The goofy stones thread....

[Jason Coen]

Thanks. This one is gray-green, maybe 2"x6" or so. $5, I think, maybe $10, but no more than that. Might have to pick it up.

[David Weaver]

Definitely.

There are others in the scotch progression, but I don't know that much about all of them because I've never seen a big one. The scottish dalmores are a really cool looking stone, but apparently not that fine, and the water of ayr stones are a very fine hone. I could be wrong about their hardness, too, because I've never had a big one to hone a razor, but they must be hard enough to hold their grit or they probably wouldn't be well regarded for razors like they are.

I know so little about them that I don't know if they are just brands of a hone from a mine or what (for example, there are lots of german thuringian hones that are not labeled escher, but they are still thuringian hones, just like eschers)

[David Weaver]

Dave,

You need to develop a web site with detailed colored photos of identified stones, large enough that the rest of us can compare our "unknowns" to! I've been fortunate enough over the years to have picked up a number of vintage oilstones, with a few having labels for identification. But for every stone with a label, I got 2 or 3 without and can only make a wild guess as to what they are.

The ultimate test, though, happens when you take a tool to the stone to test ability to sharpen.

T.

I have a few that I don't know what they are, but not as many as you do, I'm sure. I don't get out much and see stones in the wild, and if I do, they're often some carborundum company product or a norton stone that was in a machinists shop or a tool and die shop. I think some of those guys use an india stone until they get it plugged, and then just buy another one.

My favorite unknown stone is some yellowish semi-translucent arkansas stone that's hand cut on the back. No clue where it came from, but it's great.That and a brown stone that I thought was natural but turns out to be a muddyish fine arkansas, it's a really cool greasy feeling stone.

Getting good pictures of things close up is hard, and is apparently beyond me. If someone else had a site like that, I'd sure look at it, though.

[jeremy j smith]

I have a queer creek oil stone with label still attached that I can photo graph for you all. I have a ProScope HR2 that I can use to take very close up images (100x?) of the stone and give you all comparisons to other known stones that I have (for example, norton water stones). I also have a couple tam o shanter hones and coticules that I can do this with as well.

Let me know if you are interested.

Jeremy.

[jeremy j smith]

Also, the Straight Razor Place wiki has a page with photos of many sharpening stones. They tend to focus on very fine stones, but that is understandable when honing straight razors.

Jeremy.

[David Weaver]

Jeremy - I'd like to see the pictures of the stones. Especially the tam o shanters. Coticules are always nice to see, too since they're all so different looking.

[jeremy j smith]

David.

Here are the best pictures I was able to take of my two tam o shanter hones. I photographed them wet to bring out their character.

IMG_0465.jpg

The top stone is 7.5 x 1.5 x 0.5 (LxWxH). The box lid (not pictured) indicates that it is a tam o shanter hone and matches other examples. The bottom stone is 8 x 2 x 1 (LxWxH) and was sold to me as a tam o shanter stone. A close up of the bottom stone is below. It has the speckled appearance common to tam o shanter hones.

IMG_0470.jpg

I could not get a good close up image of the top stone. It is much more grey in appearance with a finer and denser speckling.

Jeremy.

[David Weaver]

Sweet!! those are excellent. What do you think of what they do for a razor compared to any of the standards? How's the edge quality?

[jeremy j smith]

David.

I purchased the smaller (top) stone at the same time as a select grade coticule from the Superior Shave website about two years ago. I had better luck with the coticule, so I have not worked with the smaller tam o shanter hone much since. The larger (bottom) stone is a recent purchase. I liked its size and thought it would be useful for knives, planer blades, and chisels.

I will use the ProScope HR2 (hand-held usb microscope) on these stones Thursday. I think I have a 50x or 100x lens for it. I suspect the stones will look interesting through it at that magnification.

Jeremy.

Jeremy.

[jeremy j smith]

I used my usb microscope to take close up images of the tam o shanter stones.

Small Tam o Shanter 50x
Small Tam 50x.jpg

Large Tam o Shanter 50x
Large Tam.jpg


For comparison, here are close up images of some other commonly available stones.

Norton Crystolon Coarse/Fine 50x
Norton Crystolon Coarse.jpg Norton Crystolon Fine.jpg

Vintage Norton Lily White Washita 50x
Arkansas Norton Vintage Lily White.jpg

Vintage Norton Hard Arkansas 50x
Arkansas Norton Vintage Hard.jpg

Vintage Translucent Arkansas 50x
Arkansas Unknown Vintage Trans.jpg

Vintage Coticule 50x
Coticule Unknown.jpg

If the images are blurry, I apologize. The stand that comes with the microscope is not the most stable. A better stand would allow me to use the higher magnification lens (200x) and improve the focusing.

Hopefully, you all will find this interesting. I certainly did!

Jeremy.

[David Weaver]

They are super cool pictures, Jeremy. The tam o shanters look awesome under magnification. I have a digital microscope, I don't know how good of quality it is, but it might be nice to get pictures of the surface of as many of the stones as possible.

[jeremy j smith]

Yes, the tam o shanter stones are quite distinctive.

I had trouble getting the microscope to focus correctly. If I can adapt a boom stand from a broken microscope my father has, I may be able to get better results. I have found that you do not need high magnification to get good detail if focused correctly.

Jeremy.

[David Weaver]

Three more stones...

Left - nakayama finishing stone. This one is super hard, and is a low cost stone (about the cost of a synthetic finisher) for various reasons.
* it's modern origin
* it's not straight on one side
* coloration isn't consistent

There may be others. Good stone for a razor, good super finisher for carbon steel. It's hard to get a stone as good as this one for $100 on the first try, though. You're more likely to get junk at that price level, or at least something softer, or as hard but that cuts poorly.

In the middle - an ozuku mine (another natural japanese stone) mid-grit stone. It's probably similar in fineness to an 8k waterstone. A nice stone for woodworking tools, because it's super hard, but coarse enough that it's not slow and can follow any medium waterstone. If it's a little too slow, a nagura slurry speeds it up a lot. Practical for woodworking except for the cost (though stones like this one, which is not fine enough to finish a razor, are not nearly as expensive as razor finishers, which seem to be the most common stones from the ozuku mine.)

There is a lesson to learn for all modern japanese waterstones, there are types that are popular now (like the super hard finer version of the ozukus for razors), but for tools, the japanese mines have been mined of most of the best stones. If a stone is new origin stone, you have to wonder a little why it wasn't mined out when miners were selling the good stones only to the privileged classes. (I guess that's code for saying I think if you're into these stones, they're interesting, but if you're not, you're likely to be out of money and unhappy because they are a little harder to use than synthetic stones).

On the right, my favorite oilstone. I have no idea where it came from, it's not quite translucent, but it's finer than a norton translucent, and the back is hand cut. It's a strong cutter but fine. On the razor boards, others that have stones with this coloration find them a treat. Good luck finding one, though. I chanced on this one on ebay to finish razors, but it's better than any modern oilstone (that I've tried) for tools. IMG_20121228_094438_785.jpgIMG_20121228_094502_395.jpg

[Jason Coen]

I have to ignore this thread or I'm going to wind up buying a natural Japanese stone.

[george wilson]

Tam o Shanters and Water of Ayre Scottish stones were mostly used by silversmiths for smoothing out silver pieces they were making. I have a few of these "pencil" type 1/4" or 1/2" square stones. I do not think they are made any more.