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Thread: Trotec Speedy 300 Pricing: Trade Show vs. Sawmill Creek Pricing

  1. #1

    Trotec Speedy 300 Pricing: Trade Show vs. Sawmill Creek Pricing

    Greetings fellow Creekers.

    I'm currently in the market for a laser and have been pricing laser systems through Trotec, Epilog, and ULS. This post is a factual narrative about my experience thus far with Trotec regarding pricing. The purpose of this post is to discuss laser pricing using the Sawmill Creek discount vs. Trade Show pricing. I intend not to impart my opinion on the pricing, nor will I discuss any pricing that I have specifically been asked not to share.

    I asked Keith Outten via PM if posting pricing information would be ok. He said it would be fine as long as the information was factual and as long as I would not be sharing any confidential information.

    I contacted Amie McGee (Sawmill Creek rep) via voice mail on 9/20/2012. As she was at the PA trade show, she was unable to return my call until the morning of 9/26. She took my information and delivered it to my local sales rep for a price quote.

    The Sawmill Creek price quote I received is below:

    Sawmill Creek Price

    Speedy 300 with 60 watt tube: $25,950
    80 watt tube upgrade: $2,000
    Honeycomb Cutting Table: $500
    Air Assist: $795
    Delivery: $450
    Total: $29,695

    PA Trade Show Price

    Speedy 300 with 80 watt tube: $22,900
    80 watt tube upgrade: Included
    Honeycomb Cutting Table: Included
    Air Assist: Included
    Delivery: $500
    Total: $23,400

    While I don't have a physical copy of the pricing offered at the PA show, I have confirmed through multiple sources the pricing that was offered and accepted by Trotec.

    Difference: $6295 in favor of pricing at a trade show.

    Here is the initial Speedy 300 price quote I received with Sawmill Creek pricing:


    Trotec Speedy 300 Pricing.jpg

    Here is the initial Speedy 100 price quote I received with Sawmill Creek pricing:

    Trotec Speedy 100 Pricing.jpg

    I contacted Amie a second time about pricing out a Rayjet 300, but she did not return the call and instead had my local rep call me back. The Sawmill Creek pricing of the Rayjet 300 @ 60 watts was exactly the same as the Speedy 100 @ 40 watts.

    I've been working with my local sales rep on the pricing of a Speedy 100. Although the price point I'm currently at is better than the initial price quote (I've been asked not to publish the revised quote), it appears I may have to stop the negotiations and attend a trade show to receive the best pricing.

    Does anyone have any advice to help me get the best price? I'm starting this out as a hobby with hopes of turning this into a business in the future.

  2. #2
    Sadly, this is a game all the laser companies play. Because there is no listed price for any of the manufacturers and everything is individually negotiated, it makes people very tentative to share information about pricing.

    The price you pay is the trade show price or no price at all. You don't need to attend a trade show to get the pricing. Just tell them to give you the price. If they won't, just let them know you'll post your negative experience on here. There is no reason why someone who went to a trade show should save $6300.
    Equipment: IS400, IS6000, LS100, HP4550 Laser Sublimator
    Software: Adobe Suite & Gravostyle 5
    Business: Trophy, Awards and Engraving

  3. #3
    In the past I have tried to make major purchases at trade show time. This is a great way to save a few dollars!
    Trade Shows, I've found usually offer the best discounts. If you have one close to you, you may negotiate on the
    floor model and save the shipping costs.
    Martin Boekers

    2 Epilog Legend EXT36 75watt Lasers
    Geo Knight K20S 16x20 Heat Press
    Geo Knight K Mug Press,
    Ricoh GX-7000 Dye Sub Printer
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    numerous other tools and implements
    of distruction/distraction!

  4. #4
    When I first approached Trotec, it was via their website. I had not received any reply to my pricing inquiry (not uncommon based on other posts in the forum) so I contacted Keith on SMC to get the SMC Trotec Vendor Rep contact information (Amie McGee). I had hopes that by going through Amie I could secure reasonable pricing; high hopes in fact due to the work Keith has done to get Sawmill Creek members a discount. While Amie was very knowledgeable and a pleasure to speak with, she didn't go into pricing and instead handed me off to a local vendor rep. It's the local vendor rep who provided the price quotes attached above. In subsequest discussions with Keith, the normal process would have been to call Amie, get pricing, & order the system; working with the local vendor rep would have occurred after the order was placed.

