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Thread: Electrical service for "detached" garage/workshop in LA area

  1. #1
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    Electrical service for "detached" garage/workshop in LA area

    I'm looking at a couple of rental houses with detached garages that don't have any electrical service and running 6/3 cable underground for a 60 amp sub-panel is not an option due to concrete driveways and patios being in the way. Overhead cable appears to be my only option.

    I looked at one garage and it appears that they pigtailed cable near the weatherhead at the main house and ran it to another weatherhead at the garage. Is that how it's normally done?

    - Jason

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason White View Post
    I'm looking at a couple of rental houses with detached garages that don't have any electrical service and running 6/3 cable underground for a 60 amp sub-panel is not an option due to concrete driveways and patios being in the way. Overhead cable appears to be my only option.

    I looked at one garage and it appears that they pigtailed cable near the weatherhead at the main house and ran it to another weatherhead at the garage. Is that how it's normally done?

    - Jason
    No, HELL No. " Pigtail at the weather head" To me sounds like it is before the meter which is a BIG No No. What I would do is install a 50 amp breaker in your homes panel, then the garage panel would be a sub panel. Come out of the side of your home with an LB fitting, conduit up to a weather head, then overhead to garage. Being a sub panel you need four conductors Hot Hot Neutral Ground. Hope this helps

  3. #3
    You may be able to "mole" under the driveway and patio by renting a boring machine. On occasion, we'd have to bore under a short distance and bringing in a directional boring machine was too costly. So we'd rent a stand-behind boring machine like this:

    They are a bit hard to control and sometimes it takes a few tries but it works. You'd just need to be some distance back to allow for a gentle slope so it doesn't drill too deep.

  4. #4
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    Nope -- This is LA. Concrete as far as the eye can see!


    Quote Originally Posted by Julie Moriarty View Post
    You may be able to "mole" under the driveway and patio by renting a boring machine. On occasion, we'd have to bore under a short distance and bringing in a directional boring machine was too costly. So we'd rent a stand-behind boring machine like this:

    They are a bit hard to control and sometimes it takes a few tries but it works. You'd just need to be some distance back to allow for a gentle slope so it doesn't drill too deep.

  5. #5
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    That might actually be what they did on this particular house. I only gave it a quick glance. That said, I have seen a lot of sub-standard electrical work here in LA-LA land, so nothing surprises me anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Upton View Post
    No, HELL No. " Pigtail at the weather head" To me sounds like it is before the meter which is a BIG No No. What I would do is install a 50 amp breaker in your homes panel, then the garage panel would be a sub panel. Come out of the side of your home with an LB fitting, conduit up to a weather head, then overhead to garage. Being a sub panel you need four conductors Hot Hot Neutral Ground. Hope this helps

  6. #6
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    If I was going to go to all the trouble of running an overhead line, I'd sure consider going 100A. Yes the copper will be more but you'll end up with a better solution. But then, I was in my last leased place for 7 years before buying.. and YMMV.
    One can never have too many planes and chisels... or so I'm learning!!

  7. #7
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    Hey, Jim -- Yeah, It'll be quite awhile before we can buy a house again.

    I'd considered going 100-amps, but I have 60 amps in my current shop and it's been more than adequate for my needs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Neeley View Post
    If I was going to go to all the trouble of running an overhead line, I'd sure consider going 100A. Yes the copper will be more but you'll end up with a better solution. But then, I was in my last leased place for 7 years before buying.. and YMMV.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason White View Post
    Nope -- This is LA. Concrete as far as the eye can see!
    Then you're stuck with overhead. Now, you may be able to pigtail at the weatherhead, electric company companies often allow it, but you'd need them to make the connection and you'd need a meter installed on your garage. They would also most likely require a permit and application for another service. Some only allow one service for a single family home. If you connected the wires at the service head yourself, you'd be working with live wires.

    There are a few ways to feed your garage but all entail installing a second weather head on your home. I don't know your local codes so I can't tell you which would fly. If you want to know for sure, call your local inspector. Most are pretty willing to help.

  9. #9
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    How 'bout rigid metal conduit, essentially lying on the ground? (RMC, not EMT. RMC looks more like water pipe. You can't bend it, and it has threaded connections at the end.) That's how the detached garage at my house is fed. RMC goes out of the house, down to grade, along the edge of a concrete patio, and up into the garage. You can touch the top of the RMC in some places, but it is under a bit of dirt in other places.

  10. #10
    Overhead service from the house panel to the garage is doable, aluminum quadplex is the best choice between the weatherheads as a equipment grounding conductor is required w/ the feeder, 3-wire is no longer allowed since CA is on the 2011 NEC & it was prohibited in earlier editions.

    The PoCo's use aluminum triplex & it has a very good record of reliability.

  11. #11
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    First, I may not be reading it right, but overhead lines to detached garages was common till the early 60's. I just redid one on a rental house. If by pigtail, you are talking about before the meter, that is different.

    Secondly, since you are renting, it is very important to get written permission to do something like this. It is doubtful that many landlords would let you do it in the first place, and they certainly would require a permit for CYA purposes.

    All that being said, the upgrade of the overhead line is the best way to go. It's not that big a deal. The big deal is gonna be....how big a service comes into that old house in the first place? I have seen houses with as little as three breakers, and less than 60 A.

    Rick P

  12. #12
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    Hi, Rick -- From what I've seen, most of the older houses here in the San Fernando valley have 100-amp main panels, so I'm assuming I can safely run 6/3 cable overhead from one weather-head to another one on top of the garage. I'll let a pro handle that job. A surprising number of detached garages here have sub-panels already installed, but the wires feeding into them are too small for my needs.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Potter View Post
    First, I may not be reading it right, but overhead lines to detached garages was common till the early 60's. I just redid one on a rental house. If by pigtail, you are talking about before the meter, that is different.

    Secondly, since you are renting, it is very important to get written permission to do something like this. It is doubtful that many landlords would let you do it in the first place, and they certainly would require a permit for CYA purposes.

    All that being said, the upgrade of the overhead line is the best way to go. It's not that big a deal. The big deal is gonna be....how big a service comes into that old house in the first place? I have seen houses with as little as three breakers, and less than 60 A.

    Rick P
    Last edited by Jason White; 06-23-2014 at 12:36 AM.

  13. #13
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    Well, Jason,

    Sounds like if you can find one with a sub panel already installed, It wouldn't be too big a job to have an electrician do it up for you. In this scenario, you can probably get a landlord to go along with it...with a permit of course.

    Good luck in your hunt.

    Rick P

  14. #14
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    Any luck finding a place, Jason?

    Rick P

  15. #15
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    Yep, we just signed a lease on a place in North Hollywood. Nice big garage, too. House has a new 200-amp main panel, so we'll be getting electric run to the garage very soon!

    Thanks for asking!

    - Jason

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Potter View Post
    Any luck finding a place, Jason?

    Rick P

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