Buying houses... Brian was right :-/

[Wade Lippman]

That's in a rural county. I'd say that's a fairly normal price for that size house. Most houses regular people live in are in the $150K-220K range.

It's showing the taxes for it at $3,600 per year for 2013.

There are many others like it on Zillow. Go to zillow.com and enter "Hanover, VA".

I live in a surrounding county. I couldn't afford to live in the mother-in-law suite in that size house

Around here the taxes on that house would be $12,000. One county over (where Rochester is) they would be $20,000.

I always thought our taxes were sky-high because our values were so low, but our average house price is probably $150,000, so the discrepancy is not large.

Our income tax is about the same as yours, but our sales tax is higher. Gotta get out of NYS!

[Chris Padilla]

Well, here in SILLY-con Valley (SF Bay Area), I can understand Dan's plight. Real estate here is pretty crazy as well and homes get multiple bids. I recently received a personal hand-written note (snail mail) from someone wanting to know if I'd sell them my house. They even put a price in there that was about 25-50k more than I think my house is worth! I showed it to my wife and she immediately tossed it in the recycle bin. Sure, we could sell our house and walk away with 100%+ equity (purchased in 1999) but our mortgage would go up (i.e. monthly cash flow would decrease) finding a new place. I outgrew my 2-car garage-ma-hal workshop 10 years ago and I'd LOVE to get a place with a 3 or 4 car garage but I'm not sure I want it THAT badly. Our daughter doesn't go to the best middle school but it isn't bad and they've improved their rankings/scores every year. Her eventual high school also isn't the best but it is reasonable and not so bad that I want to pay to send her elsewhere. I'll pay for college but I'm already paying for public school via 7k/yr in property taxes. I guess when we retire we might finally sell but then we'd have to leave the area and we would never be able to afford to get back into it...and that might just be fine. 15-20 years to go...ugh!!

[Steve Peterson]

If you see a house that you really like, you need to act fast. The good houses get sold really quick and get taken out of the MLS system, while the problem houses stay on the market for years. It skews the average quality of the houses in the MLS system. If you only look at the new listings, you have the best chance of finding a good house before it is gone. It is frustrating to look at all the old listings of problem houses.

Steve

[Jerome Stanek]

If you see a house that you really like, you need to act fast. The good houses get sold really quick and get taken out of the MLS system, while the problem houses stay on the market for years. It skews the average quality of the houses in the MLS system. If you only look at the new listings, you have the best chance of finding a good house before it is gone. It is frustrating to look at all the old listings of problem houses.

Steve

That sounds like real estate talk around here there are a lot of houses that are a good value and have been o the market for a while. Neighbors house was for sale for 10 months and sold because they had a new house built and couldn't afford 2 payments.

[Brian Elfert]

That sounds like real estate talk around here there are a lot of houses that are a good value and have been o the market for a while. Neighbors house was for sale for 10 months and sold because they had a new house built and couldn't afford 2 payments.

I think Steve is right. I see good houses sell within days. There was a house that looked perfect for me by looking at the MLS listing. I asked my agent to set up a showing and it was already sold after just a few days.

If a house has been on MLS for 30+ days I start to wonder if it is overpriced or something is wrong with it.

[Shawn Pixley]

Dan, I feel for you. I have followed the other thread without commenting. I'd like to suggest some things.

The question you may need to ask is, "how scarce is what I would like relative to the general market?" If the house and property that you are looking for are common, you have a reasonable chance of finding one for a reasonable price. If, on the other hand, you are are looking for a property that is a fraction of 1% of the general market, you will be looking forever and still not finding it at a reasonable price.

While at the end of the day you'll write one check for a house and the land it sits on, when shopping for houses knowing the fundamentals of land valuation can help you to determine whether what you are looking for is viable or not. For instance, in my neighborhood a 3,500 square foot lot goes for $750 without a building. (No, I didn't pay near that). For several of the first generation houses from the sixties, the houses are actually liability relative to the land value (the 1000 sf house and land going for less than $750K. If I wanted any property of an acre or more in size, I would need to move 20 miles further away from where I live (I am already 20 miles from my employer).