    While I contacted Amie via voice mail the day the show started, she didn't get back to me until three days after the show (which is understandable), but didn't offer show pricing. It would have went a long way for her to have said "Here's the pricing we were offering at the show. Even though the show is over, I'd be happy to sell you a system at those prices." (By the way, I did send her both her and my local rep an email to give them a chance to respond.)

    I can certainly understand why people don't want to discuss pricing. No one wants to feel like they've paid too much, and no one wants others to feel bad because others didn't get as good of a price. My purpose in posting is to share the information so that others don't ever feel like they are getting taken. In my case, it would have been to the tune of $6000 had my budget been willing to spend that much.

    What's unfortunate is that the people who can't attend a show won't necessarily have the opportunity to pay the show pricing.
    Last edited by Ronald Erickson; 10-06-2012 at 4:19 PM. Reason: Sentence structure corrections

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Erickson View Post
    What's unfortunate is that the people who can't attend a show won't necessarily have the opportunity to pay the show pricing.
    I've been going to trade shows for over 25 years in some trade or another. Been going to sign trade shows for 4-5 years now. I can say with 100% certainty that trade show pricing is always better and I can also say that trade show pricing is almost always good at the show and not much past it.

    I've tried to play hardball with companies in the past about getting the tradeshow price and I've lost more times than I have won.

    Just for the record, all manufacturers offer trade show pricing and we're on our 3rd laser, 3rd brand and I can say with all 3 of those, trade show pricing is always less expensive, but if you're not at the show, you're not going to get trade show pricing. It's just the way it works. You might not like it or agree with it, but it happens at just about every booth at the show.

    JDS, Johnson, all of those people offer trade show discounts. Call 2 weeks after the show and ask for that discount. You won't get it.

    In the end, buying a laser is like buying a car. If you let someone else do the negotiating for you, then you get what you put into it. If you negotiate yourself, you've done all you can do.

    We paid $3,000-4,000 more for our Epilog than others did because we didn't know any better. Lesson learned.
    Trotec Speedy 300 75W Universal PLS4.60 with Rotary Attachment
    HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer
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    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  6. #6
    I asked for Trotec pricing and run times for specific designs in roughly Feb., I am still waiting for their reply and that was speaking directly to Aime McGee. Called Epilog after a month of waiting on Trotec and my old rep was at my door the next day.

    While I was to busy to attend the Las Vegas show, my rep called me knowing what I wanted and gave me the show pricing on my machine. From the tech and sales support I don't ever see any reason for my business to look beyond Epilog.

    Just my two cents on it all
    Epilog Helix 60 watt, Epilog 36EXT 75 watt, Rotary Attachment, 3 Jaw Chuck Rotary Attachment, Prs Alpha Shopbot, Photobrasive Laser Mask, Rayzist 1924 Blast Cabinet, Harbor Freight Blast Cabinet for the Larger Items, SR3000 Resist, Epson 1400 Printer, 2 Paragon Glass Kilns, Covington Wet Belt Sander/Polisher, 2 JDS Air Filtration Units, 14" Stone Saw, and A Few Other Things I Forgot About!

  7. #7
    I had a similar experience trying to deal with Trotec sales when I was shopping for my Laser, I could never get the guy to call back, and the pricing stunk. ULS didn't even want to negotiate. In frustration I posted questions on this forum, the next day the President of Epilog called me, offered me a SUBSTANTIAL savings on a 50W laser and I immediately put in my order. So far I'm happy with my purchase.
    Ernie Martinez
    Marco Island Florida
    Epilog Mini 24 50W
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  8. #8
    Wow Braden, that sounds like you have a very responsive Epilog rep. I initiated discussions with Epilog the same time as I did with Trotec. Epilog was quick to send out the promotional materials and I received local contact information right away. My local Epilog rep (30 min away) has responded to every email I've sent and has sent me a complete pricing list for every machine and option. While the pricing is "list prices" so to speak, it gives me a point of reference. He's invited me multiple times to come in to his shop to demo his machines. Thus far I've held off because I personally like the design of the Trotec machines. I'll most likely send him an email to inquire on the show pricing in Las Vegas to see how he responds.


