Page 18 of 18 FirstFirst ... 81415161718
Results 256 to 265 of 265

Thread: Precision Tools in Woodworking

  1. #256
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Williamsburg,Va.
    Posts
    12,402
    I keep my own little "bureau of standards" in the shop. Things like standards for setting and checking mikes and calipers,granite surface plates,squares and straight edge(all black granite) are good to have. Actually,pink granite makes a better wearing surface plate. But,in a home shop environment,you aren't going to wear out any granite!

    What you say is true about temperature,but for wood working tolerances,I wouldn't worry much. Don't forget about NOT handling precision mikes,levels,etc. with bare(hot) hands. When I level my lathes,I wear gloves to not warp the Starrett #199 level,which is very accurate and sensitive to heat.

    If you are using dial calipers,lay them on the FACE to keep dust and chips out of the tiny little rack teeth. The most trouble I've had with dial calipers is they can sometimes jump the rack a bit,causing the needle to not zero in the vertical position. You can rotate the dial till it does zero,but that bugs me. They usually come with a thin little brass tool that you can insert behind the dial and correct the problem. READ the instructions. The gear that runs in the rack is very small and delicate.

  2. #257
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Tokyo, Japan
    Posts
    1,550
    Roy

    Excellent points. two questions.

    1. How would an individual go about getting his precision tools periodically checked and recalibrated? And how much would it cost?

    2. While it may be going overboard, how would one go about using precision tools (assuming they are accurate at 68 degrees F) effectively in a woodworking environment with temperatures both well above and below 20 degrees C? Are there tricks for improving their effectiveness in cold/hot weather?

    A professional's insight would be much appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Stan

  3. #258
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Williamsburg,Va.
    Posts
    12,402
    Unless you are working to tenths of a thousandth,or less the temperature difference in say,a 1" mike,are not going to be noticeable. Don't leave your precision tools in direct sunlight,or near hear sources and you will be fine. Working to such precision means you are working in a grinding room with surface or cylindrical grinders anyway. The surface roughness of even a nicely lathe turned piece of metal will exceed .0001",or more.

    Standards for checking mikes can usually be found in shops that sell machinist's tools,or you can buy them separately from Starrett. If you can find an odd gage block,it will also make an excellent standard. I have my own set in the shop.

    It is likely that in a wood shop,most measurements will be for comparative measurements rather than absolute. Therefore,if all your wood is made to the same thickness to fit together,it won't really matter exactly what that thickness is ,plus or minus a few thou.
    Last edited by george wilson; 03-03-2013 at 7:30 AM.

  4. #259
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    226
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Roderick View Post
    If your daughter's house was built in 1880 I doubt you had much use for a square. Mine was built in 1886 and every angle is custom, sometimes complex. Everything is cut to fit.
    Too true. Actually, the side exterior walls are fine, it's mostly the interior from the joists sagging over time and taking the walls down with them. The house is balloon framed, so the exterior walls extend from the foundation to the attic. Consequently, the side windows were all still rectangular. One of the front corner posts has settled some, the consequence being the front door opening and the second floor window above it are out of square. I made the top rail of the upper sash and the bottom rail of the lower sash oversize for that window so that I could scribe them in place and trim them to fit exactly with the meeting rails properly lined up. The windows were probably the most significant of a long list of projects in the renovation of my daughter's house. The originals were mostly beyond salvage due to rot from too many years of neglect (not being painted) but my daughter wanted windows exactly as the originals. I bought a Suburban load of long leaf yellow pine and left it to age in the basement adjacent to my shop for six months. After first rough milling to a bit oversize in every direction I let the parts sit for another week before the final milling. Like the originals, all the rails and stiles are joined with draw bored through tenons that are also wedged. The mullions have stub tenon joinery. Like the originals, they have no counterweights. They are held in the open position by nickle plated spring bolts that are exactly duplicates of the originals (and were very hard to find).

    The house was quite a father-daughter bonding exercise, and plenty of work working. The DPO (damned previous owner) had performed a "renovation" in the '70s that involved the removal or serious damage to a lot of the original trim. All that had to be replaced with new, which in turn meant more SYP and woodworking. Some of the doors needed work and a couple of new closets needed new doors that matched the originals. Additional trim was added, chair rail above tongue and groove bead board in the dining room, boxes around the tops of windows and more elaborate crown moldings.

    Here's a before of the dining room with the DPO's paneling:

    Dining Room.jpg

    And after:

    IMG_0441sm.jpg

    Note the distortion in this pic is from the wide angle lens. The walls aren't square, but they aren't that bad!!!
    - Mike

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

  5. #260
    Quote Originally Posted by Stanley Covington View Post
    Roy

    Excellent points. two questions.

