Testing a Kobalt Mill File

[harry strasil]

FWIW Dept, Years ago at a Blacksmith Convention we had a gentleman in who explained about files. Years ago files were what they classified as 101 points of hardness, which I assume means 1.01% Carbon content. This is extremely hard as Bearing races are 1.% carbon. Mondern files at that time were .95% of 95 points classification. At the time you could still get 101 point files, they were called industrial quality files. Don't throw your old good Nicholson files away, Resharpen them, which has been discussed on Sawmill Creek before. It used to be that the best Drill bits and Files that were Black Oxide finished were the best.

File usage is also a determining factor on how long they will last. Back in the day a good portion of a Blacksmiths time was spent filing and finishing things that he had forged. During my apprenticeship I was given a piece of 1 inch shafting and 2 files, one being a Bastard cut and the other a mill cut. These were the only two files I was allowed to use and I had to using only the files, form 1" long sections on the shaft, 1/4" round, 1/4" square, 3/8" round, 3/8" square and so on. I was repeatedly informed that drawing the files backward while resting on the material would dull them. Took me I think 3 days, and I was never so tired of filing, and my arms felt like they were gonna fall off. Years ago they made a handled file that had one safe edge that were made for filing the drags on Chainsaw Chain, which is really hard. There was an older gentleman that came around with a pickup full of used drill bits, files and milling cutters etc. He showed me how hard the handled files that were actually new were and I bought a dozen or so, I still have several of them and I never did wear one out.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

have you tested any files from Sears? I really do not know how to use a file or judge one but i found the Craftsman black oxide files much nicer than that variety pack of Nicholsons they sell at Home Depot but that is not saying much as in my hands the Nicholsons just kind of slid over everything leaving an odd scratch here and there.

I don't want to ask more work of George, but I'd also love someone's opinion of these - I believe they're Indian made - I've got one mill files from there, but haven't really put much use to it, nor payed attention when I had, although I remember it leaving a nice finish draw filing on brass. I had, however, grabbed a few of the taper files for sharpening saws when I saw they were on sale (which often is a bad sign at Sears - whenever I see something on sale it tends to mean they're no longer going to carry them, or they're switching to a new manufacturer, like they did with the Bessey-style clamps a while back) and they were certainly better than new Mexican Nicholsons, (although that's not saying much) Out of the box, they aren't feeling that much different than my Grobets from Lee Valley or Tools For Working Wood, but I haven't really put that much work into any of those files, having use d them just for a saw or two, and only on touch-ups. I'm know just enough to know when a file is terrible, but not much more - I guess I need to pay more attention to it.

I did the same as some others and grabbed some American-made Nicholsons when I found some on the backs of the racks. I got a larger 12 inch or so file, and was pretty pleased when I was actually able to put it to some work rehabbing a drawknife - couldn't file the hardest part of the edge, it obviously just skimmed across, but was able to work quite a bit of the backing steel, which just destroyed an import file.

[fred klotz]

New Old Stock

[fred klotz]

I've found Bahcos on the rack at my tool supplier (Oregon)

[Jonas Andersson]

I've cleaned many old rusty files in citric acid and with a brass wire brush. The difference before and after are huge.

[george wilson]

Actually,I have thought of reverse electroplating(electro stripping) the Kobalt and HF files to see if it would remove the tips of the supposedly bent back cutting edges of the teeth. It has been years since I have had my electroplating outfit out.

In the 50's,Sears sold "Kromedge" files. I did not THINK I liked them at the time. I don't recall why. But now,Rio Grande jeweler's supply sells "Valtitian" files for filing hard metals like platinum. I ordered some for the shop at work. I think they are hard chrome plated just like the old Sears Kromedge files of many years ago. They seemed to cut o.k.. I don't know if electroplated files can keep as keen an edge as unplated. Doesn't seem likely.

This Valtitian order was back before the good makers went South. I have no idea if they are still made by good makers. I think I noticed them for sale somewhere lately.

[Rick Markham]

What does NOS mean in this context?

New/Old Stock

[Joe Tilson]

I would like to know which file to purchase to sharpen saws with. I went by the HD the other day to try and purchase saw files. The guy says to me what kind of chain saw do you have? I said, none, I'm talking about hand saws, he says oh you just have to buy another saw, you can't sharpen those. I told him I have several saws from the early 1900's and I would like to sharpen them. He says, they don't make files for those anymore. I then left the store. Even on the internet it is hard to make out the files one needs for sharpening saws. Hellllllllllpppppppp! Yes, I don't know what to look for.

[Jim Foster]

Hear is a thread, google saw files and lots of info comes up

http://norsewoodsmith.com/content/un...saw-file-sizes

[Rick Markham]

So After reading Harry's post it pretty much tells ya new files will never be as good as the old good files! Interesting about not dragging back in the cut to keep them sharp, that's going to become habit for me. I have a small tidy stash of some decent USA made nicholsons. (I too am a tool pig, and thanks to George cleaned out my BORGs years ago.)

I'm glad you chimed in Harry, I've been thinking about you recently. There's a big local "Flywheelers" convention here coming up. I think I'm gonna be starting to accumulate some blacksmithing equipment. My primary target is a large hardened top anvil. Since moving into a new house, I have a very nice outdoor (covered) area for a forge an anvil and anything else!
Hopefully I will find some nice hammers, and other good stuff!

[John Coloccia]

Maybe i'll just make a forge this spring and start making decent files for us. It's frustrating, isn't it?

[Don Kingston]

Just the other day I was reading on a web site and got lost following the storyand ended up with great reading about files. It was the SIMONDS tool website as I was looking up the saws.
http://www.simondsint.com/handfiles/...le%20Facts.pdf
Either in this story or one on sharpening, the author feels that filing should have an apprentice ship and be a trade.
Great story and it convinced me. Though that has nothing to do with Mr. Wilson's topic of poor tools made today reading his tool test reminded me of the link.

[Mel Fulks]

Usually when I use a file I'm just sharpening a lawn mower. Old files are sitting all around in my basement,picked up one a while ago and noticed it was real sharp. It's a PLASTICUT made for plastic laminate and the luxurious solid plastics. Maybe good US files are still made for plastic. Never seen the brand sold by any place other than the plastic dealers.

[peter leyden]

I have a total of at least 145 files and rasps. The brands include Nicholson, Simonds, Heller, Johnson, Disston, Grobet, Arion, etc. 58 of the files are new, purchased at a time when these files were still made in the USA. If you are still looking for files, they are available. If interested, let me know and I will type up a list and get it to you.
Peter Leyden
p_leyden@hotmail.com

[phil harold]

I just got mine but they only sent one file not a ten pack...
what a rip- off
I have filed a complaint,
we will see what they will do about it

With some research I found that Bahco files are considered good ones and order this http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...A3BUJ4ZPESQSK2
10 files for $16 shipped , the only problem: delivery take a month.
Hope this may be helpful to some one, and thanks again guys