    It certainly sounds like an opportunity for improvement with customer attentiveness and satisfaction.

    I appreciate the feedback and details of your personal experience.
    Last edited by Mike Null; 10-10-2012 at 7:21 AM. Reason: at R Erickson's request

  9. #9
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    While I understand all the emotions involved, we don't buy equipment for our business based on emotions, we base it on what machine fits our needs best. I don't understand the logic of "they didn't call me back so I bought the one that did call me back". If you're buying something for a hobby, I understand that, but if you're buying it for a business, then call twice, call 3 times, get in the car and drive somewhere to see it. If it's the best for your business, then some times you need to do what it takes to get it there. That's the sad reality of most everything today. Been out to eat lately? Found anyone that actually cares about your dining experience to wait on you? You'd think in todays economy, people would be doing all they can to call back and service potential customers, but it's just the facts that they aren't. There are stories on here about Epilog (need I tell my story again how my sales rep finally bought back our machine because it wasn't working right-only took him 8 months to make that move), there are stories about ULS and also Trotec.

    Trotec has had a reputation of not calling back that well over the years, but it's been complained about many times by many people to people at Trotec, and they've made huge strides as far as I know. Not perfect, but they are getting far better.
    Trotec Speedy 300 75W Universal PLS4.60 with Rotary Attachment
    HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer
    ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router, Ricoh Dye Sublimation Printer
    Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter, Xenetech XOT 13 x 13 Rotary Engraver, Corel X5, Adobe Creative Cloud

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Shepherd View Post
    I don't understand the logic of "they didn't call me back so I bought the one that did call me back". If you're buying something for a hobby, I understand that, but if you're buying it for a business, then call twice, call 3 times, get in the car and drive somewhere to see it. If it's the best for your business, then some times you need to do what it takes to get it there.
    For me, it's pretty simple and this applies to any company I deal with: If a company doesn't respond to inquiries about their products, I'm not going to keep making inquires; I'm going to move on to a more receptive company who IS responsive. Their business is to sell their products. If they aren't receptive to selling to me, then I'm not receptive to buying from them. There's no emotion involved with my decision to stop trying to get product information, in this case from ULS.

    Sometimes a business may not actually know what it needs. That's the time a product vendor should be stepping up to assess and fill the needs of your business. If you know exactly what your business needs and it is only being offered by one particular vendor (aka a monopoly), then it certainly may be worth the time to aggressively pursue the non-responsive business to purchase their products.

    As an example, If a customer approaches you with a job and you don't respond, do you believe the customer should continue to approach you two, three, or four times because it is best for them? Most likely they would not and you would have lost the opportunity to do business. Do it enough and you'll either learn from the experience and become more responsive, or you'll lose business to others. Money doesn't care who earns it.

    I am hopeful that I'm not coming across as complaining. My intent is to share my experiences with others so that they may be better informed when making their purchase decisions.

  11. #11
    The laser industry is a bit screwy with sales. They forward all inquiries to regional salesmen and they respond back at their earliest convenience. After they make the sale and do the initial demo, you will probably only need to speak with your sales person a couple of times after. After that, you probably know more about the machine then they do, and any problems you have you will direct to customer service. You don't call the person you bought your Ford from about a braking issue, do you?

    As far as pricing, trade show pricing is a gimmick. There is no reason why it shouldn't be given to anyone and everyone. It's up to you to put enough pressure on to get the pricing. Maybe they won't give it to you for $23,500 but there is absolutely no reason to pay $30,000 because you didn't happen to go to some random trade show. I'd play hardball and if they won't budge, go over their head. Once you get into upper management, they'll more often then not make the deal happen. They don't care about the commission and they know if they were able to afford to sell the machine for $23,500 one week, they'll be able to sell it for the same price the next.
    Equipment: IS400, IS6000, LS100, HP4550 Laser Sublimator
    Software: Adobe Suite & Gravostyle 5
    Business: Trophy, Awards and Engraving

