?s for owners of well water/septic systems...

[Dan Hintz]

SWMBO and I are considering purchasing a house that uses well water and a septic system, I believe built in the mid-80's... having lived with city water/sewage all of my life, I have some concerns. I've read the usual pro/con articles on Google, but I'd like to get some first-hand experiences with them.

Water:
Power goes out, so no running water... pretty straightforward con, so do most solve it with a backup power source, or just "suck it up, Buttercup"? I imagine all minor taste/color issues are resolved with a decent reverse osmosis / water softener system?

Septic:
A bit more of a concern for me. We already don't throw grease and such down the drain (people do that?), but we do like our garbage disposal... I see some still use theirs, but is it really a problem with overloading the system? How often do you have solids pumped (I see estimates from every 2-20 years... pretty wide range!)? How long do the tanks/fields last if properly maintained, i.e., is this something we may need to replace soon if it's the original system? Other than tossing in some bacteria every few months and having it pumped every couple of years, is it pretty much like business as usual (it's the two of us and one child), assuming the system was cared for properly in the past?



Anything else I'm missing or should be concerned about with either system? Assuming the rest of the house is in good order, this seems like a good deal... more than double our current square footage and 2 acres of wooded/landscaped land.

[David Weaver]

On town water now, but grew up with a septic and four people in the house. Parents are still on it and with well water.

In general, I thought the water from the well was FAR better than town water, even the town water run through something rudimentary like an activated charcoal filter. We had a particle filter, but that was it. It became brown surprisingly quickly, though we didn't have to change it more than four times a year. I guess if you don't have a filter, you just drink that stuff and it goes through, the water otherwise looked clear and looking at a foot long round filter element that had 15,000 gallons of water through it is probably misleading about how dirty the water actually is.

FIL is using a softener, and because his water didn't test well in terms of bacteria, a UV system to kill the bacteria.

We didn't throw *anything* down the drain. I'm sure the septic can handle it, but when it comes down to it, what we had could either go in the woods (or a compost pile) or in the trash and really not amount to much additional work compared to the convenience of just dumping food waste into the garbage disposal. With four of us on the system, we had to have the septic pumped about every 5 or 6 years, IIRC.

My wife and I still don't put much down the disposal even though we're on town water and sewer, because we grew up not doing it. In my head, it just seems like the more liquid and less solid that line out of the house and to the street has, the fewer troubles I'll have.

[Chuck Darney]

We've always had well water and septic tank.

For water, you're right...no power, no water. Unless your power goes out frequently and for long periods of time, this isn't too much of an issue. My power WOULD go out frequently and for long periods of time - several days were possible. I finally got a standby generator that can handle the entire house. It has helped a couple of times and I consider it money well spent. For me the lack of water for the times the power was out was less of a concern than the lack of heat since the natural gas furnace blower wouldn't work. This was a much greater concern when the kids were young. A week without power in January was not much fun.

We have our septic system pumped every two or three years. We probably don't need it that often now that the three kids are out of the house and it's just me and my wife. I asked the guy who pumps the system about the bacteria additives and he said they were a great scam that have very little, if any, effect. If you get the system pumped, do it again in two years. You'll have a good sense of the buildup and may find that two years is too soon...or too long.

In general, septic systems are failing from the day they're installed. Properly maintained they should last a long time though.

I've never had a garbage disposal so I really can't speak to how it would affect my septic system

[Tom M King]

Water quality, and volume, depends on the well, and type of well. Ours is a "deep" drilled well in granite, and I wouldn't trade the water for any other. On our third pump in 34 years. I put in a constant pressure Grundfos system the last time, and it's a big improvement over the old pressure switch that allowed a 20 pound variation. A generator is needed anyway, so when a hurricane knocks out the power for any length of time, the well gets run along with the other stuff on the generator.

Septic tank is not much of a worry if the land perks well. There are some newer types of systems for the drain lines these days that work a lot better than what was used in the past. Here, pumping the tank is subsidized by the county, and it only costs a hundred bucks. Even at that, every five or six years has worked just fine here. No garbage disposal here, but I have thought about putting one in that went to the compost pile.

I hang the pump on a stainless steel cable. At the top of the well, there is a loop in the cable with about twenty feet of extra length. On the cable below the loop is a pulley attached to a short piece of chain. When the pump needs to be pulled, I park the front end loader over the well, with the bucket up over the top of the well, put the chain with the pulley in the chain hook on top of the bucket, loop attaches to truck hitch, and the truck pulls the pump right out. It also eases it back in. A couple of helpers handle the pipe and wire as it goes in and out. This has saved me many hundreds of dollars and time waiting for a well guy to get there.

