CPAP machine practical in workshop for someone who's very sensitive to wood dust?

[Doug Hobkirk]

I ask simply because I am curious. The machine could be located wherever, like outside the shop or in a sealed box fed with outside air, and the hose could be however long. I trained myself to stop mouth breathing, so I am comfortable with lightweight headset. And I've become used to the tube.

CPAP-Nasal-Pillow-Mask.jpg
Very stylish, don't you agree?

I read of people who have tremendous difficulty with wood dust, especially some species (walnut?).

I personally am not organized enough to do it, I personally am not very sensitive, I personally DO use CPAP. My track saw table and sanding station are with ten feet of an outside window.

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CPAP Testimonial

• In my initial sleep test, I stopped breathing just over 60 times an hour. That doesn't seem plausible, or maybe even possible, to me.
• With the machine, I stopped snoring, which was BAD, although I never heard it. Two college buds and I shared a motel room last winter. Both were wary of me, but trusted my promise that I didn't snore now. In the morning, they reported the only sound was a faint whoosh noise from the machine, which I had left atop the bed. The next night they wouldn't let me put the machine under the bed because they liked the sound!
• I've used it for 6 years and only missed two nights. Less tossing and turning, more rested in the morning.

[Scott Brandstetter]

I have to say I think this Idea has merit. Especially if you add the mask that encloses the nose and mouth. You have me thinking now...wonder if they sell Cpap machines on ebay? I think hanging the system in the center of the shop with a flexible hose...who knows

[daniel lane]

It's an intriguing idea, but seems like it would be quite the bother to set up when you can just get a PAPR. Of course, those treat the air before supplying it to you, where the CPAP would provide fresh air at a slightly positive pressure. In that regard, I suppose it would be like a poor man's SCBA, swapping the cylinder for a long hose. Hmmm. <ponder>



daniel

[Paul Wunder]

A CPAP or BIPAP machine is not designed for protection against wood dust and frankly for the price of a good CPAP, which is available by prescription only (since it is a medical device) you can buy a top quality 3M powered respirator which is designed for this purpose.

BIPAPS and CPAPS have tiny 1"x 2" very thin filters designed only to prevent large particles of dust from entering the internal fan. The filters would quickly become overloaded within minutes in a shop environment. Also, the units are designed for a hose length of about 6' in length with an impeller strength to match. CPAPs and masks will cost about $1K and a BIPAP will be over $2K. Lastly, the typical mask will block your vision in various directions.....OK for sleeping, but very dangerous in a shop.

[Doug Hobkirk]

A CPAP or BIPAP machine is not designed for protection against wood dust and frankly for the price of a good CPAP, which is available by prescription only (since it is a medical device) you can buy a top quality 3M powered respirator which is designed for this purpose.

BIPAPS and CPAPS have tiny 1"x 2" very thin filters designed only to prevent large particles of dust from entering the internal fan. The filters would quickly become overloaded within minutes in a shop environment. Also, the units are designed for a hose length of about 6' in length with an impeller strength to match. CPAPs and masks will cost about $1K and a BIPAP will be over $2K. Lastly, the typical mask will block your vision in various directions.....OK for sleeping, but very dangerous in a shop.

Wow! I get it - you don't like the idea! Sheesh...

But your points are somewhat off base:

• I suggested locating the machine outside the shop, or in a sealed box with outside air piped in. Filters clogging? In 6 years I've never changed a filter after the first few months when I was being nervous.
• I yoked two hoses together many years ago for convenience. I prefer the hose goes downward (they have options for it to go up) below my elbows. Freedom to roll over, and 6' gets slightly tight. Twelve feet lets me go open the window!
• I got a new machine a year ago (medical coverage demanded it). Whenever I get a new mask every year or two, although I think the coverage allows for a new one every six months, I save the old hoses, none of which show any deterioration. So even though I'm asking out of curiosity, I happen to be capable of rigging an 18' (or 24') system for no cost.
• And I freely admit that I am very tolerant of imperfect sterility. Although I did ask my PCP (of 30+ years, a common sense doctor) if my casual attitude was reasonable. I would not consider that OK for my wife (new kidney) who takes many immune system suppression drugs.

And, just to throw another log on the fire, most CPAP machines also have a variable humidifier integrated into the system. I found it didn't seem to help much and keeping that clean was the only maintenance I ever needed to do. I haven't used it for several years, and I haven't had to do any maintenance other than the occasional new mask. But it might help someone who is highly sensitive, and cleaning out the container every few days isn't a big deal.

[Jerry Wright]

I have been a dedicated cpap user for15 years. I have used it camping as well as all over the world. There is a fundamental problem with using one in the shop which has nothing to do with filtration, mobility, or cost. The problem is airflow. Try taking a walk, then put it on. You will find inadequate airflow to support breathing at elevated rates of respiration. Remember that it operates on a set pressure, If you adjust it well over your prescribed sleep ptessure, then it might work , but watch out for your passage ways!

[Matt Meiser]

They make supplied air respirator equipment that's actually designed for the job.

[Doug Herzberg]

Doug, I've been on CPAP for nearly two decades and have two old machines sitting in a closet. For woodturning, I have a Trend Airshield Pro, which was very expensive, but does a pretty good job of providing breathable air while protecting me a little from projectiles coming off the lathe.

I've thought more than once about something like you propose if and when the Trend fails. Woodturners stand in one place for a long time, so the hose issues seem less consequential. CPAP machines are well built and seem to last forever. They can be purchased new online for $3-400, but you do need a prescription. I would think there are many pack rats like me who can't throw away a functioning machine, but might be persuaded to part with one for a small price.

