TS-Aligner and Ed Bennett - A Cautionary Tale

[Will Patterson]

For those who are not familiar with the product, here is a link:


TS-Aligner


So here goes my review and final conclusion on Ed Bennett's TS-Aligner. The product itself works fairly well but I cannot speak for the integrity of Ed as a business person. I have been trying to contact Ed for the past 2 months to confirm that he received my TS-Aligner as I had sent it back to him for re-calibration. I had exchanged emails with Ed and he had given me permission to send him the TS-Aligner and to include a check for $10 and he would re-calibrate the unit.


I have still not heard back from Ed. The only positive is that he has not cashed the check as far as I know.


Perhaps I should have known better but I did not see this until I had corresponded with him and gained his permission to send the items back for calibration.

The waiting list for TS-Aligner products is very long. Please don't ask me how long - answering such questions is a waste of time and makes the wait longer for everyone. I have provided a description of the process below. Each step involves elements that can cause indefinite delays beyond my ability to predict or control. People who have more resources (facilities, labor, funding, inventory, etc.) can easily produce delivery estimates. I can not so please don't ask me to. Call me to find out where I am in the process. Call me with questions about woodworking or machinery. Call me about the weather. Call me to make sure that I didn't die or flee to Canada (living the good life on TS-Aligner money in Saskatchewan!). But, don't call me asking for an estimate on delivery. If you pester me about it, I'm likely to get annoyed with you and give the most definite answer I can: "never".

Not very professional. "Never"?.... :sigh:




In my last correspondence which was this morning, I asked him to either return my items with or without calibration or to allow me to return the entire unit. Per his website:

It's always good business to have happy customers. Happy customers generate more business than all the advertising in the world. I only want happy customers. If you don't find one of my products useful or valuable, then the worst possible thing I could do is make you keep it. I don't want unhappy customers. If one of my products makes you unhappy, then I don't want you to end up getting stuck with it. That places a great responsibility on me to ensure that my customers choose my products because they are the best possible choice. So, I must do my best to provide all the information needed to make the right purchase decision. That's why my web site is packed full of detailed documentation. Since the TS-Aligner introduction in 1991, only five customers have asked for (and received) a full refund.
Some might think this makes me an easy mark. I say that they should think again. I've noticed that some people like to "manufacture" issues of dissatisfaction so that they can obtain "freebies", or "consolations" for their "inconvenience". If I do something wrong that causes you trouble, I'll do whatever I can to make it right. If there is something I can do to optimize my product in your application then I'll do whatever I can to make it happen. But, I won't be the victim of what I call "retail terrorism". I won't pay a ransom (freebie) to save the hostage (the sale of my product). I'll sacrifice the hostage (buy back the product) and eliminate the unhappy customer.

I guess these are just words to Ed.


Thanks for listening and buyer beware but I would stay away from the TS Aligner and not make the same mistake that I did. Besides there are a lot of great competing products and they are delivered in a timely manner with much less attitude. There are also a lot of shop built solutions that are cheap and just as good.

[Will Rowland]

I had similar dealings with Mr. Ed Bennett. If that guy would just put $10k worth of equity into his company, and hold a little finished inventory, he could rule the world (of woodworking aligner devices). As it is, I think the below is more appropriate:

[Stephen Cherry]

I just read over the site policies, and it seems VERY clear that making these jigs is a sideline, Mr. Bennett has a day job, and he gets to them when he can. He sounds a little obsessive, but they are nice looking jigs and the prices are not out of line.

Basically, the site discloses that it's not like buying from amazon, and you should not expect that it will be. If you've read the site, and want to deal with the situation, it seems fine to me. You do not have to buy from him.

That said, if you think you could do better, one alternative would be to show the information from the sit to a local machinist and ask to have one of jigs duplicated.

[Dick Mahany]

Here's an alternative. Made it for almost nothing and used an old dial indicator that was laying around. Repeats to 0.001" , but requires a very good fit for the miter slider Thats why there are two adjustable ends on it). Since I'm not setting up metal milling equipment, I'm happy with it, and if I ever need to deal with the manufacturer, I know where to find him .

IMGP3648.jpgIMGP3651.JPG

[Todd Seitz]

Dick, I really like your jig. The old KISS theory definately applies to this jig.