[Prashun Patel]

I don't have well, but I do have septic. My intimidation of septic has diminished over the 10 years I've owned it. Ours is relatively new, though: 2003.

The maintenance isn't bad. I never throw bacteria into it proactively. I just have it pumped every two years (we're a family of 4). Occasionally the cleanout ports in the field get clipped by a lawn mower, so it's about as easy to fix as a broken sprinkler head on an irrigation line.

I am unsure if the technology has changed much over time. Our system is passive: sewage goes into a tank, the 'compost tea' rises in the tank to an overflow point where it drains into a leaching field. The field itself is largely a series of perforated pvc pipes and rock and sand. As long as the surface of your field is free of everything but grass, the system should last indefinitely if well maintained. I imagine the system should last about as well as your indoor plumbing does. I am unsure what kind of piping they used in the 80's, though.

My only gripe with the system is that it is in our usable yard. So it has done funny things to the grass over the field, and we are not allowed to build, drive, or install over the components.

My partner has a well. He has a battery backup for the pump. His issue is pressure - especially for lawn irrigation.

[Jamie Buxton]

A different fix for the water supply during power outages is a larger water tank. Most well tanks operate by the well pump pressurizing the storage tank, so you do have pressure for a while after the electricity goes out. How long depends on how big your tank is. And if you can place the tank above the house, you can use gravity to feed the house during an electrical outage. Gravity never goes out.

Need for a water filter depends on your water. Maybe you have sediment in yours, or maybe you have minerals like iron, or maybe sulphates (rotten eggs smell). Your local well service guy likely knows what your aquifer supplies. Or you live with what's already on the property, and see if you want to add more kinds of filtering.


Yeah, living with a septic system is pretty much like living with a sewer system. Don't put stuff down it that you shouldn't. Pumping frequency depends on how many people are using the system.

[Mark Bolton]

In our experience the main issue with septic is waxes, detergents. Those are the main killers of a leach field. The waxes and oils in manufactured detergents and cleaning products as well as other sources continually coat the leach field eventually reducing the absorption of the soil. That said, with so many more environmentally friendly detergents out now (even in the main steam products) it's getting better.

Anything organic is broken down over time which is the way it's suppose to work.

The only other major septic killer is when a baffle falls off in the tank and allows solids to flow into the leach. There is a crust layer and of course anything that floats at the top of the tank (paper, corn, and.. well, floaters, but those are less common in the US with poor diets hah.. everything sinks). If the baffle falls off in a conctete tank or a PVC baffle comes off and you don't realize it for some time you can destroy your leach in short order. Generally the pumping company checks the baffles when they are pumped but if not caught in time....

Wells are so variable it would be nice to get a water sample to know for sure.

You've covered the power issues...

[Matt Meiser]

If the baffle falls off in a conctete tank or a PVC baffle comes off and you don't realize it for some time you can destroy your leach in short order. Generally the pumping company checks the baffles when they are pumped but if not caught in time....

This is really easy to fix too, and inexpensive. If you are willing to do it yourself, its about $10 worth of PVC. I GLADLY paid $100 to have it done

[Dave Sheldrake]

I have two unused wells, both into granite bedrock, one is 65 feet the other 130 feet but both sell fill to within 5 feet of the surface due to a natural spring. It used to be the supply for the entire village about 200 years ago.
We don't use either but were told a pumping system could be installed that would both draw the water and keep it clean. I'm toying with the idea of using well water plumbed in for sanitation such as Toilets but don't really want all the hastle of using it for drinking water.

cheers

Dave

[Wade Lippman]

Some well water is good and requires nothing more than a filter. Other is disgusting and requires extensive treatment. I wouldn't worry about the first, but wouldn't go near the second.

Around here we have nothing but shale, so septic systems are expensive and difficult to maintain since the ground won't absorb water. Probably not a problem for you, but worth checking out first.

Personally I wouldn't be without public utilities, but there is always a trade off. Two miles down my road the utilities end and the home prices drop significantly.

[Lee Schierer]

Before you buy the house have the well and septic tested, including a flow test on the well, to make sure they are okay. Failed septic systems can be very expensive to repair or replace as most locales have stricter rules now on what can and can't be done. We had to change our system when the leach field failed and it cost $18,000 for a new approved system. My daughter had to replace hers in NJ at a cost of $12,000. Septic systems typically last for 20-30 years depending upon the soil before serious work needs to be done.

