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Thread: Building a bench (the kind you sit on)

  1. #61
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    Thanks Brain, that's helpful, I have something with a floating panel in mind that I'm currently stewing on. I could go either direction at this point. Cheers.
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  2. #62
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    Sounds good, looking forward to seeing the results.

  3. #63
    I'm with Judson. I'd go for solid panel. Fixed tenon at only one point, and I think you will be fine. I just made a Shaker trestle table with a deep upper stretcher that does it the same way. The height of the apron will prevent racking even if it's not connected along its entire length.
    Last edited by Prashun Patel; 12-09-2013 at 9:19 AM.

  4. #64
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    That solution should work. If a traditional f&p is too much than a 2" x 3" framing member mortised into the leg with the panel under it floating in a rabbet and glued at the top edge would be elegant and stronger than a panel mortised in the way that is proposed. You could even hide a stretcher behind the panel that could double as a supporting edge for the bottom of the storage container.

    Anyways, Chris check out the wegner CH25 easy chair, specifically the front leg. That's the shape I'm talking about.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Holcombe View Post
    You could even hide a stretcher behind the panel that could double as a supporting edge for the bottom of the storage container.
    This is a very good idea. Adds strength, and compliments the construction I already had in mind. I like this a lot.

    Cool chair...yes I see what you mean by parabolic.
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  6. #66
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    Well, I had a bit of time tonight so I decide it was time to just move forward with the build. I settled on a design (to be revealed as I build...the result may surprise you:p) and went about laying out a story stick.

    IMG_20131209_201253_493 (1).jpg


    I had been waiting to do final prepping of the leg stock until had decided on design. With my story stick laid out, and with the little time I had left in the shop tonight, I decided to get all the legs to their near final dimensions so I can lay out the joinery.

    I had already flattened/squared my reference faces so I decided as a next step to establish the final length and create nice square foot. I mark out the shoulder that will mate with the arm rests and from there lay out the the bottom of the legs simultaneously to ensure and equal shoulder to floor distance.

    I take my time with the cut. Marking out on all four sides and then using a wide chisel to cut a v-notch...I think taking this time up front ultimately saves time, as it leaves me with almost no cleanup after sawing.
    IMG_20131209_201222_505.jpg

    With the notches laid out, I saw about 1/8 of an inch down right to the line on all four sides, saw about 1/2 the thickness on the last side I kerf, flip the piece over, and then saw the other half.
    IMG_20131209_202211_179 (1).jpg

    The cuts aren't totally clean through and through, but all 4 sides are nice clean and square, so after sawing it just takes a few swipes with a block plane to get everything clean and square across the full thickness.

    IMG_20131209_203716_654.jpg


    WARNING: PURISTS AVERT YOUR EYES!!!

    As a last step before I leave the shop tonight, I mark out the final 2x2 dimension and run the legs though my bandsaw cutting abut 1/32" shy of the final mark, which I will hit with a plane later on. I won't bother to clean up the sawn show faces yet,as there is not a need, and besides I'm going to end up sawing some curves in anyway so cleaning them up now would be a waste of time.

    As an added bonus, bandsawing to near final dimension leaves me with a stack of 1/16" to 1/4" thick off cuts, which are potentially useful and far less messing than my usual pile of foreplane shavings.

    IMG_20131209_211445_269.jpg
    Last edited by Chris Griggs; 12-10-2013 at 6:26 AM. Reason: lots of typos...I probably missed some!
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  7. #67
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    Looking good Chris. What is that backsaw you have?
    "If you have all your fingers, you can convert to Metric"

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hilton Ralphs View Post
    Looking good Chris. What is that backsaw you have?
    Thanks Hilton. That's my shop made "Kenyon Sash Saw": http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...iques-welcome)
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  9. #69
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    Looking forward to seeing your progression!

  10. #70
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    16 Mortises....

    With the design decided and the leg blanks prepped I got started on the joinery last night.

    I began by making a drawing template for the shape I will put into the legs and drew the pattern onto each of the blanks before laying out any joinery. This was done simply to dummy proof the layout. I may still tweak the shape I mocked up, but any changes will be minimal and not enough to impact joinery placement.

    Before I did any cutting I used my story stick to mark out all of the mortises. All 16 are laid out together and the marks from one leg are applied to all others to ensure consistent alignment of all 8 rails (that's right Brian, I said rails )

    IMG_20131210_201756_279.jpg

    With all the leg joinery laid out its time to start cutting. Mortises are one of those things that I still haven't settled on a "preferred" method of cutting both in terms of what I use to cut them and also, when I use a mortise chisel what method I like best. Truth be told, this is most likely because I really only complete a few actual furniture project each year, and over past few years, as I've gotten seriously into hand tool work, most of what I made as been casework, so mortising practice has been minimal (I find dovetailing for instance to be a good bit easier than M&T work).

    Anyway, I decided to break out my new-to-me drill press and try a power/hand combo method. The mortises are laid out to fit my 3/8" mortise chisel so I usec a 1/4" Forsner bit to waste out the center area. My initial plan was to just chop the ends and pair the side but there was enough material left in there that I end up attacking the whole mortise with my mortise chisel similarly to how I would if I hadn't drilled it out. That is, using my mortise chisel in the BD position, I pair out a thin layer to establish some nice clean walls and then work down the length of the mortise chopping to full depth with my chisel. I think I picked up the paring out of a thin layer prior to chopping from one of Derek's tutorials, and it is a step I find very worthwhile whether I am fully chopping a mortise by hand or, in this case, chopping out what remains after wasting it out with a drill press. When I do this I not only find that I end up with much cleaner more consistent walls but that I can also work faster while chopping as chisel alignment becomes so easy and mindless.

