Timber Frame Workshop (and house...)

[Todd Burch]

Just about any kind of tractor, I suppose.

I suspect more timber frames were put up without tractors than with tractors.

I have more time (God willing) than $, so I can sit back and think about how to I want to approach all aspects of this. Lots of options other than tractors to move and lift. Gin poles, derricks… blocks and tackle, levers, probably others. Maybe even a large treadwheel pulley… now THAT would be a hoot! People would work for free just for the fun of doing it.

[John K Jordan]

Right now, the decision is between a band mill ($) and a swing blade ($$$$).

Quite interesting thread. I didn't finish all of it but will later. I live in a timber frame house (on 27 acres) that someone else built around 1988 - I love it. As i sit here I glance up at 6x6 joists supported by an 8x12 beam supported by 8x8 posts on either end of the room. Life is good!

A friend of mine wanted to build one like you - very long story short he finally got it done with timbers dredged out of one of the great lakes and with a few cherry logs from his property high across the great room. Looks great! Although he wanted to do it all himself, he hired a crew from somewhere in the northeast - it went up very quickly. However, the conventional and trim and finishing took years... It looks like something from a magazine now, inside and out!

As for the sawmill, years ago I bought one of the smaller Woodmizer manual mills (LT15), not for timber frame but for general farm use. The manual mills are FAR cheaper than the powered mills but will cut the same timber. You basically crank or gently push the carriage while walking down the length. (Good exercise!) The tradeoff is time - it will take longer with the manual mill but I had more time than money.

There is no tradeoff in timber length - I added one extra track section and can cut 17' logs. For longer, add another section.

The real limitation for me is the size of the log. Mine will supposedly slice up a 28" diameter log BUT the process for that size is very tricky. Worse, the handling of big logs is a real test. I usually load logs with 30" skidding tongs hung from hooks welded to the FEL bucket of the tractor. My Kubota will not lift all the logs I want to mill. I got around that in two ways - first I built up a ramp and rolled the logs onto the mill, pushing with my tractor. Second, I bought a used skid-steer (John Deer) which can lift a far heavier log.

Even after the log is loaded, the fun continues. The hydraulic ($$$) mills will grab and turn the cant but I turn large cants by hand or with tractor assist. I've had some that took two people to turn.

Swing vs band? I couldn't even consider a swing mill ($$$) but I understand it is amazing for dimensional lumber, and no practical log diameter limitation. I assume it will work for beams and such, but don't know. I do know I can easily cut any size beam I could possibly use with my little Woodmizer. The 15 hp gas engine on my mill will slice anything I've tried, big oak, hickory, persimmon, pine.

Bottom line, a manual mill will do the job at much less cost but more time and effort. Once the job is done, it is wonderful to have around for even occasional use. I imagine to justify keeping a big hydraulic mill one would have to be either rich or go into the sawing business. Neither for me!

JKJ

[Todd Burch]

Thanks for the encouraging post John. There are warm fuzzies ALL OVER your post! Good wisdom too.

Todd

[Todd Burch]

...
My plan is to downsize all the extra tools and such I have collected over the years, and raise $20K to buy a personal sawmill and related equipment. $20K might not buy it all, but it will be a start, and my workshop will sure feel better without having to step over stuff every time I walk through it.

Progress report… after about 1.5 weeks, I'm just about at 10% of my goal, and I can't tell anything has let the shop yet.

[Tom Hyde]

Hi Todd,

I'm probably one of the few who can say "been there, done that" ....

Great, great advice and insight (and first time I've heard of some of those issues with SIPs). I came close to doing the same, even had an architect with a timber frame company draw the plans and an engineer stamp them, and, like Todd, got a $100,000 quote for just the frame as well. But in the end I thought better of it and built a very nice small stick-built house. And no, not all the baseboards are in yet. I also built a decent shop. And a 500 square foot cedar pergola/grape arbor ... All for less than the cost of the original house design (including the Euro workshop tools). Okay, let's be honest, I'm still working on the grape arbor.

What changed my mind? I decided to tackle the Jack Sobon shed first (and I've seen the finished one at the Shaker Village). Amazing what a kick in the aft reality check that "simple" little project was. Even went Neanderthal on quite a bit of it. That convinced me that a full house was well beyond my means, skill and patience. Nothing but respect for those who have built their own timber frame home or shop because I have some small insight into what that actually means.

