cyclone drum for vertically challenged basement

[Graham Hutchinson]

I am thinking of upgrading the dust collection in my basement workshop and am leaning towards a 3hp stationary cyclone system. Unfortunately my basement is vertically challenged. I have 78" from the floor to the bottom of the joists and another 7" in height between joists, which the motor of the cyclone could go up into. Has anyone used a different style of drum at the base of the units? I could make up a large diameter low drum, or a small diameter tall drum on its side, or a rectangular box, however the dust and chips will probably just build up under the cyclone outlet and not get to the edges of the drum or box. Portable cyclones are lower, but they don't seem to have the same performance at the same hp. Thanks in advance.

Graham

[Paul Grant]

Although odd, a cyclone will work if hung at an angle...food for thought.

[Jamie Buxton]

The chips box under my cyclone is shop-made. It is rectangular. I put a clear window in the side so I know when it is getting full. Through that window, I can also see that there is lots and lots of blowing around in there. Unless your chips box is flat as a pancake, I think your chips will fill out to the edges of the box.

[Anthony Whitesell]

I am in the same position. I actually think my measurements are the same (78" headroom and 7" more between the floor joists)

I will attempt to describe this as I don't have a picture. So please bear with me.

The orientation of the motor and fan on top of the cyclone body is very common. Most cyclones pictured are listed this way.

The cyclone I purchased (but have yet to assemble) was laid out to have the motor mounted on the floor. The motor was to be connected to the cyclone body via a 8" ducting. It turns out the blower and motor height is taller than the take-out of an 8" elbow. So there is the choice of sacrificing floor space or drum space. I am leaning towards losing the drum space.

Now am I thinking there may be another option. Flip the motor upside down and mount it to the side of the cyclone frame. Use the same 8" ducting to connect them. This would give a few more inches to the barrel height. Thoughts?

[David Kumm]

Take a look at the Aget type push through cyclones. The shorter cone is less efficient but still great for most wood chips and all but the fine dust and even a regular cyclone is mediocre at that so you aren't giving that much up. The elbow off the top of the cyclone can be pretty compact in a push through as well. Dave

I think dayton may have made a push through too.

[Michael W. Clark]

There are a couple of ways to skin this cat, but not any easy ones of-the-shelf that I'm aware of. David's suggestion for Aget cyclones is worth a look, but you may be looking used, as these are an industrial model.

The height of the dust bin is going to determine how much material is held before emptying, so as this gets shorter, the capacity goes down and the emptying frequency goes up. Also, you really need some dead space between the cyclone discharge and the top of the material in the dust bin. As the material level gets close to the bottom of the cone, dust gets re-entrained and sent to the filters. All the swirling Jamie is referring to starts happening in the cone and get caught up in the clean air return up the center of the cyclone. The lightest, smallest dust is often the first to get re-entrained.

You might consider some of the portable models, but make it stationary and put some distance between the cone discharge and top of the storage bin. Short, fat cyclones can be very efficient but often have a higher pressure drop so the system flow may be less than a more convential looking cyclone with the same HP motor and fan size.

You may also consider putting your own system together with two smaller cyclones in parrallel, splitting the flow so each cyclone is handling half the volume. This is more efficient (collection wise), but you would have two dust bins to deal with, the inlet ducting, and the outlet ducting to a common fan. It may be more than you want to get into.

Other options may not be a cyclone at all. The Thein Baffle may be able to be scaled up to the flow and power you are planning. I have only seen it discused here on smaller systems (1-2HP), but doesn't mean you can't make it bigger. You could also consider a drop-out chamber if you have real estate but no headroom. Basically make a box large enough to slow the air down and allow the heavies to fall out into a collection bin.

If you can discharge outside, you could blow it all into a bin. Just a thought...

Mike

[Graham Hutchinson]

Thanks everyone, these are all good comments and thoughts.

Graham

[Mike Ruggeri]

I was in this exact same situation. I mounted my cyclone so the motor was between the joists and then cut down my Onieda barrel to fit. I "cut from the bottom" of the barrel so that the top was untouched and getting a good seal wasn't an issue. For where I cut at the bottom, I curf-cut 1 1/2" x 3/4" of sollid wood and bent it and screwed it to the drum around the bottom. That allowed me to put a new 1/4 plywood floor in the drum and then I sealed the whole thing up with caulk to make it air tight. While my drum capacity is less than others, I don't find it to be an issue and actually makes emptying the drum more managable.

Mike

[Ryan Baker]

I had the same problem, and about exactly the same dimensions. I have an Oneida V3000 (3HP). With the short drum and stand, it fits just fine in the space. The motor extends up between the joists. That is one of the reasons I picked that model over some of the others. It works with no modifications. It may not have the capacity of a larger drum, but it meets my needs and is a lot easier to empty than a full-size barrel. (Those who fill up full size drums that quickly usually aren't in basement shops with height restrictions.) Not trying to influence your equipment choice ... just pointing out that there are some stock options out there that will work without modification.

Bear in mind that installing the unit in this type of situation can be a little difficult. You do not have the height to mount the motor assembly on top of the cone on the stand the way the Oneida instructions indicate (you can't get it high enough for the impeller to clear the housing). You need to assemble the motor to the rest of the cyclone, raise it, and insert the legs under it. That will require some helpers or some rigging. Tipping it up wouldn't clear either in my case. A wall-mount option may be a lot easier to use in this situation. Just check the measurements before you get too far into the assembly and be ready to improvise.

[Paul Wunder]

I have a ClearVue in my basement shop with the motor mount and blower hanging between the joists. I am also height challenged (90" including the joist space). I used a Penn State 35 gallon fiber drum to save height. It is a bit shorter with a larger circumference than others that I saw. With your space limits you could use that drum and cut enough off the bottom (perhaps 5-6") and still wind up with a 25 gallon+ drum installed in a conventional manner. The ClearVue was easy to mount between the joists.

[Graham Hutchinson]

Low Ceiling Height- split system.jpgSBS Complete Kit with Filters.jpgThanks again everyone. Paul, one of the models that I am considering is the CV1800 but the drum height is not the limiting factor. The two filters stacked end on end dictate the height. CV sent me some images today of a split installation. A bit more expensive but doable.

Graham

[Paul Wunder]

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...t=#post2071280

Graham,

The above link to an earlier post by me shows a split filter manifold that I made where the intake is at the top. I had only 90" to work with. While the picture shows an unfinished assembly, I added wheels underneath and added threaded rods as in your picture. You can make yours fit by decreasing the slope of the mainfold, reducing the height of the cleanout box and, if necessary, eliminating the wheels. Can't prove it, but I would think that the top-feeding intake would be more efficient than a side feeding one. One advantage of the CV1800 that I own is that it is very adaptable to various installation situations and thus allowed me to have a "real" cyclone with sufficient sucking power and separation.

[Jim Zolbe]

My Oneida Gorilla was about 3" too tall for my basement shop. So, I cut 3" from the stand legs, but that left the fiberboard collector barrel too tall. I used a Japanese saw to neatly cut a 3" ring section out of the barrel, kind of like "chopping" a hot rod. That left me with a barrel top, a barrel bottom, and a 3" tall ring. I cut about 1" out of the ring so it would fit 1-1/2" inside the barrel bottom like a coupler sleeve. When the bottom dried, I glued the barrel top over it. I used Titebond III, checked to be sure it was airtight, and it works great.