Shop Vac versus Festool Dust Extractor

[Jason Roehl]

I've used a non-Festool, certified HEPA shop vac. I'm not impressed. You have to use an overly-expensive (certified) bag that has a flap of tape to close the opening when you remove it from the vac, and a paper cover (looks like it would leak where the retainer ring causes it to wrinkle at the top) over the main filter. Other than that, it's a regular shop vac. I have a regular Shop Vac brand (the standard large one), and when I put in a HEPA filter (I don't see how dust could get around this thing--it's rubber gasketed at both ends and the retainer keeps it tight) and a drywall dust bag inside (also has a rubber gasket in the opening that fits snugly around the deflector just inside the hose opening), I can use an ROS to sand drywall without a mask and the air will be CLEAN. I did it once over hardwood flooring, and there was nothing on the floor when I was done, not even the ultra-fine dust.

If you can afford a Festool vac, knock yourself out. I probably could, but I don't see the need. I'd rather have a vac that I can abuse a bit more, and if I kill it, I'm only out $100, not $600. And, I've killed a few--but in almost 17 years, I still haven't spent $600. I also don't think it's that loud.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

No offence Steve, but I would counter that statement with this one:

No, for many of us it most definately is not.

Stew, none taken. I look away for a day and look what happened to this thread!

I noticed something interesting a while back. I started woodworking as a very broke youngster, and got by with whatever I could get. I did get a lot of time in the woodshop though. I spent all of December there one year, and look back at that point in my life as one of the best. Soon after, my career took off, but the new income came at the cost of shop time. Over the next ten years it became obvious that some of the get by for cheap solutions, like a Shopsmith, a Delta dust collector/spreader, a little tablesaw, etc, ended up using up my precious little bit of shop time more than actual woodworking did. Because of that, I upgraded many things.

I bet my path is not dissimilar from many of you. Now, I can afford any tool that I want, and am at a point in my professional career that I can pay other people to help get me woodshop time, I have very good tools that I can spend it with. I don't have to spend time fiddling with them to get the result I want, and that is priceless to me. Still hoping for a December in the shop again, but it's coming.

The question was, is a Festool vacuum worth the money? It can only be answered subjectively because the value of each tool is different to each of us, so I stick to my answer, to many of us, yes a Festool vac is worth every penny.

I can completely understand how someone else, because of time. money, interests, ambition, goals, or probably even blood type, would answer the question differently. That's perfectly fine, and I sure won't look down at them because they choose something else. The inverse should apply too though. I have never seen a Festool snob. Every person that I have had the pleasure of chatting with here who owes Festools, has gone out of their way to avoid it.

[Chris Fournier]

Since the OP was considering a Festool I would assume that cost wasn't an issue and that they were looking to learn about the differences between it and a shop vac and understand why it cost more. All of the differences have been pointed out by the various posts. Whether or not you agree with the price it is very clear that there are some pretty big differences between the two. The OP needs to decide if these differences justify the price difference. No one else can decide that for them.

Seems like every time someone mentions Festool on this forum that are people that just jump in and say they are overpriced and not worth the money regardless of whether or not they have ever used them. Just because you can't afford something doesn't make it overpriced and not worth it. There is definitely a difference between an inexpensive power tool and a high end power tool. There is a reason it costs more. Everyone is free to spend their money as they would like. I am tired of the constant negative comments that seem to always to appear on the forum regarding high end tools whether it be Festool or some other brand.

I can afford Festool. I simply can't fathom it.

As presented your definition of "high end tools" seems to mean expensive. I have a lot of expensive tools. They also represent "high value" which to my way of thinking incorporates utility as well as cost when it comes to evalutaing their worth.

To my mind Festool does not represent high value. You can call a Festool a "dust extractor" but that is simply a 25 cent phrase for vacuum. I am willing to go out on a limb and suggest that if you are considering buying a Festool dust extractor you have two things going for you: one, you already have every other tool you really need and two, you have money to burn.

[Paul McGaha]

To each their own way I think. I currently don't own anything from Festool. Maybe at some point in the future. No doubt to be purchased in a pick your moment sort of basis.

Must say though I'm really pretty happy with my portable power tools as they are. Most of them are Porter Cable. I have an old Ridgid Vac and a newer Fein Turbo III I bought from a creeker. Just can't seem to put the old one out to pasture.

PHM

[Kevin Gagne]

I can afford Festool. I simply can't fathom it.