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Erickson View Post
    For me, it's pretty simple and this applies to any company I deal with: If a company doesn't respond to inquiries about their products, I'm not going to keep making inquires; I'm going to move on to a more receptive company who IS responsive. Their business is to sell their products. If they aren't receptive to selling to me, then I'm not receptive to buying from them. There's no emotion involved with my decision to stop trying to get product information, in this case from ULS.
    I NEVER chase salespeople to give them my money. If they want to sell a machine/product/service that I'm in the market for, They better return my call, or I also move on.. Re-calling someone time and time again without a response shows they clearly don't want your business, and I simply don't have the time to waste chasing them, waving a fist full of cash they obviously don't want.
    Epilog 24TT(somewhere between 35-45 watts), CorelX4, Photograv(the old one, it works!), HotStamping, Pantograph, Vulcanizer, PolymerPlatemaker, Sandblasting Cabinet, and a 25 year collection of Assorted 'Junque'

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  13. #13
    Great point Ross
    Quote Originally Posted by Ross Moshinsky View Post
    The laser industry is a bit screwy with sales. They forward all inquiries to regional salesmen and they respond back at their earliest convenience. After they make the sale and do the initial demo, you will probably only need to speak with your sales person a couple of times after. After that, you probably know more about the machine then they do, and any problems you have you will direct to customer service. You don't call the person you bought your Ford from about a braking issue, do you?

    As far as pricing, trade show pricing is a gimmick. There is no reason why it shouldn't be given to anyone and everyone. It's up to you to put enough pressure on to get the pricing. Maybe they won't give it to you for $23,500 but there is absolutely no reason to pay $30,000 because you didn't happen to go to some random trade show. I'd play hardball and if they won't budge, go over their head. Once you get into upper management, they'll more often then not make the deal happen. They don't care about the commission and they know if they were able to afford to sell the machine for $23,500 one week, they'll be able to sell it for the same price the next.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Shepherd View Post
    we don't buy equipment for our business based on emotions, we base it on what machine fits our needs best. I don't understand the logic of "they didn't call me back so I bought the one that did call me back"
    We are talking about a laser here, not some very specialized piece of equipment that is only sold by one company. Almost any laser made by almost any manufacturer will do the job - if company "a" doesn't want to return you phone calls then there is always company "b", or "c", etc. I have heard this before about Trotec and I will keep it in mind when I get ready to buy another laser. I'll contact each company once and will continue down the path with those that call me back.

    Gary
    I refuse to participate in this recession!


  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Hair View Post
    We are talking about a laser here, not some very specialized piece of equipment that is only sold by one company. Almost any laser made by almost any manufacturer will do the job - if company "a" doesn't want to return you phone calls then there is always company "b", or "c", etc. I have heard this before about Trotec and I will keep it in mind when I get ready to buy another laser. I'll contact each company once and will continue down the path with those that call me back.

    Gary
    So if you want a Ferrari, and you've researched all your needs and it's a Ferrari that fits your needs the best, you send Ferrari an email and they don't respond, you then send an email to Ford, Chevy, and Kia. If Ford and Chevy don't respond quickly, and Kia does, then you go buy a Kia?

    You wanted a Ferrari, but Kia called you back first and had the nice salesperson, so you bought a Kia?

    That makes no sense.

    It's well documented on this forum that laser sales are a weak point in the field. Like I said, we had a story a few weeks ago about Epilog not calling back. So does that mean Epilog is off the table now? You're dealing with SALES PEOPLE.

    If I want a Toshiba Laptop, and I go to Best Buy and I can't get anyone to help me, do I buy something else because their sales people can't help me? No, I do what I need to do to get what I'm trying to get.

    If anyone thinks linking the sales people's reactions to the service you can expect, they don't know Epilog, Universal, or Trotec. Service is top level in all 3. A salesman not calling you back in a timely manner is NOT reflective of how their service department runs.

    Last point- why would anyone send an email to someone for a critical question like this? Emails notoriously get flagged as spam or junk mail all over the place. Every stop to think that maybe your emails got flagged out by their server? Something a sales rep wouldn't have any idea about? If it's THAT important, PICK UP THE PHONE and call them.
    Trotec Speedy 300 75W Universal PLS4.60 with Rotary Attachment
    HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer
    ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router, Ricoh Dye Sublimation Printer
    Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter, Xenetech XOT 13 x 13 Rotary Engraver, Corel X5, Adobe Creative Cloud

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

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