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Thread: Wood Magazine to Test Whole Shop Cyclones

  1. #226
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    734
    And the Government could force everyone to buy only Dust collectors made by "Dust-Stop"

  2. #227
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Nashville, TN
    Posts
    1,544
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Burnette View Post
    People DO care how much dust gets caught in the drum AND in the filter. If people didn't care we wouldn't have Dust Deputys, Thien Baffles & similar separators that attempt to extend the interval between filter cleanings & replacement.
    I was talking about pre-separator/cyclone collection only. The measure of collection efficiency is the amount caught/ the amount put in. It is very easy to weigh what goes in and what gets caught in the separator. You don't have to measure or weigh the filters to determine the separator collection efficiency.

    My other point was that even if you did very scientific and expensive testing, it does not result in a guarantee of that equipment for different applications. It would only compare the equipment for those conditions. For example, you can't guarantee that your separation device that you tested will deliver the same performance (% collected) in everyone's shop under every condition.

    I would enjoy the tool reviews better if there was not a winner. Just state the facts, list the specs, provide test results if there are any, and let us know about any deficiencies encountered under normal use. In the WOOD article, I think it would have been good information to list the filter area and type of media included.

    Mike

  3. #228
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    South Central Pennsylvania, USA
    Posts
    761
    For those who haven't seen a copy of the article (I hadn't), Oneida has posted it up on their website: http://www.oneida-air.com/PDF/Wood%2...r%20review.pdf

    Along with the splash that WOOD has named them the TOP TOOL: http://www.oneida-air.com/inventory....51D09DC8B19%7d

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Wunder View Post
    The test parameters didn't strike me as a "real world" test. They ran MDF boards through a drum sander for a given number of passes and measured room air particles before and after the sanding. I would have preferred they use a table saw, jointer, planer, etc. similar to most shops. How many hobbyist shops have drum sanders and run MDF through it all day.
    I'm going to go somewhat against the grain. To me, measuring room air particles after some dust producing operation or other and how long a dust collector could provide that cleaning action would seem to be the best judge of operation. Whether the dust ends up in the duct, filter, bag, or vortexed through the time-space continuum is of little consequence to me. Getting it out of the air that I'm breathing is the top priority followed by how long I can operate before having to clean or maintain the filter to keep up that operation. Using a drum sander on MDF pretty much seems like a worst case scenario to me. Something like a jointer or planer is likely to give you larger particles that are more easily trapped by a dust collector. Sanding MDF seems likely to produce a particularly fine dust - problematic both for collection and clogging of filters as well as for causing respiratory issues.

    Looking at it that way, I'd say that whether the unit is single-stage, two-stage, single horsepower, multi-horsepower, or whatever else is back to being of little initial consequence to me. I'm looking for the machine that gives the best end product for my money. From there, I would like to compare trade-offs. If the "best" only allows me ten minutes of operation before cleaning while something else gives me an hour of operation while collecting nearly as much, you know which one I'll be looking at. Further, is the "best" 10x as expensive as the "next best" which is nearly just as good? And how "nearly" is "nearly as good" for either of those questions?

    So, to me, the article has a certain value. What are you paying for a dust collector? What are you gaining by paying more? What are you gaining by going from single-stage units to two-stage units?

    I'd have to say that the biggest surprise to me was the results between the General International 10-210, the Grizzly G0562Z, and the JDS Dust-Force 2500. Looking at the three of them I'd be inclined to say they're all similar import units - liable to even all be manufactured at the same plant before being painted their different colors. I'd further be inclined to make my decision based on price alone if I were looking to buy one of them - particularly if I were looking at the GI and JDS, which look identical. The Grizzly looks more like the Powermatic with the "solid" canisters and such and is the cheapest of the three, so I'd possibly be considering it as well. But the GI has significantly lower particles over time while the other two (including the most expensive of the three, the JDS) could be argued to have the absolute worst results of the test. And the GI's particle performance is getting close enough to the Powermatic that I'd consider it for 2/3s the cost of the Powermatic if I were on a budget.

    Further, the GI and the Powermatic returned better results than the Grizzly cyclone, which shows that just throwing a cyclone on things isn't necessarily going to give you better results. I'd have possibly considered the Grizzly figuring that I was "upgrading" to a cyclone and would be better off than the GI or Powermatic without a cyclone - and spent more money for much poorer results.

    Like others say, I'd be interested to see the results of the ClearVue in comparison. I'd also be interested in a further test using a standard filter bag of some sort. For the Grizzly G0562Z they mention that it was leaking through welds, connections, and bag rims, but how do the bags themselves compare? They say they were all rated at 2 microns, but are certain setups using higher quality filter bags? Could you get better results out of xxx machine by upgrading and putting zzz bags on it?

    I have to say that my biggest complaint on the actual article is the graphics in their chart. Whose idea was it to use red for an "excellent" rating and green for a "fair" rating? Red is always "stop" or "caution" or such. Every time I looked at the chart I had to review things about three times to make sure I knew which was better and which was worse because my mind always wanted to see the green on the chart as the best condition.

  4. #229
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Central WI
    Posts
    5,666
    An air leak in the system can really throw the numbers off. When I changed filters my Dylos would go crazy every time I turned the collector on. turned out there was one screw hole not caulked. Makes me wonder how well each unit was sealed. Dave

  5. #230
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    3,789
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bank View Post
    For those who haven't seen a copy of the article (I hadn't), Oneida has posted it up on their website: http://www.oneida-air.com/PDF/Wood%2...r%20review.pdf
    Thanks for posting the link.
    I started with an Oneida 7 years ago, but got rid of it because it leaked horriblyand just wasn't a good product.
    I replaced it with a Laguna (well, a JDS, but they are the same...). Worked okay, but clumsy to use and extremely noisey. It had a minor leak, but not like the Oneida.
    Got rid of it last year when I moved and got a Grizzly. Much quieter (despite the test result) and overall better. I haven't found any leaks.
    Don't know about the poor filters, but you can buy new filters for the big difference in price.
    Interesting to speculate if the Grizzly is so much more powerful than the Oneida because the filter was more porous, or if the Grizzly filter was less effective because it was so much more powerful. Or if the two are unrelated.

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