Iwasaki Milled File question--is it worth buying all grades?

[Matt Lau]

Currently, I have a red-handled EF detail Iwasaki file from Lee Valley.

I'm working on fettling some Japanese planes, and plan to make quite a few wood bodied planes (some krenov, some Japanese) as presents for friends.
I'd really like to have a way to flatten the bed accurately and quickly.

Currently, the EF file is impressively aggressive and smooth without being too grabby.

Would it be worth buying the coarse, medium, and fine also?

I'm hesitant to buy too many things, as I don't have much space (and I'm just a hobbiest).
If another tool can do it better (like an Auroui/ Liogier rasp (want), NOS nickolsen files (have), chisel), I'd like to save my money and buy it.
However, if the Milled tooth files really benefit from following a progression, I'll buy the set.

If the EF is the star performer of the set, I may just buy some more EF's in other sizes.

I'd especially like to hear from John, as he's got a lot of experience with these files (and also builds guitars too).

-Matt

[John Coloccia]

I'm going to have to go see what I actually have. I didn't really pay attention to what I was buying. I just bought one on a whim, tried it, and drove right back to Woodcraft and pretty much bought every other one they had at the time. I think I was a relatively early adopter when they became available so there wasn't a ton of information floating around on them. I believe I sent George my "coarse", though it may have been a medium. It was WAY too aggressive to use anywhere on a guitar, IMHO, unless you were carving it out of a tree. I generally tend to use various edge tools (chisels, draw knives, violin knives, palm planes, band saw, etc) if I need to remove a lot of material in a hurry. Tearing it off with a coarse file or rasp just seems....well...so uncivilized.

All that said, I believe I MOSTLY use the "extreme" fine and fine. They're great for refining a surface and leaving it very smooth, but they still remove material at a reasonable rate. The medium and coarse are both a bit too aggressive for my liking, personally. I would personally reach for a rasp of some sort if I wanted to remove a lot of material, or edge tools as I mentioned before. The flat profiles make more sense in the coarse and medium than the round ones, IMHO. I could almost see them being useful on end grain, or maybe removing some rough tool marks on mostly flat areas. I can't figure out what I'd do with curved ones, though.

The reason is that these things work best, and really shine, when you use them in a draw filing motion. Material will just shear off, giving good material removal but still leaving a great surface. Now think about this. What good does using a round file in a draw filing motion do you? The fine and extra-fine still work OK when you just push them mostly straight. The coarser ones just kind of grab. Now, I DO use the round one in a draw filing kind of motion sometimes to get into some spots, but typically when you use some sort of round rasp/file sort of thing, you're trying to pinpoint area to refine them into the curve you want. I just don't find it works for me that well. Even with the EF and F, I find myself twisting the file a little bit as I push forward, essentially forcing it to do a shearing cut anyway.

Anyhow, that's all just my opinion. I think a ton of guys have these things now so hopefully you'll get a lot of good responses. I'm actually wondering what people think about them myself.

[Tom M King]

Pretty much the same for me, as exactly what John said. The fine and xfine are fantastic, and I wish I'd had them 30 years ago.

[John Coloccia]

This is funny. After I wrote that, I did a search on Iwasaki files. There's STILL not a lot out there, but watch this:



You can actually see him doing the little "twisty" motion I was talking about with the small, extra fine round file at the end. You can see it a bit with the larger one too. These Iwasakis are like draw knifes. They will tell you how they want to be used if you listen

[Mike Holbrook]

I'm with John. I have 9 or 10 of these files and use them regularly. I think the fine files work better for me than the coarser ones. I keep trying the coarser files on different woods in different situations but I always seem to feel the finer files work better for me. I have also had small problems with the coarser files blowing out small chips or splinters of wood especially on edges. Unless I want a coarse handle surface or something of that nature I use the fine or xfine files.

[Frederick Skelly]

I have about a half dozen in flat and half round, in a mix of Coarse, Medium, Fine and EF. I use them all the time. Im really glad I have them. I think someone here @ SMC convinced me to try them.
Fred

[george wilson]

I will mention a valuable tool: I found a new but broken in half horse hoof rasp in the museum stable area several years ago. It consists of a coarse rasp on one side,and a pretty sharp,very coarse file on the other. I took one of the broken off pieces,and ground it on each end to make a 4" long,square ended short file. It has been great for smoothing out the lumps in guitar necks under construction. The short length allows it to be used there. It removes wood quite well. First the rasp,then the coarse file side for a cleaner surface to be made smoother later on by sanding. I shortened my broken file by clamping it in a steel vise and knocking off the excess with a hammer,with a rag over it to avoid sharp shrapnel flying all over the place. Then,I smoothed the ends and blunted them some on the belt grinder.

This tool would be equally useful in making other stuff,like furniture legs,or whatever you can find a use for. I don't know if all horse rasps are equally sharp,but you can find them at any feed and seed store. Probably Tractor Supply,or similar farm oriented supplies or hardware stores. Make sure the rasp has a very sharp feeling file side. They used to cost about $25.00,but I haven't checked in some time as mine is still good.

The Japanese file you sent me has been great,John. Similar to the old Nicholson surer shear files,only a lot smaller. The smallest super shear file Nicholson made,a 10" file,was never sharp,but the larger ones are as sharp as a tack. Too late to get those,though. I did buy an identical Simmonds several years ago from Travers. I left it at work,though,so I can't tell you if it was USA or made in India by now. Or if still made at all.

[John Coloccia]

I forget, George. Did I send a curved one or a flat one?

[Tom M King]

George, it sounds like it has one side with a "finishing file". All the name brand horse rasps come pretty sharp, and they can be sharpened a number of times. I like Bellota's as much as some of the more expensive ones. This link might help: http://www.anvilbrand.com/Rasps-C933.aspx

We use them on horses' feet.

[george wilson]

Thank you for the link,Tom. Mine does have the finishing side. It is useful to have both a rasp and a finishing side. I do like the looks of that Simmonds that has a coarse and a finer side,both of finishing file type,IF the quality of Simminds can be trusted these days. I might like to get a Simmonds and leave it as is,using it just as an extra coarse cabinet file.

I can't recall the brand of my horse rasp,since I made it several years ago,and broke the tang end off,removing the name in the process. Looks like these are cheaper than I thought,too.

John,you sent me a flat Iwasaki,which has been a great file. Thank you again.

[John Coloccia]

John,you sent me a flat Iwasaki,which has been a great file. Thank you again.

You're most welcome, George. I knew I wouldn't have sent you a curved one that coarse. The flat one is far more usable in that configuration. I still haven't used those needle files you sent me. They're so beautifully made, it seems a shame to use them on anything but the finest of tasks. It's so sad that you really just can't buy things like that anymore, at any price, it seems. I've always wanted to build a clock, or a watch, from scratch. They should come in handy for that!

[george wilson]

Those needle files are over 100 years old,and Swiss made. They have absolutely NO flat spots on their corners at all. And,they were cut better than even the GOOD $125.00 sets of Nicholson that USED to be made in the USA.

I own the last remaining stock of those in the World. Some day I will start selling them off.