[Peter Kelly]

I just read over the site policies, and it seems VERY clear that making these jigs is a sideline, Mr. Bennett has a day job, and he gets to them when he can. He sounds a little obsessive, but they are nice looking jigs and the prices are not out of line.

I still answer the phone and reply to all email messages. I spend lots of hours in front of machines making parts. I assemble and calibrate my products. I personally train, assist, and coach everyone who works for me. The products which I sell bear my name. Their quality and reputation mean everything to me. They are my entire livelihood. If I get out of touch with my customers, vendors, employees, and products, then I put my livelihood at risk.

http://www.ts-aligner.com/philosophy.htm

Wonder what the real story is...

[Stephen Cherry]

I still answer the phone and reply to all email messages. I spend lots of hours in front of machines making parts. I assemble and calibrate my products. I personally train, assist, and coach everyone who works for me. The products which I sell bear my name. Their quality and reputation mean everything to me. They are my entire livelihood. If I get out of touch with my customers, vendors, employees, and products, then I put my livelihood at risk.

http://www.ts-aligner.com/philosophy.htm

Wonder what the real story is...

That's an inconsistency there, isn't it?

[Chris Parks]

I recall a lot of very robust debate involving Ed back in the rec. woodworking newsgroup days. Was anyone here a member?

[John Leatherman]

Dick, that is an ingenious way to align the saw. I wonder, though, couldn't you just clamp the dial indicator to a miter-gauge? I've got a couple cheapo DI's in my machine shop that I upgraded from. I think I've found a weekend project here.

[Larry Fox]

Dick, I really like your jig. The old KISS theory definately applies to this jig.

+1 Mine looks like a primative version of Dick's version and it has served me very well for years.

[brian c miller]

I have recived lots of help regarding his "indicator on a stick" version. Free access to his very detailed website for step by step alignment.

I never bought something and he's still been pretty helpful.

The calibration is pretty simple.... If you have a starrett combo square and a reasonable flat surface this should be a quick adjustment. There's even directions on his site to self align:
http://www.ts-aligner.com/calibration.htm

The key is to understand the math behing the gizmo.

Reading on the indicator = 1 - Tan(angle desired)So, the reading is 0.000" for 45 degrees (plunger barely pushed in) and 1.000" (plunger pushed in almost all the way) for 90 degrees (actually zero degrees).

As I under stand it you only need the calibration if you intend to "find" angles using the angle attachment gage... the calibration is done to eliminate the possibility for cosine error. Here is a quick sketch of what I mean by Cosine Error.
Cosine Error.JPG

Picture the 2" line being the indicator at full extenstion and the 1" line being the anglefinder point. If you had the DI @ a 5* angle you'd get a reading of 0.000 when measuring 90* and a reading of 1.004" at true 45*... not 1.000"

If you used 1.000" to set 45* you'd be off by something 0.11*

[glenn bradley]

Here's an alternative. Made it for almost nothing and used an old dial indicator that was laying around. Repeats to 0.001" , but requires a very good fit for the miter slider Thats why there are two adjustable ends on it). Since I'm not setting up metal milling equipment, I'm happy with it, and if I ever need to deal with the manufacturer, I know where to find him .

I did as Dick did. $100 to align a tablesaw? Even folks like me who are after +/- .001" can get there easily without the anodized hardware.

22124 Alingment 004.jpg22124 Alingment 006.jpg22124 Alingment 012.jpg

[Chris Tsutsui]

Perhaps an improvement to the business is if all of this information pops up prior to clicking "purchase" with one of those "agree" check boxes. Then it could reduce confusion to buyers.

However I did come across all of those terms and conditions of sale when I was searching for the price list on the sellers website.

Sorry to hear your unit went out of calibration. Maybe it's an excuse to buy some machinist tools to calibrate the unit yourself?

[Alan Melbourne]

i hate situations like this.
if you are acting as a business then you have to answer emails and the phone.
even if there is a situation at home. it will ruin a companies reputation if you let these things build up.
i lower my value of a company very quickly in these situations.
if i email a company monday and havent heard anything by tuesday evening i will email again. nothing by wedness day evening i will start to get mad. by friday evening i will be angry and think about not doing business . email again , nothing back in a few hour i wont bother anymore and never go near them again.
its the only way to weed out this sort of bad customer service.

[Peter Kelly]

Forrest makes something similar: http://www.forrestblades.com/accessories.htm

They pick up their phones too btw.