A small enclosure to pre-filter the ambient air in the shop would be pretty simple, if moving the machine outside is impractical. My full face mask for the CPAP costs almost $200 by itself and I'm not taking it to the shop, but I think most devices designed for the shop could be adapted. Also, I can't wear eyeglasses while also wearing a CPAP mask, so it wouldn't work for me.

If I can put a system together using what I have, I'll have more money for woodworking tools.

[Dave Richards]

I think you ought to try it and see what you get but don't expect too much.

As someone who works on them as well as critical life support equipment such as ICU ventilators and anesthesia machines, I think you might find the idea isn't that great. CPAPs and BiPAPs are designed to to work in relatively clean environments such as bedrooms. They are designed to move fairly clean air such as that typically found in bedrooms. As mentioned before, the intake filter is only designed to keep out the big chunks, not airborne particulate matter such as wood dust. You can put the device into a box with filtration designed to filter out the dust but you'll need to provide some active method to get air into the enclosure. Otherwise the CPAP's blower will have to work harder to draw in air. That will affect the operation of the unit. Adding length to the hose will increase back pressure at the blower which also makes the blower work harder. It might be able to handle 12 feet of hose instead of six but coupled with the restriction on the intake from enclosing the unit in a box, you may find the unit overheats and the blower life reduced.

If you are putting two hoses together when you use the CPAP, did you have appropriate adjustments made to the settings? Pressure monitoring in the patient circuit is measured proximal to the machine to simplify the breathing circuit. If the unit settings are made for a six foot long hose and you add another six feet, you've changed the situation and the settings won't be right for you. You might not notice a difference but then again, you might.

[Doug Hobkirk]

I have been a dedicated cpap user for15 years. I have used it camping as well as all over the world. There is a fundamental problem with using one in the shop which has nothing to do with filtration, mobility, or cost. The problem is airflow. Try taking a walk, then put it on. You will find inadequate airflow to support breathing at elevated rates of respiration. Remember that it operates on a set pressure, If you adjust it well over your prescribed sleep ptessure, then it might work , but watch out for your passage ways!

That's an interesting idea, Jerry. I might try an experiment: 15 minutes using dumbbells wearing the mask - that's 15 more minutes that I've done in the last year! I've never adjusted the pressure, that might bear non-sleeping experimentation.

[Doug Hobkirk]

Doug, I've been on CPAP for nearly two decades and have two old machines sitting in a closet. For woodturning, I have a Trend Airshield Pro, which was very expensive, but does a pretty good job of providing breathable air while protecting me a little from projectiles coming off the lathe.

I've thought more than once about something like you propose if and when the Trend fails. Woodturners stand in one place for a long time, so the hose issues seem less consequential. CPAP machines are well built and seem to last forever. They can be purchased new online for $3-400, but you do need a prescription. I would think there are many pack rats like me who can't throw away a functioning machine, but might be persuaded to part with one for a small price.

A small enclosure to pre-filter the ambient air in the shop would be pretty simple, if moving the machine outside is impractical. My full face mask for the CPAP costs almost $200 by itself and I'm not taking it to the shop, but I think most devices designed for the shop could be adapted. Also, I can't wear eyeglasses while also wearing a CPAP mask, so it wouldn't work for me.

If I can put a system together using what I have, I'll have more money for woodworking tools.

I think the Trend shield looks very impressive. The stimulus for my idea was the idea of using pressurized outside air. (And not spending $300 (or whatever).

I have found zero used CPAP machines on eBay, current or past sales. I wonder why?

I had lots of difficulty adjusting to a full mask and then a half mask. At an expert's suggestion, I taught myself to breathe through my nose by taping my lips. It worked. Now I only need "nasal pillows." They lose the seal occasionally, but are easy to reposition. And now I can wear glasses - how can a person go to bed and not have the option of reading?

[Kerry Wright]

Doug, I'm right there with you except I stopped breathing about 54 times an hour. Wow, talk about a life changer.

I believe your idea may be plausible, but only for more stationary tasks. I can't see being able to contend with the hose (and maintaining a good seal) and moving around the various machines. Besides, I'm pretty sure I couldn't use it at all in the shop. After two minutes I'd be sound asleep

If anyone is interested, I have an older CPAP in the closet. As long as you don't mind it occasionally turning itself on and/or increasing to full pressure whenever it sees fit, I'd be willing to part with it.

[Paul Wunder]

CPAPS and BIPAPS are life changers. I have been using one for about four years. I was told to use one starting about 10+ years ago. I tried back then, but I could not learn to breath with the device. I also have ancillary lung issues.

The good news is that the technology has changed dramatically (at least on the better units). I urge anyone with sleep difficulties to seek help because prolonged sleep apnea can cause severe elevated blood pressure and markedly increases the risk of stroke. These machines are now eminently usable....and bearable! I now wouldn't think of laying down to sleep each night without it.

I have a ResMed Series 9 BIPAP (about $2300..which Medicare paid for) and I would highly recommend it if that is what is needed.

[John Coloccia]

I use a fresh air hood from these guys for spraying lacquer.

http://www.turbineproducts.com/fresh...spirators.html

[Doug Hobkirk]

I use a fresh air hood from these guys for spraying lacquer.

http://www.turbineproducts.com/fresh...spirators.html

Wow! Isn't that cumbersome? Does it get hot inside?

But those are technology questions. The important question is do you have severe allergies? And then I realized it's for "spraying lacquer." I keep thinking that one of these days I will learn to read...