We've had well and septic for over 35 years in our current house. With regard to no water when the power goes out, your pressure tank will hold a reserve of water that can be used. Since we use our well for our heat system in addition to household water we have a large pressure tank that gives us up to about 45 gallons of water depending upon where in the discharge fill cycle the power goes out. We use the water sparingly, but since power outages in our area are usually short we've not had a problem running out.

Using a garbage disposal will add to the load on the septic system and you will probably need to get it pumped more often. Also, using a septic additive like Bio Sure or Rid-Ex will help and does no harm.

[Brian Elfert]

I'm in the process of buying a house with septic and well so I've done some research. I also have friends with septic systems. In the area I am moving to the water table is fairly high with lots of wet areas. Almost all new septic systems are mound systems instead of a traditional leach field system. Older houses with the original systems still have leach fields, but most will need mounds when they fail. Traditional septic systems with leach fields locally seem to last 20 to 30 years before they fail. My friend bought a 1970s hose in 2000. He dodged a bullet because the septic failed inspection and the seller had to pay for a new system.

The state of Minnesota requires pumping every three years. Some will install a garbage disposal since the tank needs to be pumped fairly often. I talked with a septic inspector and he doesn't recommend a garbage disposal on any septic system.

The house I am buying had a new mound septic system installed in 2011. That is one reason I choose the house. I would much rather have city services as any savings from no utility bill are quickly eaten up by pumping and eventual replacement costs.

[Dave Anderson NH]

The rules vary by situation and location Dan. Lee is correct. The first step is testing of the well and septic. Any offer should be based on the results as fixing or replacing either is a major cost. I have a 380ft drilled well delivering 75gpm which cost me $10,000 3 years ago to replace an overrated and under delivering well put in by the contractor who built the house 25 years ago. Being empty nesters we pump out the 1200 gallon septic tank every 3 years strictly to keep my wife happy though the pumping contractor told us with our small load every 5 years was plenty. Being in a northern climate and having had at least one power outage of 2 days or more for each of the last 5 years we finally put in a 14kw propane powered auto start generator system. Being without water or heat for 6 days in NH in mid December is not much fun. Before getting the generator I figure we threw out a total of over $2000 in food from our refrigerator and freezer during the 4 major outages and I might be seriously underestimating. For comfort, convenience, and peace of mind the expense of the generator system was well worth the money spent.

[David Weaver]

Some well water is good and requires nothing more than a filter. Other is disgusting and requires extensive treatment. I wouldn't worry about the first, but wouldn't go near the second.

Around here we have nothing but shale, so septic systems are expensive and difficult to maintain since the ground won't absorb water. Probably not a problem for you, but worth checking out first.

Personally I wouldn't be without public utilities, but there is always a trade off. Two miles down my road the utilities end and the home prices drop significantly.

I'd imagine that it won't be too long before they get extended and those folks are forced to go online with the utilities. Where my parents are, public sewer is being run first, and there is an option to take it now and have a subsidized hookup (half or something?) or defer and pay full price to get hooked up later (can't remember the required date to go online, 5 years from now or something). That ruffles the feathers of the people who have a good septic and water that tests well, but that's just the way it goes, I guess. 25 years ago, there wasn't any public water within several miles...never would've believed that at 4 miles outside of town, that they'd ever be required to be on town water and sewer. Water will come a few years longer down the road, but it will follow.

[Ryan Mooney]

The first step is testing of the well and septic. Any offer should be based on the results as fixing or replacing either is a major cost.

This this this.

If the well water looks, smells or tastes bad it can be terribly hard or impossible to fix so run the taps and smell it when it first runs out and after its run a bit and take a drink. Send a sample off to be tested (the local ag extension will usually do this pretty cheap). If you can get the original well reports those are useful to have as well as well as any recent maintenance records (how new is the pump? the pressure tank?). Finding out if there are points of unusual wear is also useful (like is the well pumping up sand - which can be hard on the pump).

Also cost to run a well varies depending on local (electricity) and depth. The last house we ran about $180/mo in extra electric in the summer (at $0.07/hw our winter bills were < $100 and summer bills > $280, we didn't run AC much but did use electric heat so the majority of the summer cost was the pump) for the pump to water the trees and pasture. That was on a 320' well with a 40gpm pump. So if you can get the previous years electric bills from the seller (can't hurt to ask ). If not you can do some math on the depth and expected volume and get a rough idea.

Septic maintenance varies wildly depending on the terrain and install. Get a qualified septic inspector out to give it a once over. Not cheap but a lit cheaper than finding out you have to remediate once you're in there!