Stanley 4 1/2 Frog Problem - Chatter!

[Brian Mayeaux]

Hello,
The frog on my Stanley 4 1/2 that I picked up at an estate sale chatters a lot and wobbles when I loosen the screws that attach it to the base. I have tried using some gear grinding compound and sliding the plane frog against the flat of the plane base/flats to improve the fit but that doesn't seem to help. One thing that has helped is brass shim; with the screws partially tightened i can slide .002 in. brass shim stock at the back end of the frog, and this does reduce the chatter.

Is there another way to improve the fit? It is hard to get a file or other sanding tools down on the flat of the plane base even with the tote removed, so I'm at a loss on how to fix the wobble.
Thanks for the feedback,
Brian

[Jim Koepke]

Howdy Brian,

Congratulations on your first post.

The screws on the frog should be tight in use.

Any chance you live in the Pacific Northwest?

There are different approaches to this depending not only on the manufacturing time of your plane but also on what means you have available to work on the plane.

Is there any possibility of posting some pictures of the plane and the mating area of the frog to the plane's base?

Here is an old post on getting a plane to work:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...ker-to-Jointer

I think there is something in there addressing the seating of the frog.

jtk

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Brian

It sounds as though there is a high point(s) under the frog or on the base where the frog sits. One or the other is causing the frog to rock fractionally.

I would start with the frog (because it is easier). Just run a file over the surface and see if there is a high spot (it will show up shiny - or cover in marking fluid first if the surface is shiny from lapping). Remove any high spot. Replace and try and tighten up. If there is still movement do the same with the base.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Brian Mayeaux]

Thanks for the suggestions. I will post some pictures later today. I have some diamond sharpening plates and did rub the bottom of the frog against that but didn't check for a high spot; will look today. I also believe there is a high spot on the base flat but it's a small area so not sure how to address that. I have a small section of steel bar stock that has been flattened with a diamond stone, and I used that to rub the base flat with a little grinding compound - the rock is still there so I will try to mark high spots and post some pictures to you for comment. I'm considering taking it to a machine shop to try and mill the base flat about .001" to see if that helps but I don't want to do anything to mess this up. I would really like to use this plane.
I am in Texas.

[Derek Cohen]

Brian, if there is a high spot on the base, and it is away from the circumference, just grind it away. It does not matter if it is ground lower, as long as it is not a supporting surface. It could be this point by which the whole shebang is affected. A Dremel would work. Alternatively - and preferably - if you can get a short but wide coarse file in there, then that is the way to go as you could lower the high spot to the same level as its surrounds.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Matthews]

+1 on clamping it into a vise and filing.

It's the metal work equivalent of planing.
Even if you get a frog that's tilted laterally,
you can adjust the blade back to square.

A good file should make short work of this.

(I dress these on the edge of my granite sharpening base, with wet/dry sandpaper. It makes a huge mess, but it works.)

[Jim Koepke]

Even if you get a frog that's tilted laterally,
you can adjust the blade back to square.

I have seen that on later frogs and they can be bad enough to be outside the lateral lever lever's range to correct.

jtk

[Pat Zabrocki]

If it is a type that has a frog adjustment screw, it could be that the tab the fits into the groove is not sized properly. I have only had this occur once. the tab would not seat properly and was the reason the frog was not contacting properly. take the tab off and see if the frog seats properly. If it does find another tab or just file the opening of the tab a little to make it fit.
Pat