[Val Kosmider]

Thank you for hanging a number on the proposed building. I was thinking that the 2400 square foot "shop" was going to run about $200,000 as pictured, and could easily run up towards $300,000 at $125 finished foot when he talked about adding "some living space". I have always thought that P&B and Log Construction ran about 25% more costly that traditional stick built, and yet people seem to gravitate toward it as a "way to save money." Hmmm....????

This is an old thread...and for perhaps obvious reasons, it died under the weight of the OP's budget.

[Todd Burch]

Thread is old, but not dead. Like me.

[Tom Hyde]

Whoops, how did I do that?!? Look twice, post once.

[Todd Burch]

Well, many tools have been sold, and I still can't walk around in my shop. Methinks I have more selling to do. But, the good news is that the sawmill has been purchased, and even operated for a test drive, and now I'm planning my construction timeline. Timeline is pretty simple right now:

1) Get plans for a pole, stick or metal building in the 1500-2400 sq ft range to house the mill, the cut timbers, and build it on the cheap.
2) Gets plans for a timber frame, and build it on the cheap.

I would like to complete #1 before spring 2016. After timber frame is done, #1 building will perform multiple duties as a spray finishing area, project assembly area, storage area, service area for machines/tractors, etc.

[Mike Heidrick]

Are you thinking insulated pole barn with concrete floor or just steel and gravel?

[Chris Padilla]

Still chugging along with this, Todd!! Cool. Maybe one day it will actually happen, eh? LOL

[Ian Moone]

Great idea!.
Have done similar within my life time and considering doing it again (Eldest lad).
At 56 I ain't looking forward to the hard graft (Again).

One thing you MAY have to consider depending where you build and the supervising local govt authority (Building inspector / engineer) is that I THINK these days you won't pass muster unless your timber is professionally structurally graded & stamped accordingly.

Worked 20 odd years with my late Father who was a master builder. WE would build out of green hardwood... a long established practice & had a portable mill (and kiln & timber factory etc) but I don't know that we could repeat what we did, building the factory for e.g. because unless your qualified and registered etc for structural grading of lumber - how do you get your own lumber graded and stamped so the building inspector can see it when he inspects the construction?

It's the age old story with red tape & bureaucracy these days - that if you don't get all the permits and inspections etc and every square is ticked - you can't secure a mortgage over the dwelling at the bank and so on and so forth.

Its just a little harder these days to 'self build' in some respects.

Again this may depend on the location and how stringent the local authorities are.

[Bob Cooper]

From my very limited experience you may not have to have the timberframe stamped. I really worried about this when I built my house. I bought the TF from a big TF company and discussed this with them and they said it is typically not needed. I also used about 10 12x12 oak posts from the property and the inspector never asked. Ask around though in your area

[Todd Burch]

Are you thinking insulated pole barn with concrete floor or just steel and gravel?

Concrete floor, no insulation. I've been doing more research on metal buildings. They seem to be inexpensive up front, but in the long run, perhaps more expensive. One thing that you are doing is finishing out the inside of your building (to the max!). If I were to be doing that too, I might go with metal. But, since I really am just looking for a shell, I'm really leaning towards a wood building. I don't want the condensation or noise issues of a metal shell.

Still chugging along with this, Todd!! Cool. Maybe one day it will actually happen, eh? LOL

Slow but steady… I'll get there.

One thing you MAY have to consider depending where you build and the supervising local govt authority (Building inspector / engineer) is that I THINK these days you won't pass muster unless your timber is professionally structurally graded & stamped accordingly….

Where I am, no building inspector, no code, no authorities over my shoulder. Life is good in the country.

From my very limited experience you may not have to have the timberframe stamped. I really worried about this when I built my house. I bought the TF from a big TF company and discussed this with them and they said it is typically not needed. I also used about 10 12x12 oak posts from the property and the inspector never asked. Ask around though in your area

No stamping required. You really went big on your posts! I guess the motto could be… when in doubt - go big!!

[Mike Heidrick]

I had it unheated or cooled this whole past year and had no condensation issues. The building was bubble wrapped is all. I get noise really only when it rains. Just an idea. Added $500 to the cost for 40X64X16 wrapped. If you want just a shell I think that is where the steel does excel.

As to the concrete - add a few hundred and at least put in pex in the concrete. You may not want to heat it today but it will be there if you ever do. blueridgecompany sells pole barn kits of pex and a manifold and the ties and a tool.

Just some ideas.