fixed.


    Thanks in advanced.

  2. #2
    I like Alaska Cedar for this purpose and would specify Heartwood with Sikkens Cetol for a finish, most Marine suppliers should have it.

    Mac
    Last edited by Mac McQuinn; 06-25-2012 at 3:33 PM.

  3. #3
    Ok, my renovated kevlar canoe has ash gunnels, mahogany decks, and cherry seats and thwarts. Ash is traditional for the gunnels because it is strong and flexible. The decks are any rot resistant wood. Mahogany was fun, but cedar or teak would also work well. Thwarts and seats are probably traditionally ash, but can be anything. The gunnels and decks are usually finished with a penetrating oil such as Watco. Seats and thwarts are usually spar varnished. Plan on giving the decks and gunnels a quick rub down with oil once in the spring and once in the fall.

  4. #4
    here are the photos of the canoe. It looks worse then it is.










  5. #5
    It's going to take some work although if structure is solid, it should be a rewarding project. With some of the old wood for patterns along with existing mounting holes in hull, this should be relatively easy to accomplish. Some cleaning of the hull along with polishing of the gel-coat should make the boat presentable again. Looks like a nice project, good luck.
    Mac

  6. #6
    thanks for the information, and the encouragement. I will post as the project moves along. Starting to source wood in my area.

  7. #7
    Wood is not a good material for gunnels if the boat is stored out of doors. If you can't store the boat under cover, you should probably come up with some composite approach.

  8. #8
    Kevin, we usually used Ash to make the kind of repairs that your looking at making here, and it looks as if it was Ash that was used origionally. As for the seats, what we use for the webbing is the seatbelts out of cars or trucks and cross weave it. If you use these materials to make the repairs, they will last for a very long time. Another item that you should use for making these repairs, is stainless steel screws the brass ones break off to easily and the stainless won't rust or stain the wood. Years ago we used to build cedar strip canoes and kayaks to sell, we did repairs to other types of canoes for a few people who didn't mind paying for the work. To do the repairs to this canoe it would take a couple of days and it would probably cost around three to three hundred and fifty dollars. That would include all of the materials and a good cleaning and waxing. Another thing I would like to mention to you and it is if this canoe was tippy before when you used it, now is the time to fix that. All you have to do is to lower the seats down a little lower into the boat, this will lower your center of gravity and make the canoe allot more stable. Good luck with this project, it looks like you've got a little cutie there that wants to help.
    Len

  9. #9
    Kevin I forgot to mention this, but, if we didn't have the Ash at the time we would use Yellow Birch. Actually some people requested that we use it on their canoes, and for a finish on the gunwhales and all other wooden parts, we used the two part clear resin that was used to cover the Cedar strips with. It is similar to what you'd get if you were to purchase a fiberglas repair kit, but it doesn't turn yellow over time like the fiberglas resin does. We use to purchase it in 45 gallon drums and it wasn't cheap as you had to buy both parts A&B at the same time. It has been a few years since I since we've built our last one, and just because of price we won't be building anymore of them. Simply because people didn't want to pay the price that we needed to cover our costs, but there are about twenty of them still out there in use. And most of them still look as good as the day they were built, and all of them were used.
    Len

  10. #10
    Rodrick. Would the composite materal be strog enough? That I have several sources for deck and wood materals.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Churchton, MD
    Posts
    63
    I have replaced the rails -inside and outside on a Mad River canoe. Don't underestimate this repair. The gunwales provide strength to the canoe hull as well as anchoring the seats. They must conform to compound curves. Within those constraints, weight is an issue - you want max strength, max rot resistance, and min weight. Yes use stainless fasteners. Also consider a caulk seal between rail and hull (it is extra work to tape and do it right but the rot on my rails started by capillary action on the rail-hull interface as well as around the fasteners.). Ash is traditional being a trade off between weight and strength. Ash varnishes well. Repairing and anchoring your seats will take some planning. In my opinion, if you are going to expend the time and effort on this then do the seats properly. Forget the lawn chair, safety belt type webbing. Cain the seats properly. It is not that difficult, and the materials are inexpensive. As suggested prior, definitely lower the seats. In my canoe the seats are anchored within the rails, and then stainless rods lower the seats down like six inches. You might still be able to buy ash rails from one of the canoe makers like Mad River. Having made my own previously, I would recommend looking into buying factory made stuff (shipping is special and you would need to pickup at a sales outlet). Lastly, the rails provide an anchor for the bow and stern decks as well as cross thwarts which are used to carry the canoe so they must also be strong. The repair is worth doing right because the canoe will glide under your paddle like never before.

  12. #12
    That's easy peasy. Go to a good canoe store and they can order you a new set of gunnels. For the thwarts and seats I went to eds Canoe. (http://www.edscanoe.com/). I put in fitted mahogany decks (yours are plastic), I got the angle right, then used a bull-nose router bit to rout it out so that it nestled into the gunnels. slightly longer screws hold the deck into the gunnels. Use only stainless steel screws to connect the gunnels together. I think eds canoe has a lot of the stainless steel parts you will need.

    You need to get the gunnels from a canoe store because they are some 19 feet long, and you will pay a fortune in shipping unless you can get them to throw them in with a canoe shipment.

    Before I installed the gunnels I wiped them down with a thick coat of Watco oil. After I installed them I did it again. I now wipe them down twice a year, and make sure that they are stored under plastic.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    ft walton beach, fl
    Posts
    228
    Good spar (not polyurethane) varnish is best for covering the gunnels etc. Spar varnish is more flexible and will better protect those parts that flex in use. The existing seats look like rawhide which can be replaced. You could not weave those seats with cane as is, the holes are too far apart. It would be possible to cane them by routing a groove and installing pre-woven cane but the holes would still be apparent.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Shorewood, WI
    Posts
    897
    I use ash as a readily available strong material for gunwales. I've also used the lighter sitka spruce, but that's no longer so readily available. You can splice shorter stock if you can't find it full length: a scarf joint with an 8:1 slope is plenty strong when glued with epoxy.

    I fit the gunwales, including all shaping and screws, then remove them for finishing. I use a thin boatbuilding epoxy (System Three Clear Coat is my favorite) that soaks into all surfaces, including the insides of screw holes. (You can use a test piece to make sure your epoxy is thin enough that you'll be able to reinstall screws after cure. I don't recommend putting the screws in before epoxy cure, because then the gunwales can't be removed without destruction. If you want gunwales like this, just use epoxy and no screws to install the gunwales.) After cure, several coats of UV protective varnish cover the epoxy, but varnish does not need to go in the screw holes.

    Now the wood will be well protected after installation, particularly tight spots that hold water. However, abrasion can let in water, so you need to keep the finish in reasonable shape.

  15. #15
    Ash is definitely the way to go in my experience. Not a hard job - just take your time.

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