Vintage miter boxes

[Tim Null]

I bought a Stanley 150 and then ordered a miter saw from Bad Axe. Wow, works great. I recently made two custom poker tables. Almost all of the molding needed to be cut at a 22.5 degree angle. I cut all of this on the miter box. The design of this box lets you use almost all of the saws length. And it was accurate. I did touch up some edges using my Evenfall shooting board. I could dial in the angle to be slightly less or more than 22.5 degrees when necessary to make the pieces fit. This was not something I could do with a powered tool. Mark has a nice little piece on his site about this miter box. For small pieces like molding, etc it is just the ticket. And the Bad Axe saw is amazing.

[Charlie Stanford]

It seems to me that this topic deserves more "air time". Maybe it is just me but I find tons of info. on making sawing jigs for a bench or making sawbenches but very little discussion of miter boxes. Admittedly I am coming from more of a construction orientation, where one lives and dies by the compound miter saw still...

I restored a Millers Falls/Langdon 74C, which I am quite fond of. I find it to be more accurate than my electron eater and even easier to use. I am thinking I will do the majority of my crosscuts using this box and I have a hard time understanding why most hand tool users would not get major usage from one of these saws. I am in the process of building table(s) to use this saw and my Steel City planer on. I am also in the market for a lighter, faster cutting saw than the Disston 26" (actual tooth length), 11 ppi saw that came with it. I have searched long and hard for a smaller miter box but I am giving up on finding one. I think I have decided my 74C will serve most of my needs better anyway if I find a better lighter saw for it.

My main concern, now that I have the box fully restored, painted...is the saw. It seems to me that a saw with a thinner plate and a little less size and weight might serve my general needs better. I am wondering what tooth count and size saws others use and find serviceable?

Ulmia Miter Box with plenty of accoutrements, FWIW:

http://www.pecktool.com/index.php?ma...ndex&cPath=132

[David Barnett]

Ulmia Miter Box with plenty of accoutrements, FWIW:

http://www.pecktool.com/index.php?ma...ndex&cPath=132

Having used Nobex, Jorgenson and at least three other frame saw miter boxes, I can attest that the Ulmia was the best with Nobex being a distant but acceptable second—I truly didn't like the Jorgenson I tried but maybe it's better now. The Nobex, in spite of its generous depth capacity, seemed more suited to cutting interior architectural mouldings and picture frame stock—I've seen a few in framing shops. The others fell far short in my experience. The Ulmia works very well but is spendy.

Long ago, just after I bought a tablesaw, in part to improve my mitering situation, Trevor Robinson, from the oldtools list who lived across the CT River from Northampton in Amherst—called and said he had something for me. The next day he showed up with a #358 Stanley miter box and big Disston backsaw, the hold-down clamps, rods, extensions, everything——and said "it's yours for $25 if you want it." I wanted it.

For accurate small work and one offs, it's still my go-to. Heavy, yes, with a saw plate nowhere as thin as a frame saw—nothing flimsy about it—but holds a setting, saws dead-on straight and is a pleasure to use even if it is slower.

[Mike Holbrook]

Wow Charlie that is an expensive saw, not sure why/how it is better than a Nobex? Nice link to that Bad Axe link Tim, that is an interesting alternative and certainly provides a more compact saw.

[Mike Holbrook]

Looks like David answered my question about Nobex while I was typing. Tim inspired me with his info. on the Stanley 150 as an excellent compact alternative with modern saws available to work in the box. I just got a decent deal on a Stanley 150 that I found on auction.

The saw that comes with the miter box I bought does not look great but Bad Axe has a saw designed for the box. Bad Axe even has a copy of the original Stanley 150 manual available for down loading. According to Stanley quite a few saws will work with the 150. The blade guide does not require a saw with a back so this miter box should even work with some hand saws. The other big advantage according to Bad Axe's testing, this miter box gets usage of 85% of a saw plates teeth vs 67% for the double post miter boxes. I will make a bench hook, like Andrea and Bad Axe have demonstrated, to mount the miter box on once I have restored and painted it.

[David Barnett]

Looks like David answered my question about Nobex while I was typing.

Mike, the Nobex I bought, which was not their top of the line, was not altogether unusable but did suffer from a couple problems. The first was slightly inaccurate detents/settings for anything other than 90°—not so much as to render it worthless—but enough to vex me if I needed to match carved or other figural elements. I'd want a Lion trimmer if it was my sole miter saw, as I was unwilling to perform compensatory sawing gymnastics—complementary angles and otherwise—to get a tight fit. Of course, shooting the miter would also work.