Everything in real estate is about location and timing. Property in rural Iowa has a very different value than land in Southern California. Cheap land in Iowa doesn't help me much. An just because I would like a 4,000 sf house on the beach in Malibu for under a million dollars, doesn't mean I could ever find it. When I am looking for land / buildings for my job, I have found that a comprehensive understanding of the market (commercial real estate for my job) can help you detemine whether what you are looking for is viable in the area you are considering.

We looked for 3 years to find the house we are in now. It was very frustrating. We toured probably 100 homes before getting this one. Was the house perfect? No. But is satisfied enough of the criteria that we bought it. A week doesn't go by without someone encouraging us to sell our house and move to a bigger, more expensive one. I am not interested in that at all.

Good luck in the search. I am pulling for you.

[Bob Rufener]

Reading your thread makes me smile. We live in SE Wisconsin. We have 18 acres, a pond, a 2300 sq ft house (built in 1975 with a lot of my sweat) a basement shop and walk out basement. We pay $4000 for taxes and our local school is a good K-8 school that feeds into a nearby high school with a great technology department. I deer and duck hunt in my back yard. For $500K I'll walk out tomorrow and leave the furniture. I guess it is all about location, location, location. People around here who complain about their property taxes should read the replies to your thread and be happy for what we have.

[Brian Elfert]

Property taxes even from one county to another can vary dramatically. Where I was living I was paying $4,800 in property taxes per year and the next county over a similar house valued the same is $2,800 to $3,000. The county I was living in includes the city of St Paul, Minnesota so the county had a lot of extra costs for social services.

[Scott Shepherd]

Around here the taxes on that house would be $12,000. One county over (where Rochester is) they would be $20,000.

I always thought our taxes were sky-high because our values were so low, but our average house price is probably $150,000, so the discrepancy is not large.

Our income tax is about the same as yours, but our sales tax is higher. Gotta get out of NYS!

Come on down, Wade! Just leave the crazy taxes at the state line

[Rick Potter]

Dan,

Is it possible to find a smaller house with a lot big enough to add what you want? That way you can get the improvements the way you want them, not someone else.

Rick Potter

[Mark Bolton]

Reading your thread makes me smile. We live in SE Wisconsin. We have 18 acres, a pond, a 2300 sq ft house (built in 1975 with a lot of my sweat) a basement shop and walk out basement. We pay $4000 for taxes and our local school is a good K-8 school that feeds into a nearby high school with a great technology department. I deer and duck hunt in my back yard. For $500K I'll walk out tomorrow and leave the furniture. I guess it is all about location, location, location. People around here who complain about their property taxes should read the replies to your thread and be happy for what we have.

That is my reaction but of course obviously neither of us has the location based needs for professions, children/visitation, and so on.

I live in a area of the country where major incomes are hard to come by for the average joe (WV). I own 115 acres with a house on it that I paid 50K for the land and have very little in the home (my profession). My tax bills for a few properties and personal property just landed this week. The taxes on the property and residence are 440.80/year. Same as you, good K-8 in town and decent highschool but its a good bus ride away for the kids. I also own a commercial building (my shop) which I hate to even say what I paid for it, lets just say less than a decent used car, but its 4K+sq' and right on the main drag and my taxes on the shop and land are 226.24.

All that said, there are a lot of accommodations that one must appreciate to live in the country. Its nothing against Dan in any way but people shopping for million dollar homes just arent going to live here.

[Dan Hintz]

For all you guys who can get a sweet house for a few hundred $k... I hate you ;-) Being midway between the Baltimore and D.C. beltways (about 20 minutes without traffic... which never happens, of course) has its advantages... a lot of jobs in the surrounding areas. But an obvious disadvantage is housing will not be cheap. I look at it as a long-term investment... the housing costs more than in most areas of the country, but I make more, too, so all of the money I put into the house will (hopefully) be available sometime down the road. If I move to a cheaper area, I can still get a sweet place and possibly have a little retirement money left over.

What are the property taxes on an $800K house? Around here, they'd be $1500 a month or so, and they're only going to go up as the local tax base ages and the local school district workers age and have higher (active and retirement) benefit and compensation costs.

Having a kid in the "top school" is a bit of an overrated thing, in my opinion. Above average with good AP options in high school is plenty, the rest is up to the parents (in building good habits) and genetics. People around here spend all of their money to get their kids into more or less three different districts, and then get taxed to death, and a lot of them have kids that are average or only slightly above average, and they need better parents more than they need better schools (in terms of focusing the kids academically).

