Veneering Question

[Jay Jolliffe]

I have to make a table top that will be veneered. In the past I've used Baltic Birch for door panels & smaller projects. The top will be longer than the Baltic Birch that I can get. Regular birch would work but I'm afraid of it not being flat enough. Has anyone used MDO or Nova-ply to veneer?

[Mike Henderson]

I've veneered to solid wood without problems. An issue with solid wood as a substrate is that the solid wood expands and contracts. If you look at really old veneered furniture you may see splits in the veneer caused by the movement of the substrate (our ancestors didn't have Baltic birch or MDF). What you can do to help in that case is to put a layer of veneer across the grain of the solid wood, then the show veneer on top of that, aligned with the grain of the substrate.

Mike

[John TenEyck]

I wouldn't use MDO, but I would use MDF. I have no clue what Nova-ply is so I can't comment. MDF is probably the best substrate for veneer where a high degree of structural strength is not required. It's often used in table tops that are well supported. If that's not appealing, you can get Baltic birch in 4 x 8 ft sheets by ordering it through a full service lumber yard, or maybe a local cabinet shop. I recently was faced with the same issue and didn't want to order the Baltic birch. I ended up using poplar plywood from Home Depot and it worked just fine with my 1/16" shop sawn veneer. 60+ inches long and very flat and true.

Another option is to make a composite panel of 1/2" plywood sandwiched with 1/4" MDF on both sides as your substrate. That will give you the beautiful smooth and stable surface of MDF for the veneer as well as the structural strength of plywood.

John

[Thomas S Stockton]

Jay
Nova ply is a prefinished plywood product so I wouldn't use that, you might be thinking of apple ply which is a domestically produced plywood similar to baltic birch. On the west coast you can buy plywood that is 3/4" thick and has 1/8" mdf faces for veneering it is kinda spendy.
I wouldn't want to veneer over solid wood for a table top, I think you would be asking for problems down the road.
When I veneer something that size I use either mdf or a good quality plywood that has what is called a procore, which is a ply center and mdf under the face veneer.
I personally don't veneer over baltic birch anymore, I've had problems with warping. Comes out of the press flat and a couple of months later has moved a fair amount.
Tom

[Judson Green]

I've veneered over solid wood, though only recently, but it has been done for hundreds of years, nothing wrong with doing it today. If I was doing a table top I'd consider making my own stave core, it would be a little more stable... if "core locked" (like Mike's saying in his last sentence) then really stable.

I've veneered on MDF, thats easy, nice and flat.

The ply with MDF is cool. That might be a real good solution especially if you need to be conscious of the weight of the table.

I've used apple ply, but not for veneering. Good stuff.

A void just under the surface could be a real bummer if you used ply.

[Jay Jolliffe]

What I have to do is make a table that will have a Mahogany border on three sides, veneer the top with an outline of the island I live on in the middle. I was going to make a solid Mahogany top & inlay the shape of the island & decided the veneer might be easier....I've never tried to bond any wood to the edges of mdo so I'm a little leary about doing that. Would glue work bonding them together?

[Judson Green]

MDO or MDF?

The resin coating on MDO would lead me to believe it would not be a good candidate for veneer work. I used it a long time ago for outdoor signs.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mediu..._overlay_panel

If you mean MDF, then just about any of the common woodworking glues work just fine.

[Jay Jolliffe]

I did mean MDF....I guess I should read what I post .....Thanks

[John TenEyck]

Is this table top triangular? You said three sides. Anyway, I think I'd make a solid wood edge to fit around the MDF. I'd start with some stock about 1-1/2" wide and just a little thicker than the MDF. Then I'd cut a rabbet on both sides of the stock to leave a 1/4" tenon about 1/2" long. Then I'd route a 1/4" dado around the edge of the MDF top, on it's center line, using a piloted router bit. Glue in the solid edging, mitering the ends. Then I'd flush trim edging with the top and bottom and cut the top to final size, aiming to leave only 1/4 - 1/2" of solid stock at the edges. Now you have a nice MDF panel with solid edging for your veneer, and no worries of how to bond veneer or solid stock to the edge of MDF.

John

[Chris Padilla]

How John is describing is similar to what I did with shop-cut walnut veneer, walnut, and MDF. I built up a MDF sandwich of two 5/8" thick MDF to get 1 1/4" thickness. I then glued 1/2" thick walnut to the edges using biscuits and then flushed up where needed. Then I veneered my walnut veneer to the top and bottom faces. This puts the veneer line at the edge/"corner" of the piece where it is virtually hidden and I think it looks better. My tansu really looks like it was made of solid walnut (and its weight feels like that, too!!).

Here is the tansu thread: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?92396-Tansu

[Jay Jolliffe]

I was following your progress on the Tansu Chris....but I don't remember any finished pics...did you post any?.....I think I'm leaning towards your way & Johns.
How does MDF hold screws? One end goes against the wall & I'll have to fashion some sort of cleat or something against the wall...

[Judson Green]

MDF doesn't hold screws well at all. Pocket screws with the pocket in the MDF is OK.

But if your building this up (2 or more sheets) you could enbedd some real wood.


Edit: ment to say MDF doesn't hold screws in the edge.

[John TenEyck]

I was following your progress on the Tansu Chris....but I don't remember any finished pics...did you post any?.....I think I'm leaning towards your way & Johns.
How does MDF hold screws? One end goes against the wall & I'll have to fashion some sort of cleat or something against the wall...

If you glue and screw a hardwood cleat to the underside of the MDF top it will be fine. The screws will hold it until the glue dries, and the glue will be bonding the hardwood cleat to the veneer. It will never come loose.

John

[Chris Padilla]

I was following your progress on the Tansu Chris....but I don't remember any finished pics...did you post any?.....I think I'm leaning towards your way & Johns.
How does MDF hold screws? One end goes against the wall & I'll have to fashion some sort of cleat or something against the wall...

Yep, at the very end of the thread, I posted several pics of the final completed piece.