The other drawback was the ease one could deflect the cut if one's technique was not light-handed and wholly unbiased. With practice and unwavering focus I could learn to make the Nobex work reasonably well and if I wasn't so terribly pernickety, it might suffice. Requirements are apt to differ and it's not a bad saw—rather it just has its quirks, and for me, these didn't fit my style or needs. Even with the #358 I'll still often shoot my miters.

[Mike Holbrook]

David I actually have some experience with Nobex as well, although my experience is with the bottom of the line saw. I bought one from Highland Woodworking, a return, almost a give away. My experience matches yours. I have only used it a few times as I find it necessary to be very careful starting the blade. The blade that came with mine cuts slow too. There is just entirely too much play in the aligning hardware for my taste.

I am hoping the Stanley 150 will work much better. Tim's post and the information on Bad Axe seems to suggest that the 150 can cut very accurately. I never gave saws like the 150 consideration before because I was afraid their alignment hardware would be too loose for my taste like the Nobex I have. I believe one could also make the argument that it is easy to fine tune a less than perfect cut with a shooting board. It seems to me the point of a miter box has largely to do with accuracy, or we might as well use a bench hook.

[Derek Cohen]

I believe one could also make the argument that it is easy to fine tune a less than perfect cut with a shooting board. It just seems to me though that the point of a miter box has largely to do with accuracy, or we might as well use a bench hook

Exactly, Mike. That is what I was referring to earlier.

I do agree that the big mitre boxes - MF and Stanley - are overkill for many of the tasks we need them to do. For example, they could be killer saws on tenon shoulders (since you can set a depth stop for both depth and length), but are far too cumbersome for this task. I'd love a small box for small moldings. The MF 74 and Stanley 346 (which I once had) dwarf the work and use saws with wide plates.

Regards from Cape Town

Derek

[Gary Herrmann]

Mike & Derek, I have the same model Langdon Acme. I use it for all my smaller cross cuts. I can't remember the last time I turned on my Bosch miter saw. Hmm.

I've got a 26" Disston on mine that has about 4.75" of plate. So far, no problems at all.

I'd also like to find a smaller one to permanently mount somewhere in the shop.

[Mike Holbrook]

Assuming the Stanley 150 turns out to work well, I think I will use it in my hand tool shop, so I can work at night without waking up the wife & picky young adults I live with. I may put the MF 74C in my business building where I am constantly needing to cut a few boards for repairs or small projects. The electric compound miter saw & saw stand are too big to leave set up all the time. The 74C works great for cutting a few: 2x4's, 1x4, 2x2, PVC, CPVC, rawhide dog chews....and I can toss it up on a table, porch rail...and be done before I can drag the big boy out.

[Peter Pedisich]

Charlie, looks like I got a deal on my Ulmia 352! ...got it from ebay for $129! And a Stanley 358 with a saw sharpened by Daryl Weir. The Stanley cuts perfectly, not sure how many tpi - I'll check tomorrow. -pete

[Kees Heiden]

Very nice Ulmia Peter (The Stanley looks great too)! Is the blade resharpenable? Mine came with several blades with hardened teeth, which were all too far worn out and had way too much set. It also had one blade with normal teeth I could sharpen. I had to stone one side until it tracked straight, and now it is a joy to use. You can also buy a Japanese style blade for this saw, which seems to be very good, allthough some people think it is too agressive.

But I must say I don't use it much yet. It is a big machine, taking up a lot of real estate. So I don't know if I will keep it. If I would work with moldings, I'm sure I would apreciate it more.

Here's a short video of using the saw to cut a piece of hard maple.

[Jim Matthews]

I score the cut all the way around, to reduce chipping on the exit of the cut.
I'll pare a small relief as well, if the stock is prone to splintering (Sapele? - I'm talking about YOU.)

Many of the pieces I'm cutting on my Langdon are so small, I can't plane them afterwards.
I clamp both two the rear fence, and clamp on a stop block as I'm a hamfist, and the work wanders if it's not held down.

These saws are like any other fine-toothed saw, bearing down doesn't make it cut faster or better.

I like the surety of a fixed workpiece that I move the tool over.

I adopted Mr. Cohen's method of fixing the works to my bench.
I don't have a permanent base attached, I put screws through the feet into my bench for each use.

It's MUCH easier to use a little higher than waist height - so I can clearly see what's happening.

[Greg Works]

I bought a nice old Stanley miter box for $2 at a local auction. There is a time investment. I go for fun and enjoy the experience so it's not a hassle for me. Many auction sites have online photos so you can sometimes get an idea of what is offered - my experience is that there is way more stuff than gets photographed.

[Peter Pedisich]

On ebay right now there is an Ulmia 352 (with a high reserve IMHO) if anyone is interested. It's not mine - I'm keeping it!