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Thread: Paneled Door Measurments

  1. #1
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    Paneled Door Measurments

    OK, a couple of easy questions.

    First off, I'm build ing some paneled doors and drawer fronts for a shop base cabinet project. The rail and stile bit set produces a panel slot that is 3/8" deep. So, my game plan was to cut the panel 1/4" smaller then the total inside slot measurement/s. This would leave an 1/8" gap all around for expansion. I'm using poplar.

    1. Is 1/8 expansion gap enough?

    2. The space balls I have are 1/4" in size, so I won't be using those. How do you keep the panel centered without using some type of material in the slot?

  2. #2
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    I'd make the expansion gap 3/16" and use Panel Buddies instead of Space Balls.
    Scott Vroom

    I started with absolutely nothing. Now, thanks to years of hard work, careful planning, and perseverance, I find I still have most of it left.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark W Pugh View Post
    OK, a couple of easy questions.

    First off, I'm build ing some paneled doors and drawer fronts for a shop base cabinet project. The rail and stile bit set produces a panel slot that is 3/8" deep. So, my game plan was to cut the panel 1/4" smaller then the total inside slot measurement/s. This would leave an 1/8" gap all around for expansion. I'm using poplar.

    1. Is 1/8 expansion gap enough?

    2. The space balls I have are 1/4" in size, so I won't be using those. How do you keep the panel centered without using some type of material in the slot?
    Why not use the space balls? 1/8 per side for the space balls is just fine. We use bags and bag's of them.

  4. #4
    Mark number one panel bunnies are less expensive number two space balls contains some kind of oil or silicone can mess your finish up it's been years since I've used space ball they may have changed their formula since. I also find panel buddies are easier to handle
    Thanks John
    Don't take life too seriously. No one gets out alive anyway!

  5. #5
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    The traditional approach (that is, pre spaceballs) is to make the panel very close to zero-clearance in the long-grain direction -- that is, the direction where there will be no expansion. In the cross-grain direction, you do make the panel with the necessary clearance. You assemble the door, center the panel, and put a small nail through the door frame into the panel in the middle. Or you can use a wood peg. The result is a panel that's centered in the door, and still can expand and contract across grain.
    Last edited by Jamie Buxton; 06-19-2014 at 2:01 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott vroom View Post
    I'd make the expansion gap 3/16" and use Panel Buddies instead of Space Balls.
    Somewhere on-line I read Space Balls require 5/32 spacing, so another 1/16 off my panels would work. I have not been able to locate what spacing is required for the Panel Buddies. Does anyone have that info?

    Thanks

  7. #7
    easy to make you own in any size you need - get a tube of silicone free caulk - cut the end to get the bead size you want - squeeze out beads on wax paper, let it dry overnight, cut into 1/4" lengths and store in a ziploc bag

  8. #8
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    I have been using foam backer rod (here's a link to some from the Blue BORG) that I cut into 1/4" wafers with a utility knife and place in the rail and stile grooves in lieu of space balls -- the foam weather stripping works perfectly and costs lots less than space balls. Never have had a door panel rattle.
    ______________________________
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  9. #9
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    I also use the same technique as Jamie,I wasn't going to say anything cause I thought everyone would think I was crazy.
    Never even heard of space balls until the internet.
    I also use a spot of glue to keep floating panels centered.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark W Pugh View Post
    Somewhere on-line I read Space Balls require 5/32 spacing, so another 1/16 off my panels would work. I have not been able to locate what spacing is required for the Panel Buddies. Does anyone have that info?

    Thanks
    An additional 1/16 won't hurt you but 1/4" is fine of your doors are of reasonable size. If you have very long stiles you may shave your panels but if they are normal size doors and drawer's I wouldn't even blink.

    I can't pathom the cost of extruding your own from another material but I guess it your doing one or two and the cost of a cup of coffee or two is an issue have at it.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Bolton View Post
    An additional 1/16 won't hurt you but 1/4" is fine of your doors are of reasonable size. If you have very long stiles you may shave your panels but if they are normal size doors and drawer's I wouldn't even blink.

    I can't pathom the cost of extruding your own from another material but I guess it your doing one or two and the cost of a cup of coffee or two is an issue have at it.
    My concern is not having enough space to jam the Panel Buddies in and have them allow for movement. How much can they be compressed and still allow movement? With a 3/8" slot, will an 1/8 allow them to be used? Or, do I shave another 1/8 off the total dimension and give myself 3/16 in order to use them?

    Thanks

    Bottom line. You guys that use them, and the space balls, what is the minimum room you allow in the slot for them?

  12. #12
    We have used spaceballs, with 1/8" clearance. We did have an instance of bleeding into the finish once, and will probably switch to panel buddies. I don't believe either is perfectly and indefinitely elastic, so I like to treat them as assembly aids to center the panel and add a spot of glue or a pin for the long term.

  13. #13
    Never had an issue with space balls. We run panels 1/4" under size but by the time they go in they are likely a shade over that (sanding profiles by hand).

    The only time I concern myself with the fit is on a very tall door with no mid rail.

    I simply can't see how long term elasticity could ever be an issue.. heck a wad of anything that would stick in there and not fall to the bottom of the door would do its job for many many years.

    The problem with cutting the panels long and centering left to right is that while very minimaly, your panel profile will appear shorter on the long grain ends than on the edge. To me at least if your making a bunch if doors consistency is the key. All parts the same, all assembly then same. 4 more space balls per door isn't going to bankrupt me. Of course if I was making enough doors to afford an insertion machine I'd be looking at alternatives.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Bolton View Post
    ..The problem with cutting the panels long and centering left to right is that while very minimaly, your panel profile will appear shorter on the long grain ends than on the edge...
    Make the panel blank the size it would be for zero clearance in both directions. Run your profile around all four edges. Rip whatever clearance you want off the long-grain edges. Done.

  15. #15
    Mark. my point about elasticity is just that down the road a solid wood panel may not stay centered without some more permanent fixing. Whether it's chewing gum or neoprene, eventually the spacer is going to loose its rebound. I may not be around to see it, but I do hope that at my advanced age it outlasts me.

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