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Thread: #3 vs. #4 bench plane

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Indianapolis, Indiana
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    524
    Quote Originally Posted by David Weaver View Post
    It depends on how you use your smoother. . . . There is a difference in philosophy between how Warren Mickley has described smoothing (straight through strokes on a surface), and IIRC Larry described historically accurate smoothing as being more of a spot removal issue, at least sometimes. . . . .
    I think David is spot-on in his description of the different uses for smoothers. The slightly wider No. 4 is easily the better choice for straight through strokes, but a smaller plane works better to smooth areas of tear-out and other spot issues. As a novice a few steps ahead of you in assembling tools, I predict your immediate needs will be more along the lines of smoothing sections of tear out, but eventually you'll need to deal with both issues.

    So, I suggest that you think about not only this purchase but also the next. If this will be the last smaller plane you buy for quite a while, I'd go with Jim Koepke's advice and buy a No. 3 because, IMO, it's a little better at dealing with both issues than the No. 4 and because it will probably meet your immediate needs a little better. However, if you think you're going to continue to fill in the gaps (somehow our estimate of the size of a gap in tools that needs to be filled gets smaller and smaller as we go!), I suggest you get a No. 4 for straight through stokes and consider something even smaller than a No. 3 for spot removal -- either a Stanley No. 2 (if you can spring for the bucks) or a low-angle block plane from Lee Valley and add the tote and front knob and an extra 38 degree blade so it can serve not only as a block plane but as a bench smoother. I have all four -- a Stanley No. 2, the Millers Falls equivalents of a No. 3 and No. 4, and the LV low-angle block plane with the accessories. With those choices, the No. 3 is probably the one I use least. I use the No. 4 for straight through strokes on a surface and the No. 2 or the LV block plane for areas of tear-out and such.
    Michael Ray Smith

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Ft. Wayne, IN
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    1,453
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Ray Smith View Post
    I think David is spot-on in his description of the different uses for smoothers. The slightly wider No. 4 is easily the better choice for straight through strokes, but a smaller plane works better to smooth areas of tear-out and other spot issues. As a novice a few steps ahead of you in assembling tools, I predict your immediate needs will be more along the lines of smoothing sections of tear out, but eventually you'll need to deal with both issues.

    So, I suggest that you think about not only this purchase but also the next. If this will be the last smaller plane you buy for quite a while, I'd go with Jim Koepke's advice and buy a No. 3 because, IMO, it's a little better at dealing with both issues than the No. 4 and because it will probably meet your immediate needs a little better. However, if you think you're going to continue to fill in the gaps (somehow our estimate of the size of a gap in tools that needs to be filled gets smaller and smaller as we go!), I suggest you get a No. 4 for straight through stokes and consider something even smaller than a No. 3 for spot removal -- either a Stanley No. 2 (if you can spring for the bucks) or a low-angle block plane from Lee Valley and add the tote and front knob and an extra 38 degree blade so it can serve not only as a block plane but as a bench smoother. I have all four -- a Stanley No. 2, the Millers Falls equivalents of a No. 3 and No. 4, and the LV low-angle block plane with the accessories. With those choices, the No. 3 is probably the one I use least. I use the No. 4 for straight through strokes on a surface and the No. 2 or the LV block plane for areas of tear-out and such.
    Michael, you mentioned the LV Low-Angle Block Plane. Well, I have one all decked out with the tote & knob and I absolutely love it. While it is about the size of a #2 in most respects, it has quite a bit more hand room. I have mine outfitted with the standard 25 degree blade for most of the things I use it for. However, I have a 50 degree blade and a 38 degree toothed blade for working highly figured woods and dealing with tearout. It's an amazing piece of iron, and I use it all the time. I have a Stanley Sweetheart L-A block plane that I use for more typical block plane things.