As presented your definition of "high end tools" seems to mean expensive. I have a lot of expensive tools. They also represent "high value" which to my way of thinking incorporates utility as well as cost when it comes to evalutaing their worth.

To my mind Festool does not represent high value. You can call a Festool a "dust extractor" but that is simply a 25 cent phrase for vacuum. I am willing to go out on a limb and suggest that if you are considering buying a Festool dust extractor you have two things going for you: one, you already have every other tool you really need and two, you have money to burn.

This is exactly the type of comments I am talking about.

No I don't own every tool and no I don't have money to burn. I do lots of research before making any major tool purchases to understand what the options are. I saved up for a while to get the track saw and vac. I didn't have money to burn as you imply. Once I started using them I was very happy with my purchase. When it was time for a sander it was the same thing.

I have used their products and definitely notice a big difference from the lesser quality tools that I used to work with. I even enjoy sanding now. I wonder if people that make negative comments about Festool products have ever tried using them. I used to think they were too expensive but after using them I now have a different opinion.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

To my mind Festool does not represent high value. You can call a Festool a "dust extractor" but that is simply a 25 cent phrase for vacuum. I am willing to go out on a limb and suggest that if you are considering buying a Festool dust extractor you have two things going for you: one, you already have every other tool you really need and two, you have money to burn.

Chris, not the reason I like Festool, but even if it was, whats wrong with that?? We each get pleasure out of woodworking, each differently, none is better than the others.

[Chris Fournier]

Chris, not the reason I like Festool, but even if it was, whats wrong with that?? We each get pleasure out of woodworking, each differently, none is better than the others.

I won't disagree that everyone gets to spend their money their way! I get pleasure out of woodworking too. For this reason I would spend my WWg money on a different sort of high value tooling -tools that actually work wood or perhaps even just wood. Personally I see a vacuum as an ancillary tool and get little or no pleasure out of spending money on one. For the money of a Festool dust extractor you are well on you way to a nice cylcone seperator set up for your shop and that really extracts. And I do use my cyclone with dust emitting handtools too so I don't need the little R2D2 extractor at all.

My point, which Kevin finds annoying is simply that much less money can be spent to simply suck dust, sorry, extract dust. The money you don't spend on the $$$ Festool you can spend on other WWg tools and materials which are also joy inducing! Plastic does not inspire me the way that bronze, ductile cast iron or tool steel do.

Now if I was a full time installer of $$$ custom cabinets in a rennovation setting then perhaps a festool dust extractor would make some sense...

[Peter Hawser]

Hi William,

I went kicking and screaming when I bought my Festool CT 26, but I never looked back. In many ways the Festool vac has become the most used tool in my shop. There are other factors to add to the many listed here. Via it's really smart design it is simply easier to use, more fun to use, more useful and therefore... used more! :-) For example, unlike my shop vac the hose is really flexible and it makes a big difference in using it all over the shop. Unlike the ShopVac it is quiet. I don't know about you, but I want to protect my hearing and with the Festool it is quiet enough to not need ear protection. So, used alone to clean up (everything and everywhere) or to instantly hook up to any tool (router, RO sander, belt sander, biscuit joiner...) the Festool is ready to go.

Believe it or not, my wife has the same philosophy. We used to by a cheap vacuum for the house about every year. She had enough of that and bought one costing about $500. We have had it for 7 years and it works better than any of the cheapos we used to buy.

[michael dilday]

Stew - I most emphatically disagree with you but would be the last to lambast you as you have expressed a personal opinion. It was well thought out, rational and supported by facts. The great thing about a free society is we all can make choices that are 'right' for us.

So here is my take on Festool. Do I NEED any of the festool tools I have - no. I am a hobbiest. I do this for fun. I have found over the decades that great tools (Festool, Lie Neilsen, etc) are more FUN for me to use - so that is why I own them. Period - end of story. I can turn out a better quality of work and enjoy it more with great tools. Those of you who can (and do) turn out fine furniture with limited tools have my respect & admiration but that is not for me.

When somebody asks this forum "is XXXX worth the $$$" there will be replies both pro & con with rationale for their opinion. Each questioner needs to take the responses and compare them against their own value system to decide what to do.

The only thing I thought a bit of a low blow was the swipe about status. Of the dozens of people who have seen my shop only one was a real WW'er who had any clue as to what they were looking at.. all the rest you get a glazed look and "that's nice". So if status was my motivation I would be better off with a Porche 911 in the driveway than a couple of grand in green tools nobody sees.

