How bad is using a PC 7518 in a table w/no lift?

[Rich Engelhardt]

I'm going round and round on this...

I don't want to invest a fortune in replacing my Freud 1700 & router table, but, it looks like I may have to spend more than I wanted to.

Anyhow - right now a lift is out of the question.

I got real spoiled real quick with the Freud and the above table features.
How bad is the big PC to use?

[Tom M King]

To me, the 7518 is not bad at all. I have a cast iron wing with Triton, a dedicated router table with Woodpecker lift, and five 7518's in shop made "tops". They aren't hard at all to adjust-maybe three tries to dead on. Look at the windows page on my website. The main thing I like about them is the 100% dust collection with nothing but a shop vac. I rarely use the table saw wing, because it leaves a mess to clean up. It would suit me if the wing and Triton were back where they came from. historichousepreservation.com

[Art Mann]

I would not want to use a PC 7518 router in a table without a lift because it is too difficult to adjust the height and change the bits. If you are buying, get the big Triton router. From what I have read, they have similar table use features to the Freud and are powerful. I used to use a Freud 1700 in one of my router tables. I thought it was weak for table applications and the above table lift mechanics didn't work well. The plunge base is so rough that I can't use it for it's intended purpose. It is now in a drawer somewhere and is the backup to my backup hand router.

Edit: I just read Tom King's comment and maybe the Triton isn't so good, based on his real life experience. I have no experience with it. I have lots of experience with routers in router tables with no above table adjustment and I can't stand to use them now that I have above table adjustment capability.

[pat warner]

"How bad is using a PC 7518 in a table w/no lift?"
************************************************** ********
Back ok, quadriceps working?
Then no problem. Fiducials graduated in 1/64ths in 1/4" increments.
Pretty easy to eyeball 1/128ths whence the casting is in your face.

[Andrew Joiner]

To me, the 7518 is not bad at all. I have a cast iron wing with Triton, a dedicated router table with Woodpecker lift, and five 7518's in shop made "tops". They aren't hard at all to adjust-maybe three tries to dead on. Look at the windows page on my website. The main thing I like about them is the 100% dust collection with nothing but a shop vac. I rarely use the table saw wing, because it leaves a mess to clean up. It would suit me if the wing and Triton were back where they came from. historichousepreservation.com

Once again your photos prove that it doesn't have to get expensive or complicated to do fine woodworking. Thanks Tom.

[Art Mann]

The photos also illustrate an open router table design that will spread shavings and dust all over the place. While this arrangement may be easy to use and work well for Tom, it is not workable in my shop. I suspect the same is true for many other users. Adjusting router height in a more conventional shop router table will be a lot more difficult than Tom's setup.

[Wade Lippman]

I would consider the Milwaukee. I have mine in a lift, but it works without one. The PC really doesn't.

[Ruperto Mendiones]

At the Cerritos College shop we had one 7518 mounted upside down in a cabinet. We had 4 other router stations with Bench Dog lifts. Except for one class setup I never saw the non-lift station in use. I tried it a time or two and it was a pita to adjust height precisely.

[Robert LaPlaca]

Not too bad, been using that way in a woodpeckers router table for 15 years..I figured if I got a hot deal on a lift I would jump on it, I figure a lift is a nice to have accessory,not a got to have one..

[Tom M King]

The photos also illustrate an open router table design that will spread shavings and dust all over the place. While this arrangement may be easy to use and work well for Tom, it is not workable in my shop. I suspect the same is true for many other users. Adjusting router height in a more conventional shop router table will be a lot more difficult than Tom's setup.

You missed something. The photos show the setup of an individual "top" in different stages. There is zero dust or shavings. It gets absolutely 100% with nothing more than a ShopVac. The bowling alley flooring is fitted to the router base without a hole for the bit. A straight 1/2" bit is plunged through the base. A little relief is routed out for the bottom of the bit. The working bit is inserted down through the top. No sawdust gets through to the router. Fence is made the exact height of the pieces to be run. Intake is the black hose to the ShopVac. Intake to the extra space around the bit is the PVC pipe riser (for safety and so no chips get tossed out).

Anyone who sees one run says, "I want one!"

Since that sash job, I've used these routers for a bunch of different things, and haven't turned the one in a table saw, or the dedicated router table on. Anything too big for one of these gets run with a shaper. With these, you just set the whole thing on top of a bench and adjust it pretty quickly.

[Art Mann]

I see now. That looks good. On the other hand, I typically don't use one setup to make lots and lots of identical pieces. I may change bits several times in a day and I may go from a 1/4" spiral upcut to a 3" diameter panel raiser. It isn't practical to build a dedicated table top with a dedicated router for each size or class of bits.

[Mike Henderson]

At the Cerritos College shop we had one 7518 mounted upside down in a cabinet. We had 4 other router stations with Bench Dog lifts. Except for one class setup I never saw the non-lift station in use. I tried it a time or two and it was a pita to adjust height precisely.

I took classes at Cerritos BEFORE they had the lifts so I had to use the 7518 without a lift. As Ruperto says, it was a pita. I also took classes after they got the lifts. It was MUCH easier to get things adjusted.

So you can work with it without a lift, but it's a lot easier with a lift.

Mike

[Peter Quinn]

A PC router with no lift? Rustic but workable is my call. That whole spin and dial thing is marginal compared to what others are doing, but its a great router motor, stable and smooth. So its a trade off IMO. Possibly the best router motor in a very solid base with possibly the worst height adjustment mechanism I've seen in a serious router. I guess it depends on what you are doing and how you like to work. Clearly it is workable, Tom's photos of the fine work he has done with them are solid evidence of that. But honestly I'd want to have 5 of them too rather than have one I had to adjust precisely and repeatedly. My concern having used a PC router (smaller one, same annoying height adjustment) in a table at almost every place I've worked is how much time you waste sneaking up on a precise set up. This is more of a concern if you in fact regularly do that sort of thing. For instance if you use them for joinery and have to be exact, trying to adjust out .010" height difference on a cope and stick with that big PC router under a table on your knees is not my idea of a joy. You loosen, it drops, you turn, it raises, you reach for the lock giant wing nut thingy to tighten, it turns and drops a bit, you loosen but snug, adjust, go past your setting..........I wish I were making this up, but that has been my experience. Up a little, down a little, hunt an peck. So it works, yes, ultimately, and for things like moldings on edges, no big deal because it just doesn't have to be that fussy.

Compare this to a lift. I got a jessum lift in a table saw I bought. Put an old hand me down pre-borg ryobi 3HP plunge whose plunge mechanism was shot from rust in it. I love it. Up and down precisely by the .001"'s, never on my knees, set up takes seconds not minutes. Some of these newer plunge routers (milwakee, bosch, triton, etc) were really designed with the router table bolt and go idea in mind. They accommodate above table height adjustment, have very decent power, and work well freehand too. I guess if it were me, I'd want that 7518 in a lift, but would consider buying it and putting it in a table short term while I saved for the lift, otherwise I'd probably give the other options some serious consideration.

[Peter Quinn]

I remember reading Bill Huber's post about what to do with the old PC 7518 bases, I was looking at Tom Kings site this morning.....I'm in the shop putting away the new recall replacement PC 7518 base that arrived when it hits me.....the old base would make a perfect fixture in a portable jobsite router table fashioned after Tom's design! Bingo.....that's what I'm doing with mine. Coat the handles with rubber, make it portable. Eureka!