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Thread: Jointer question for the transitional neanderthal

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    3,441
    I don't own a powered Jointer, but I wish that I did. If I had the space, I would purchase (in this order):


    1. Drill Press
    2. Band Saw
    3. Jointer


    I do own a thickness planer, so, if I want to use power, I use a sled. I may knock some of the really high spots with a scrub plane (they sure do remove a lot quickly), and then I can use shims or a glue gun to fill in the gaps so that the board cannot be pushed flat. This method works best if you can apply shims (and similar) while the sled is sitting ready to slide into the planer. I usually shim with the sled on my bench and then I need to transport the entire heavy assembly without knowing things loose. One other issue with this is that milling can change the stresses in the board, so, if you set everything and then mill it "perfect" while on the sled, things may have moved a bit. They will certainly be significantly improved but may not be perfect. I suppose that there is also the question of "was it shimmed properly".

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Chicago-ish
    Posts
    352
    One thing that's great about becoming a "blended" after being a "neander": you don't worry about snipe or boards moving because you happy about all the work that was done for you... and you know how to fix the little bit of work that is left!
    clamp the work
    to relax the mind

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Wild Wild West USA
    Posts
    1,542
    One has to split a lot of boards to recover the cost of . . . a . . . resaw capable band-saw.
    Stop thinking like that !
    Spoils ALL the fun.
    Just buy the dambed bandsaw.

    What ? I suppose women think "I wonder if I will recover the cost of this diamond ring by _____".
    Nahhh they want it they buy it, or more likely get you to buy it, and . . .
    enjoy it.

    I never thought "recover cost". I needed to cut up some wood and Queenmasteroftheuniverseandbabybunnytrainer had had enough of helping me resaw by hand.
    (actually she was still a tiny bit still game but . . .
    frankly I had had enough of wasting so much time and energy trying to resaw longish planks).

    Easy choice even for someone as
    obsessed with human powered work as I am.
    Ride my bike every day to work, even in the snow ? NO PROBLEM. Resaw eight foot bubinga planks by hand by my self ?
    Ha, ha, ha.
    Nah dude, nah

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    Sharpening is Facetating.
    Good enough is good enough
    But
    Better is Better.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    San Diego (North Park)
    Posts
    63
    Giving up or keeping the jointer will depend on what you want to build....and how long you want to spend building it. My hand tool enthusiasm has increased steadily for the past ten years but I've had absolutely no inclination to get rid of my Delta X5 6"Jointer. It is easy to adjust and works great (for nine years). I have a 13" planer but rarely use it. Often I will use hand tools only to build a project just for the satisfaction.....but the jointer is there if my mood changes or time becomes an issue. My shop is for my pleasure so I won't try to prove any prowess by eliminating something that has performed so well for me when I chose to use it. I also have and ECE jointer plane, a clifton #6, stanley #8 as well as a full compliment of jacks, smoothers and specialty planes.....because I enjoy using them....and they haven't diminished my appreciation of the Delta X5.
    I just started a class making ladder back chairs from green wood....like the ones Brian Boggs & Jennie Alexander promote. I'll be using spokeshaves, drawknife, shaving horse, axe, froe but no jointer.....but it will be there just in case.
    good luck,

    Don

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Apex, NC
    Posts
    549
    Thanks for all the replies, guys. And the PMs. (I received several, I may not have replied to all, but I do appreciate them.) I'm still sort of mixed on the idea; I've heard a lot of good reasons to go without (sled, jack plane, etc.), and a couple of other tools mentioned for work (I have them), but I've also heard several replies from others that have similar neck issues and recommend sticking with electrons for the stock prep phase. I suppose I was hoping to be convinced that I didn't need it and was looking for others to agree, and now I've waded deep into the pool of "you're right back where you started." *sigh*

    Well, one way or another, the jointer is going - it won't fit, and I'm not installing 220V in this garage. It will cost far more than it's worth to me, since the landlord is pretty strict about how such a thing would be accomplished. Now I just have to decide whether to get a smaller one or not. Perhaps I've been looking at it the wrong way - perhaps the question should be, "If I'm forced to have no larger than a 6" power jointer, is it worth getting it, or should I just use a sled and hand tools?" And that's where I lean away from the jointer.

    Anyway, once again, thanks guys. Feel free to continue the discussion/hijacking/whatever, I'm enjoying what I'm reading, too.


    Regards,

    daniel
    Not all chemicals are bad. Without hydrogen or oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in beer.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Mandalay Shores, CA
    Posts
    2,690
    Blog Entries
    26
    Obviously, I would vote for flattening with a Jack and Jointer planes. I don't think it takes that much time or effort. Both sides of a 16-18" wide and 5' long slab are an afternoon's work. but you wouldn't be putting them on a jointer in most shops. I find the toothed blade on one jack (LN LAJ) and a standard blade and another jack (Bailey #5, type 13) get the high spots out fast without too much tear-out. Afterwards hit it with the #7. Easy-peasey.
    Shawn

    "no trees were harmed in the creation of this message, however some electrons were temporarily inconvenienced."

    "I resent having to use my brain to do your thinking"

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Columbia, TN
    Posts
    535
    Daniel…food for thought, you mentioned building a bench. This can certainly be tackled with planes only, which is what I did, but it is A LOT of work. I would have gladly made use of power for dimensioning were it available to me at the time. I agree with others that the tools are determined by the projects.
    For even the Son of man came not to be served, but to serve.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Berkeley, CA
    Posts
    173
    Blog Entries
    1
    I, too, have a severe neck injury. In my case at-times totally debilitating, always painful, though I'm sure not as bad as some here. I so hate to read of all the others of you living with such problems but I'm encouraged to see so many still managing to do what we enjoy.

    I think it worth mentioning something that seems so obvious and basic - pacing - since that is what gets me in the most trouble in woodworking. I may be the only one dumb enough to keep making the same mistakes but something tells me I'm not. That something is probably just my ego, but still. (anyone else feel like Bart when Lisa wires up a cupcake to see if he can learn from afferent conditioning as well as a hampster >>
    Bart: "Yum! [reaches... zap!] Ouch!" "Yum! [reaches... zap!] Ouch!" "Yum! [reaches... zap!] Ouch!" "Yum! [reaches... zap!] Ouch!" ....)

    If I'm not really careful I end up so involved in a project that I work past the point of no return, or more often, just work wrong, and put myself out of the shop - or worse - for days or longer at a time. Some pain you can't miss when it comes on but surprisingly I find the worst by far I'm all too able to block out until way too late. My regular, non-chronic pain doctors, family, etc., never understand this. They take it to mean that particular pain isn't all that bad. In truth I handle the shooting type pain better than the one that creeps up on me like water behind an overfilled damn. Once it breaks through I'm done for. I can always tell in hindsight that it was building with me tooling away unawares, then I find I'm sick with pain AND can look back and see that it started much earlier. I'm sure that it is not as bad as what some of you experience - I really don't mean this as a gripe session - I just think it worth considering. A lot of pain we have no say over. Other pain we may and in spite of how distressing I find the pain I know I'm rotten at doing basic things to avoid it like pacing myself and being truly mindful of how I work. My partner has taken to peeking in as she walks past and often catches me working in dumb positions. She has to remind me to pay attention to such things.


    As for machines....
    Wow, and here I've been thinking all along I was going to be banned from the treefort if I admitted my recent forays into the land of powertools (just kidding) ((sorta)). Since it's all in the form of a used shopsmith it wasn't like I was going to be welcomed in the

    I work with hand tools because of all the usual reasons. Started with money, then space, noise, dust, safety, but ultimately I realized I love it, even when it approaches mild insanity. I'm doing all this for fun, not profit, so I don't have the pressures some do to work fast.
    I've been really looking for the past year at what my main roadblocks in either working well or actually progressing as a woodworker are. Some examples of what it has been at different points: lack of precision straightedges, lack of a jointer plane, not knowing how to use or sharpen handsaws well, not having decent enough workholding, or having to break out my sharpening kit and set it up, sharpen everything, put it away, then work until I can't find anything left that will cut melted butter - instead of just having a nice sharpening space out at the ready...

    Most recently I'd noticed that two perennial problems on the list are resawing and precision drilling, and that I was just not getting around to making a frame saw for resawing anytime soon and was having no luck finding a hand cranked drill press I could afford. I broke down and shopped for a used bandsaw and drill press. All the ones I saw were junk or too pricey. On a whim I finally called a guy with a shopsmith for sale, turned out he had a nice shopsmith with bandsaw, lots of extra blades, extra steel sanding disks, the lathe stuff, plus a planer. It also came with a second shopsmith (old 3/4 HP mk 5) that was "broken" - turned out the old style toothed gimler belt had snapped, otherwise in good shape, and a beat-up scrollsaw-like jigsaw - for $250. I know all the reasons many hate them and I went through a bit of buyers remorse but I've secretly wanted one since I was a kid. All the remorse disappeared when I stripped everything apart, cleaned and lubed and managed to reassemble with no "extra" pieces left over. I'm impressed by the engineering but in love with the quality of manufacturing involved.
    I went from being a 100% pure neander to owning a bandsaw, disc sander, drill press, somewhat iffy lightduty lathe, seriously terrifying tablesaw, and planer all in one fell swoop, with a jointer on the way. I figured I was destined to be one lonely woodworker since the neanders would walk right past without speaking to me while the powertool people wood all join in and taunt me for not owning a shop full of separate stationary "real" tools and instead owning a giant erector set that does nothing well but takes forever to do it, and all that. But am I glad to see I'm not actually all alone out here in the demilitarized zone between the two camps. And I'll say one thing for shopsmiths: Still built to last forever since first made in the 1950s + replacement parts available new and used + roundly mocked and derided by real men everywhere = super cheap. Once I new to look it seems half of craigslist is made up of used shopsmiths for sale.

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