    2013-02-04_11-51-36_575.jpg2013-02-04_11-53-10_522.jpg
    "I've cut the dang thing three times and it's STILL too darn short"
    Name withheld to protect the guilty

    Stew Hagerty

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    twomiles from the "peak of Ohio
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    Getting to finish up a little table. Needed to bevel the edges, soSDC14272.jpgA Stanley#1203 to rough it out, then a Stanley #18 to smooth it down. Tried a #5A ( 5-1/2 size) to smooth out the top, and will go back over it with a M-F #8SDC14274.jpgSDC14227.jpg unless you fellows think a #6SDC14225.jpgwould work better.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Stew Hagerty View Post
    Michael, you mentioned the LV Low-Angle Block Plane. Well, I have one all decked out with the tote & knob and I absolutely love it. While it is about the size of a #2 in most respects, it has quite a bit more hand room. I have mine outfitted with the standard 25 degree blade for most of the things I use it for. However, I have a 50 degree blade and a 38 degree toothed blade for working highly figured woods and dealing with tearout. It's an amazing piece of iron, and I use it all the time. I have a Stanley Sweetheart L-A block plane that I use for more typical block plane things.

    2013-02-04_11-51-36_575.jpg2013-02-04_11-53-10_522.jpg
    I have mine decked out with handles as well and it is a an amazing little Baby BUS. I wouldn't want to smooth a large table with it but it is perfect for touching up tearout spots, or making chamfers.

  5. #35
    I thought I'd post an update to this thread. As I mentioned earlier, I went ahead and ordered the Wood River #4 a few weeks ago. I haven't done much with it yet, other than sharpening the iron and a few tryouts on some pine. The other day I was planing the edge of a piece of two-by-four with my jack plane and grabbed the Wood River to try a few strokes. After a few attempts at adjusting the iron, I found the mouth clogged so I removed everything to make some adjustments. To my surprise, I found numerous gouges in the front edge of the cap iron. I don't know if I just did something wrong in setting up the plane or if metal is just too soft, but it was kind of a disappointment.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Sioux City, IA
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    Both are viable choices, but I go with the #3. Granted, my hands aren't overly big so it fits fine, but the main reason is that I use a #3 as a shaper and as a block substitute. Additionally, it does a great job of final smoothing, just as the #4 does.

    That said, I've somewhat culled my herd of LN bench planes and would not choose a WR either. For me, those smoothers are too heavy to do the kind of work I'm used to with them.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    3,697
    Cap irons are always made out of soft material and they are ground at a low angle so they dent up very easily if you set them close without a secondary bevel. If you think it came that way exchange it (contact WC, if they're smart they'll just send you a replacement cap iron). Regardless, whether you keep it or exchange it, put a 50 degree or so secondary bevel on the tip of the top/outside (not the mating surface). This will make it work better if you use it to prevent tearout and keep it from chipping. This is one reason I like the old style CBs better than the supposedly "improved" ones.

    BTW, if you were not setting it very close I highly doubt it chipped in use. Unless you are pretty sure you did something to it just try to get a replacement anyway. WC should give you the benefit of the doubt...all of their competitors would.
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Northern Virginia
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    Rob

    I've used my Woodriver #4 V3 extensively for over a year. It's the plane I drag along when I'm working outside my shop and I use it the most in the shop. So far there isn't any hint of damage to the cap iron. I agree with Chris - take it/send it back. Woodcraft should replace the cap iron.
    - Mike

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

  9. #39
    Thanks for the advice. I contacted Woodcraft and they are sending me a new cap iron.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Belden, Mississippi
    Posts
    2,742
    I have a #3, #4C, #5 1/2 and a #7. For general planing, I find these will accomplish what I need. In addition to a Stanley low angle block, a small Stanley bullnose, and a collection of woodies, I'm plane poor.
    Bill
    On the other hand, I still have five fingers.

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    twomiles from the "peak of Ohio
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    12,120
    Plane poor???SDC14596.jpg I think I'm the one that is plane poor....

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