    1. How would an individual go about getting his precision tools periodically checked and recalibrated? And how much would it cost?
    George has pretty much covered it - there are two ways to go about this. The first is to send it to a cal lab (many manufacturers offer calibration services). Prices will vary, but I think our lab bills out at around $50/hr. But we are a government entity and not available to the public. But a 0-1" micrometer would probably cost around $50 plush shipping if everything checked out ok. If the anvil and/or spindle needed to be lapped or the mic needed to be adjusted, that would potentially increase the price. It would really depend on the lab.

    The second is to purchase some standards, which are also available from various manufacturers. Mitutoyo has some great offerings, as does Starrett/Webber. While we generally do a 6 point check over a 1 inch travel micrometer, finding three or four throughout the range would probably be safe. You can actually order many tools as a set with a standard or two. Standards for long straightedges would bet very pricey, though. For the woodworker, it would be better to simply buy two and use them against each other I think.

    Also, if you go this route, keep your standards in the house where temp and humidity are more tightly controlled than the shop. Then bring your tool into the house, and let it stabilize for an hour or so (some tools we have an eight hour stabilization period) at that temperature and do your check. This would be the most accurate way the average Joe could periodically check his precision tools.

    2. While it may be going overboard, how would one go about using precision tools (assuming they are accurate at 68 degrees F) effectively in a woodworking environment with temperatures both well above and below 20 degrees C? Are there tricks for improving their effectiveness in cold/hot weather?
    Quite honestly, when working wood, it probably wouldn't be much of a problem because the tight measurements can't really be had on most woods, due to the softness of wood. If you are measuring to the thousandth on wood, then you probably won't be thrown off by most temperature changes. My comments were directed more at checking tools like plane soles and squares, etc. But again, the best thing to do would be to bring your stuff into the house to let it stabilize before checking it - that is if you are measuring to 0.0001" or tighter. That could get cumbersome, though, by taking it in to check and out to work on it and so on. In the end, a guy can only do what he can do. Do the best with what you have.

  6. #261
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Tokyo, Japan
    Posts
    1,550
    Quote Originally Posted by Roy Lindberry View Post
    George has pretty much covered it - there are two ways to go about this. The first is to send it to a cal lab (many manufacturers offer calibration services). Prices will vary, but I think our lab bills out at around $50/hr. But we are a government entity and not available to the public. But a 0-1" micrometer would probably cost around $50 plush shipping if everything checked out ok. If the anvil and/or spindle needed to be lapped or the mic needed to be adjusted, that would potentially increase the price. It would really depend on the lab. Do the best with what you have.
    Thanks.

    Stan

  7. #262
    Wow, you are a better man than I. My house is also balloon-framed with sagging most everywhere. Last year I had all the windows (these houses have lots of windows) replaced with the Pella architectural series, beautiful and energy-efficient, but not hand-made like yours.

    Did you go to a mill and have them replicate the original woodwork?

  8. #263
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    226
    Blog Entries
    2
    No, with the exception of the chair rail in the dining room we made all the trim ourselves.
    - Mike

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

  9. #264
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Tucson
    Posts
    5,001
    Blog Entries
    1
    I make wood hinges using the Incra hingecrafter. I had a problem with my hinges not fitting together. I made several sets all of which had the same problem. Turned out my Freud router bit was about 1/100 undersized, just enough to create the problem. Problem I had was I lost 2 evenings trying to figure it out AND the hinges were Gabon Ebony at over $100.00 a board foo. I thought I was doing something wrong so I kept trying. I also make my own inlays, off even in the slightest and you'll have gross misalignments as you put pieces together. Accurate woodworking tools are absolutely essential.
    Last edited by Bill Wyko; 03-07-2013 at 9:53 PM.
    What you listen to is your business....what you hear is ours.

  10. #265
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Tokyo, Japan
    Posts
    1,550
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Wyko View Post
    I make wood hinges using the Incra hingecrafter. I had a problem with my hinges not fitting together. I made several sets all of which had the same problem. Turned out my Freud router bit was about 1/100 undersized, just enough to create the problem. Problem I had was I lost 2 evenings trying to figure it out AND the hinges were Gabon Ebony at over $100.00 a board foo. I thought I was doing something wrong so I kept trying. I also make my own inlays, off even in the slightest and you'll have gross misalignments as you put pieces together. Accurate woodworking tools are absolutely essential.
    That's gotta be irritating! Thanks for sharing the story.

    Stan

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •