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Thread: Differences in MIG,TIG and Flux welders - contemplating learning to weld

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Outten View Post
    For home welding I have always felt that stick welding was the best way to go, its not too difficult to learn and the weld quality is usually pretty good for round the house projects and farm stuff. It does seem that these days people who are just starting up prefer to purchase Mig machines although I'm not sure why.
    Mostly because its easier to get some sort of stickum to stick (at least for me) and works pretty well with thin materials that I'm likely to be using around the shop. Its pretty rare that I want to go over 1/4" material and for the really thin stuff I just burn holes with a stick welder but can make a somewhat lumpy but mostly functional join with the MIG (and ye-gods yes it would be a horrid idea for me to weld something like a trailer hitch at this point regardless of the methodology). I've done a little bit of stick welding and if I was doing anything of any size (like farm equipment) I'd go back there in a heartbeat and re-learn it better (and add an oxy acetylene setup as well). I certainly don't dispute that TIG makes cleaner welds, and stick can make better welds and that oxy acetylene is more flexible (or any of the other counter arguments you guys made cause they're definitely valid), but the thing you guys have to understand is that you all know how to weld much better than most of us ever will so the rest of us are pretty happy with something that pretty much mostly works with minimal learning curve. For me I can get out the door faster with a MIG than the other technologies at this point in my practice/knowledge curve. This is also not to say that time spent learning oxy and tig and stick wouldn't be time well spent, it would.. but you really need to do a lot of it and keep in practice (unless you've done a LOT) to stay decent so even if I went back and re-learned it all better I'd still not be very good at it .

    BTW: Keith, how do you like your fancy new welder?

  2. #32
    Roger,
    I won't go into the difference in processes as it's been covered already, I will say this though, If and when you purchase a welder and hood, before you strike an arc, invest in a welding fumes respirator or welding fumes collector. Welding fumes are nothing to take lightly.

    I'm a certified Welder in DC Stick on pipe and plate and Tig for the same. I started with Gas welding and cutting/piercing at welding school and it's a great place to learn torch control and metal flow. While learning by doing is a positive tool, throw your hood and respirator on and sit next to a seasoned veteran who's welding to see how it's done correctly. Watch his hand control and puddle flow. You will see what needs to take place to make a certified weldment.

    For me the toughest welds were made with stick DC on pipe. You prepare the pipe and have to make a root pass starting from the bottom followed by several overlapping passes. Your rod angle is critical and has to be maintained as you move up the curvature of the pipe. Remember the rod is constantly shrinking and you're maintaining arc to puddle gap and removing stubs and adding new rods as you go. This is not a quick or easy process, although if you do it right, it's very rewarding.

    Good luck, be safe and enjoy
    Mac
    Last edited by Mac McQuinn; 04-06-2013 at 10:39 AM.

  3. #33
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    Ryan,

    I wish I could report to you that I have been using the new welder but I can't. Some sign work dropped out of the sky and I have been busy getting material and design work done so I can get these jobs out the door before I go to Jim McGrew's Aspire Camp next week. Two other jobs that I finished are ready to ship so I need to get that done right away. Right now my mower is sitting in my shop in my welding area, I sharpened the blades and now I need to change the sharp set for the dull ones.

    I promised myself that I would spend some time with both the new welder and the plasma torch this weekend no matter what comes up or who drops by

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Outten View Post
    It does seem that these days people who are just starting up prefer to purchase Mig machines although I'm not sure why.
    I think a lot of it comes down to what people see on the TV "fab" shows. Everyone is using a MIG welder or TIG welder. You don't see a lot of oxy-acetylene being used (and explosive gases tend to scare some people off) and I'm not sure I've ever seen a stick welder being used.

    With MIG it is very easy to get things set up and get results - not necessarily favorable results, mind you... But you can set up the MIG you got from the local big box store and glue some metal together right away without too much of a learning curve. Now, gluing that metal together properly and so that it doesn't fail if it is structural is an entirely different matter! I see a lot of "bird poop" welds out there.

    As I say, explosive gases scare people off from oxy-acetylene. Stick takes some little amount of skill to not just stick the rods to your work - and doesn't work so well for light gage stuff. TIG not only takes some time to learn, but takes some actual dexterity and coordination to pull off adding heat and filler rod. I've heard more than one person say that if you can draw a line on a sheet of metal with a magic marker, you can glue stuff together with a MIG.

    A few people have mentioned sitting down with someone with some experience. That is definitely worthwhile advice! You can end up with a lot of confidence in your abilities (particularly with MIG) if you don't know how much you don't know... Having someone with some experience there to tell you what is good and what is bad can save you a lot of time - and keep you from forming some bad habits.

  5. #35
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    [QUOTE=Thomas Bank;2092838]I think a lot of it comes down to what people see on the TV "fab" shows. Everyone is using a MIG welder or TIG welder. You don't see a lot of oxy-acetylene being used (and explosive gases tend to scare some people off) and I'm not sure I've ever seen a stick welder being used.



    As I say, explosive gases scare people off from oxy-acetylene.

    people drive cars and mower their grass with a gasoline engines , some people also cook with gas but will shake in their boots if a oxy-acetylene pops when the welder get too close to the metal being weld on, I were using a stick welder close to a cutting torch tank set, when I finish the weld I noticed that the acetylene tank were on fire where the valve enter the tank, my first thought was to run but I realize that IF THE TANK were to blown that if would already had happen so I took two quick steps to the tanks and with one breath blow the fire out,I AM MORE AFRAID OF GAS COOKING STOVES THAN OXY-ACE WELDING TANKS

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ray hampton View Post
    people drive cars and mower their grass with a gasoline engines , some people also cook with gas but will shake in their boots if a oxy-acetylene pops when the welder get too close to the metal being weld on
    Familiarity breeds complacency. I see people smoking around gasoline. That scares me! But most people aren't around acetylene cylinders regularly. So they expect them to spontaneously explode without warning.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bank View Post
    Familiarity breeds complacency. I see people smoking around gasoline. That scares me! But most people aren't around acetylene cylinders regularly. So they expect them to spontaneously explode without warning.
    WELL SAID, VERY TRUE
    do the same people believe that Oxygen will explode or burn by itself ?

  8. #38
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    Well, I have seen people say you should depressurize your air compressor when it is not in use because it would feed a fire...

  9. #39
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    Oxygen and oil make a deadly combination as well as oxygen and any ignited material such as a burning cigarette, etc.
    David B

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by David G Baker View Post
    Oxygen and oil make a deadly combination as well as oxygen and any ignited material such as a burning cigarette, etc.
    maybe but a diesel engine need oxygen + oil to run

  11. #41

    submerged arc welding flux supplier

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Chandler View Post
    Okay......I am a total newbie in relation to welding......I have had several times in the last couple of years that I wished I knew how to weld, and even came close to purchasing a welder and shield...........resisted because of my lack of knowledge.

    Could someone on this forum explain the differences in TIG, MIG and Flux wire welding and when they are used? Also the benefits of each kind?

    Much appreciation!
    hi, sir. welding actually needs a lot of experience. there are so many welding types. it takes time to master just one of them. we provide submerged arc welding fluxes for customers. so i know about SAW process.
    here is my tips. first, you should choose which welding is applicable. MIG, MAG, SAW, GMAW, etc. they are used for different purpose.
    second you choose welding fluxes and wires based on your base metal. is it low carbon steel, low alloy steel or stainles steel? is it pipeline, cars, roll hardfacing, ship building, bridge building?
    the combination of flux and wire is very important. they help you a make a good welding.
    please contact us for more info about submerged arc welding flux.
    Last edited by Keith Outten; 12-15-2015 at 1:38 AM.

  12. #42
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    Lots of good information here. Here's my experience. I bought a cheap 110 amp buzzbox stick welder 'cause well .... it was cheap. It'll run either 120volt or 240 volt though amperage is limited on 120 volt. It works but someone with no experience with stick welding would get REAL frustrated. It's much easier to get a stuck rod than a struck arc. I'd had previous experience with stick welders and had taken a class so had a clue about how things are supposed to work. The little buzz box has welded some mobile bases together and have done other small jobs but requires more skill (and a little luck) than a better machine.

  13. #43
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    Being a homeowner in the country , I needed a welder to do repairs and to build implements for my garden tractor.
    The cheapest and most versatile way to be able to do most repairs is to have a 110 mig welder that is preferably 100-120 output amps, for body work on cars, and thinner materials of steel. I bought an Astro 110 Mig welder, good quality, made in Italy, from a body shop technician, used for 225.00 and it came with a small bottle of argon.
    The next thing I own is a used Lincoln AC Tombstone welder that I bought for 100.00 and use with 220V for welding heavier steels. I was accustom to welding and brazing, soldering, in maintenance and tool rooms before so the learning curve was easier for me.
    I think Oxy Acetylene is very versatile, but expensive to acquire in the beginning. I cannot find a good used setup under 250-300 dollars, and then the gas and oxygen is quite a bit more.

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