Oh and using a high-volume low-suction-head HF DC with reducer for sanding is not going to give you the air quality in your shop that a Festool vac/sander combo would - that's just a plain fact. So to me impacting my health to save a few bucks is not a good choice but you are certainly free to choose otherwise.

happy WW'ing bro

I agree Erik. I buy a lot of tools just for the pride of ownership. Many tools I could do without or could buy a lesser quality or not NAME BRAND but I am passionate about my hobby and am willing to buy what I want.

[Van Huskey]

NECROKITTEN.jpg

It is two kittens for a Festool thread and three for a Sawstop thread...

[Peter Kuhlman]

I never think to look at the dates of the posts. Crap. Read all the way through this only to find out it is 4 years old!!!!!
Thanks Van for pointing out I am an idiot!!!

[Ben Rivel]

Might be an old thread but the topic is still alive and kicking. People will never stop comparing Festool to cheaper alternatives.

[Stew Hagerty]

I agree Erik. I buy a lot of tools just for the pride of ownership. Many tools I could do without or could buy a lesser quality or not NAME BRAND but I am passionate about my hobby and am willing to buy what I want.

I never think to look at the dates of the posts. Crap. Read all the way through this only to find out it is 4 years old!!!!!
Thanks Van for pointing out I am an idiot!!!

Might be an old thread but the topic is still alive and kicking. People will never stop comparing Festool to cheaper alternatives.

Peter & Ben you beat me to it. Yes, I was the one that set off the bomb in this thread. Michael, as they have pointed out the thread and my post ARE over three years old. Since then, I have seen the light, well to a certain degree.

I now have, in addition to my good old HF Dust Collector with Cyclone as described in my post, I also have a Fein Turbo II with a HEPA filter and a Dust Deputy mounted in a Roll around cart that I built and absolutely love.
I use it with all of my hand-held tools as well as my Disc Sander & CMS. The retractable cord is 50' long so it'll reach a long way.

Vac-Cart 1.jpg Vac-Cart 5.jpg

I also have been bitten (albeit a relatively small bite) by the Green Monster. I bought a Domino, the 500 model. They're just too darn handy to not have one. And, there are no other truly comparable alternative tools.

[Jim Dwight]

The HEPA type filters for Rigid shop vacs I have seen, I have one and will probably buy another soon are really quasi hepa filters. The say something like HEPA fabric. If you are a contractor doing asbestos work, it makes a big difference. If you are a guy working in your own shop not wanting to breathe fine dust, I am not sure it makes much difference. I don't think it does.

I think all dust collectors need a cyclone. It doesn't make them pull more air until the filter gets dirty. That is what the cyclone is for. To keep the filter clean longer. I think it's necessary. But some high end vacuums, not Festool to my knowledge, are self cleaning. That might be another reasonable way to go.

In addition to a dust deputy, I added an auto on switch to my Rigid. It is a nice to have but is worth the $50 or so it costs. With it, I have a 10 amp Rigid shop vac switching my 15A table saw both on the same 20A circuit. I am a bit surprised it works well but it does.

I use a 20 foot 2.5 inch hose for bigger tools like the table saw and for cleanup. I use a Bosch 5 meter hose for smaller tools including my DeWalt track saw.

I enjoy the few nicer tools I have purchased but I also enjoy getting the same result with less expensive tools. My tools all make enough noise I need to wear muffs in the shop so the shop vac noise is not important - to me. My older Rigid shop vac is probably close to 10 years old. I use it when I go outside the shop. It doesn't have a DD so it is much more compact. In the shop, I use the more powerful Rigid pulling through the DD.

I'd like to have a Festool Domino but I don't need one and I don't want one as bad as many other things I will buy first. I have a hollow chisel mortiser which will do, if anything, bigger mortises than the Domino but takes enough longer to do it's thing I don't use as many mortise and tenon joints as I would with a Domino. I don't see a similar argument for a Festool dust extractor. I bet it is nicer to use than my Rigids but I use the Rigids whenever I need to.

But we each get to decide for ourselves and I will say again that I like using nice tools too.

[Roy Turbett]

Always interesting to see how threads like this one resurface every few years. I remember reading this one several years ago and was firmly in the camp that Festool makes good tools but not that good. Eventually I needed a HEPA vacuum to capture some lead based paint so I began to look for a used Festool but couldn't find one. So I bit the bullet and bought a new one when Festool happened to be running one of their rare sales and haven't looked back. Its worth every penny and, unlike other vacuums, I'm convinced I could sell it for close to what I paid for it.