Proprty tax in this county is $1.014/$100 of valuation. If you add in fire, garbage, sewage, etc., taxes come to a round $1.30/$100. On a $1mil home that's around $1,100/month... not wonderful, but a tax I'm willing to pay for a nice area. I don't think ours would be quite that much because it's well water and septic systems, so that's a small savings.

Our munchkin is a smart cookie, but I know she'll fall behind if we don't keep her interested (she's like me that way). We have already gotten a poor feeling for how her first year would go in the local middle school, whereas she would be in some quality advanced programs in the new one. She'll either be an engineer or an artist... I'm hoping both.

Dan, I feel for you. I have followed the other thread without commenting. I'd like to suggest some things.

The question you may need to ask is, "how scarce is what I would like relative to the general market?" If the house and property that you are looking for are common, you have a reasonable chance of finding one for a reasonable price. If, on the other hand, you are are looking for a property that is a fraction of 1% of the general market, you will be looking forever and still not finding it at a reasonable price.

While at the end of the day you'll write one check for a house and the land it sits on, when shopping for houses knowing the fundamentals of land valuation can help you to determine whether what you are looking for is viable or not. For instance, in my neighborhood a 3,500 square foot lot goes for $750 without a building. (No, I didn't pay near that). For several of the first generation houses from the sixties, the houses are actually liability relative to the land value (the 1000 sf house and land going for less than $750K. If I wanted any property of an acre or more in size, I would need to move 20 miles further away from where I live (I am already 20 miles from my employer).

Everything in real estate is about location and timing. Property in rural Iowa has a very different value than land in Southern California. Cheap land in Iowa doesn't help me much. An just because I would like a 4,000 sf house on the beach in Malibu for under a million dollars, doesn't mean I could ever find it. When I am looking for land / buildings for my job, I have found that a comprehensive understanding of the market (commercial real estate for my job) can help you detemine whether what you are looking for is viable in the area you are considering.

We looked for 3 years to find the house we are in now. It was very frustrating. We toured probably 100 homes before getting this one. Was the house perfect? No. But is satisfied enough of the criteria that we bought it. A week doesn't go by without someone encouraging us to sell our house and move to a bigger, more expensive one. I am not interested in that at all.

Good luck in the search. I am pulling for you.

No way we could really put any sizeable addition on the house here, the lot just isn't big enough to support it, not to mention the surrounding area would not provide a high enough value buffer... houses around here are going for $250-$350k, and we're already near the top of the mark with that range. It was a starter home for SWMBO when she first got married, but now that I'm in her life and she has moved up in the world a bit since the original purchase, it's time to stop living in an area that doesn't offer us the life we think we should become accustomed to Land alone has often gone for $600k/acre in this general area, so I don't feel like I'm being taken... I just wish it wasn't that way. When new houses are built, there's practically a line out of the door to purchase... the fact that there's still a lot left at all says we're already lucky, I just have to decide if that luck is something we wish to make us of.

[Brian Elfert]

Proprty tax in this county is $1.014/$100 of valuation. If you add in fire, garbage, sewage, etc., taxes come to a round $1.30/$100. On a $1mil home that's around $1,100/month... not wonderful, but a tax I'm willing to pay for a nice area. I don't think ours would be quite that much because it's well water and septic systems, so that's a small savings.

Jobs must pay way, way better out there than in Minneapolis, MN. I consider myself pretty well paid, but nowhere near enough to pay for a $1 million house with $1,100 a month in taxes. Heck, some of the houses I've looked at the mortgage without taxes and insurance would only be $1,100 a month. Most of the houses I'm looking at the taxes could be paid for with two months of what you might be paying.

It seems like a private school might be a lot cheaper if your main reason to move is for your child's school.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

These are all what I call "first world problems."

[Mark Bolton]

but now that I'm in her life and she has moved up in the world a bit since the original purchase, it's time to stop living in an area that doesn't offer us the life we think we should become accustomed to

Wow.. I guess maybe that just read bad,.. but with that I guess I'd just increase your budget to 2-3 mil... ;-)