    IMG_20131211_073017_334.jpg IMG_20131211_074000_160.jpg IMG_20131211_073841_061.jpg

    With all that material wasted out first, the chopping is very quick and easy and I am able to chop to full depth with one pass down the length of the mortise. However, overall I don't really feel like it saved me much time or produced a better result than just chopping it fully with a chisel, especially in this nice to work air dried walnut. I think I got a more even bottom easier than I would just mortising with a chisel, but other than that the results were pretty comparable. Perhaps in something harder and tighter grain like maple that doesn't split quite as nicely the drilling out would be more worth while. I'll will however say, that before I had any proper mortise chisel (or drill press) I on several occasion wasted out the mortise with a corded drill or brace&bit and then followed with a regular bench chisel, and in that context the boring out I feel was worthwhile. All said, in this future, if/when I use my drill press press to assist with mortising I believe I will size the mortise to the bit so that any followup chiseling is simply light paring.

    The next mortise I did, I simply chopped with my 3/8" pigsticker, again first establishing the walls by paring a thin layer out, and then with the bevel of the chisel facing away from me, I chop down just away from the end nearest me and work down and back again (like how Klaus and Sellers do it). I tend to go back and forth between this method and the method where you establish a V in the center and then work back to each shoulder. I haven't decided which I prefer. The Sellers/Klaus way (which I used on these mortises so far) appeals to me more cognitively because there is less flipping back and forth of the chisel and also because that's how I chop hinges mortises, BUT in practice, I think I'm actually starting to prefer the "V-method" as I find (for reasons I can't explain) that I get slightly cleaner mortise walls with it and have an easier time getting and even mortise floor.

    So all said, I've got 2 mortises done and 14 to go, and both the drill press/mortise chisel combo method as well as just using the chisel yield fine results. In the photo below the mortise on the left with the chisel in front of it was done just by chisel and the one on the right was drilled out first. I drilled out 3 additional mortises while I was drilling the first, but I'll probably do the rest with just a chisel, mainly because its just so damn satisfying, and doesn't take much (if at all longer).

    IMG_20131211_074713_580.jpg

    And, oh yeah, I got to put my 1 1/4" Narex parer to work here doing a bit of cleanup on the sides. I found this chisel to be great for this as its long length really lets you see and feel plumb/square, and you can really lean into it if you need to. Really this step is probably overkill (and arguably totally unnecessary) as a mortise chisel on its own leaves pretty even walls (if you don't muck thing up and in this case I for once didn't), but for me still taking the time to smooth out any extra bit of schmutz inside the mortise, potentially makes the process of fitting the tenons and getting a good final result that much easier later on.

    IMG_20131211_074059_157.jpg
    Last edited by Chris Griggs; 12-11-2013 at 10:46 AM. Reason: typos
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  11. #71
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    Keeping you busy I see.

    I think you're supposed to use a drill bit where the diameter is equal to the mortise width so you don't end up having to mess with the sides.
    "If you have all your fingers, you can convert to Metric"

  12. #72
    Hey Chris,
    Looking good…I enjoyed reading your thoughts on mortising. I'm in the same place--I haven't really settled on which approach I prefer with the pigstickers. Though, like you, I am absolutely sold on paring out a thin strip at the outset--makes registering the chisel much easier and more accurate.
    Two questions: have you tried drilling a single hole vs no holes at all? (I haven't, but plan to tonight)
    Also, might it not be easier to pare out the thin strip before drilling?

    -Steve

  13. #73
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    Looks good Chris. And I do as Hilton describes... drilling the same size as the mortise.

  14. #74
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    Thanks guys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hilton Ralphs View Post
    Keeping you busy I see.

    I think you're supposed to use a drill bit where the diameter is equal to the mortise width so you don't end up having to mess with the sides.
    Indeed, I was thinking that I'd get cleaner sides by using an undersized bit and paring the walls. It didn't really go as planned and I ended up using the mortise chisel anyway. Next time I will just size my mortises to the bit as you say.

    I'm really good at teaching people what not to do...

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Voigt View Post
    Hey Chris,
    Looking good…I enjoyed reading your thoughts on mortising. I'm in the same place--I haven't really settled on which approach I prefer with the pigstickers. Though, like you, I am absolutely sold on paring out a thin strip at the outset--makes registering the chisel much easier and more accurate.
    Two questions: have you tried drilling a single hole vs no holes at all? (I haven't, but plan to tonight)
    Also, might it not be easier to pare out the thin strip before drilling?

    -Steve
    Yeah, the paring out just makes the process so much easier. I'd imagine that with enough mortising one would develop good enough control and muscle memory to make the step somewhat arbitrary, but I'm and amateur and don't do that much mortising so it really helps me get good results with much less effort, and that extra 30 seconds spent paring I feel really saves me time while chopping.

    I haven't tried the single whole method, though I have seen CS reference it.

    Hadn't though about paring before drilling...could be helpful in making sure I am aligning the bit exactly to the mortise walls if/when I do the same thing using a bit that is the full width of the mortise.
    Last edited by Chris Griggs; 12-11-2013 at 11:21 AM.
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

  15. #75
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    ForumRunner_20131211_204903.jpg



    8 down, 8 to go. I'm at about 15 minutes per mortise right now for mortises that are about 2" long (give or take 1/2") and about 1 1/4" deep (that I've already laid out). I'm going to see if I can get that under 10 min per mortise by the end of the next 8.
    Woodworking is terrific for keeping in shape, but it's also a deadly serious killing system...

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