I need help deciding...

[Tom Langiewicz]

Santa brought me $500 to spend at Lie-Nielsen.... That's the good news. The bad news is that I have to decide what I need most... I was hoping Santa would decide for me...

Here is the short list:

#4 1/2 - I've WANTED (not necessarily need) one since the first time I opened their website
Shoulder plane - I do a lot of m&t joints and don't have one. I currently use an old 71 1/2 & pare the shoulders.
Skew rabbit - very versatile tool. I currently use an old #78 to cut rabbits & Tenon cheeks
Tenon saw - all joinery is cut with cheap Japanese saws.
Couple mortise chisels - I get by without...
Dovetail saw - Japanese saw again is what I use now
Draw bore pins - had ok luck just hammering the pegs through
Calendar - eye candy...

I want to start building my own saws (for my use, not sale) but I would like to know what a nice one feels like first. Also used back saws are non existent in this area.

I have a little room in my budget but not much, I could maybe stretch it to $550 or so before shipping.

I'm leaning towards the medium shoulder plane, iron skew rabbit, and the 16" tapered tenon saw.

Let me know your thoughts!

And have a Happy new year!

[Tony Zaffuto]

You've wanted a 4-1/2 forever? Go for it! With the remaining Monet get one of their saws!

[paul cottingham]

Smoothing plane, tenon saw, shoulder plane. What order depends on you. I couldn't work without any of them. Welcome to the slope.

[Gary Herrmann]

What Tony said. If you've always wanted a 4 1/2 and now have the funds, go get it.


You should now be properly enabled...

[Jim Koepke]

Not knowing much about the rest of you bench planes I can not make a good suggestion for or against the 4-1/2. If you buy it and do not like it you could likely sell it for close to what you paid and chalk the loss up to needed experience.

Draw bore pins is another thing that I wonder about. If things fit well when assembled, they will fit well when the pins are driven in. Maybe I am missing something. It seems the pins could distort the offset holes.

A shoulder plane seems like a nice thing to have, but I have one and prefer other methods.

For mortise and tenon work you may want to look at the free download of the February Popular Woodworking. It has a saw design for cutting tenon shoulders that may end the need to touch up the shoulders. It involves making a saw and special vise. Looks worth it to me if a lot of tenon work was coming up.

You may actually get more bang for the buck by purchasing the saws you mention. I have restored an old saw plate and made a handle for it that does very well. I was surprised at one of the tool shows to try out a few new saws without being able to discern any improvement over my own efforts. I was expecting something better than my own. Kind of strange being disappointed and elated at the same time.

As to mortise chisels... Yes, I can get by with other chisels but after you use one made for mortising, you will never want to go back. They's made for whacking hard and going deep.

I speak as just coming in from the shop after working on a 1" mortise. After about an hour of whacking away on some 1" straight sided chisels I dug out an old 1" framing chisel that is being rehabbed to finish the job.

Back to the shop now. Just came in because of remembering that I needed to enter the PW contest for the last prize.

jtk

[Chuck Darney]

I got a medium shoulder plane a while back - Veritas though - and was surprised at how much I use it to clean up some cuts. Keep it high on your list.

[David Weaver]

I'd get the large shoulder from LN and a saw or two with that money. Their saws are good quality, their shoulder planes are, too. The classic pattern smaller than the large makes my hands ache, though, and I'd go to LV for the medium (I couldn't think of a use for a small).

You could get the 4 1/2, but in my opinion, it's a heavy gentleman's smoother. That type is fine, though, as long as you're not using it for smoothing a significant amount of hand dimensioned wood (i.e., any smoother is fine to remove planer chatter). If you're hand dimensioning wood, you'll likely appreciate a #4 more, and probably a lighter plane than a lie nielsen.

[Tom Langiewicz]

I have quite a few older Stanley planes and the LN 4 1/2 would purely be just because I want it not because I need it. Does anyone have the LN #140? it seems like it would be a very usefull tool. I'm wondering if people actually use it as much as I'm thinking I would.

I was leaning towards the medium shoulder plane. Most of my M&T work so far has been on 4/4 stock and 2"-4" in width. It seems that the large shoulder would be bulky on this smaller stock.

I really need a back saw filed rip. So one of them is at the top of my list.

Thanks for the input so far!

[David Weaver]

I had one (#140). It looks more useful than it is.

[Chris Griggs]

Personally, I say either get the smaller 041 or get the Large. In my hand the LN medium (and I've only used it at shows) is sorta too narrow to do the work of a large shoulder plane but too big to be able to be used one handed and it lacks the handiness factor of a smaller shoulder plane. I have the LV medium which I really like but it actually falls half way between the LN med 042 and small 041 and be handled easily one hand.

I think the LN 041 is a fantastically comfortable, ideal sized shoulders plane. Its foot print is almost surprisingly small, but at 5/8" wide its still wide enough to handle the fast majority of rabbets and shoulders you'd encounter. I would buy it in a heart beat if I didn't already have the LV medium which is only 1/16" wider and thus is would be redundant...even with that I've still strongly considered buying 041 as its just really nicely proportioned plane. I like that LN large a lot too.

I guess think about what you want to use the plane for. Really neither the LN small or medium would be ideal for cheeks, so think if there are any other places the extra 1/8" of width in the med would be regularly needed. If it won't be and you really want a shoulder plane that is easy to wield 1 handed the 041 is super comfy and still packs plenty of punch.

If you want something to work cheeks also (unless you get a rabbet block or skew blockl) than go with the large.

Anyway, YMMV but I personally don't like the LN medium. Love the LN 041 and the large 073, but the medium feels out of proportion in my hands (YMMV YMMV YMMV)

BTW, I love having my shoulder planes for all sorts of tasks but almost never use it on tenon shoulders. I think it is much easier to be accurate and also faster just to cut slightly way from the scribed shoulder line and chop or pare right in the line with a chisel. You might find the same thing, so think about what tasks other than shoulders you may end up using it for and let that guide your decision.

[Jim Koepke]

In your picture it appears you have a Stanley #98 (without depth stop).

I find it useful for many tasks including trimming shoulders. If you find it useful, you may want to get #98 & 99 pair from LN and sell off the one you have.

jtk

[Tony Zaffuto]

I had one (#140). It looks more useful than it is.

You said a mouthful there Dave! I have a number of other tools I would also toss into this category, tools that talking heads supported by ad revenue, always talk about! My 140 is great at one thing: forever drawing blood from my fingers!

I suggest the 4-1/2 for the reason Tom said he always wanted one. I have one - Bailey or Bedrock, I don't remember, as that has been so long since I've even looked at it (think 4 or 5 or 6 years!). As far as smoothers go, I love my Clifton #3 and LN brass #4 w/HAF. I would endorse your suggestion of the LN large shoulder plane, and mine gets used regularly.