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Thread: Japanese Marking Gauges - a Pleasant Surprise

  1. #16
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    David,
    After Derek's observation....has the loose beam been inserted upside down? It appears the screw bottoms on the beam, not the irons. What keeps the irons from moving?

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Cohen View Post
    Attachment 299304



    Attachment 299305


    Hi David

    I've just had another look a your gauge. It appears that the centre blade guide has loosened and shifted away from the main body/fence. It is no longer flush with the face. This will restrict its use.

    Tap it back and re-glue.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    It's designed to be like that. There is a metal fixture in the middle of the wooden beam that has a hole in it for the screw to go through, so it stays in that position fixed (it does so even with the screw removed) Can you specify where that would restrict its use?

  3. #18
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    (the version that hida carries is designed to work the same way).

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Weaver View Post
    It's designed to be like that. There is a metal fixture in the middle of the wooden beam that has a hole in it for the screw to go through, so it stays in that position fixed (it does so even with the screw removed) Can you specify where that would restrict its use?
    Hi David

    I found this on Hida Tools ..



    As far as I am aware, it is not designed to work this way. Every other picture of a Ryuma or Kebiki features it the same design as a Kinshiro ...



    How could yours do this (setting the exact depth of a board) ..



    ... or have the visibility advantage of these gauges when setting a mortice ...



    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  5. #20
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    No problem. The irons project well below the wooden arm sticking out and have a lot of travel either way, forward or back. The wooden arm only covers the thickness of the tangs, and the rest of the blade is below them. I don't know if it sticks out like that to keep the blades from flexing or what.

  6. #21
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    Stu also sells some cheap cutting gauges, anyone try them?

  7. #22
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    Matthew, Derek posted a picture and comments on the better of those gauges in the second post in this thread. David ordered a more expensive 2 blade kegaki from TFJ recently. The kegaki David ordered is more money than Stu's economy gauges but much less than the Kinshiro. Ken Hatch started another thread "Yesterday's Mail Had a Nice Surprise" in which he comments about the kinshiro gauge he found and bought recently, there is more information in that thread too.

    The kegaki David ordered looks like the kinshiro without the harder wood insert where the gauge rides against the object it is marking.
    Last edited by Mike Holbrook; 11-01-2014 at 7:48 AM.

  8. #23
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    Mike, I have read this entire thread over with interest. Stu have a "regular" type gauge as well with a wooden beam and a blade in the beam, like a western gauge would. I'm wondering if anyone has given them a try?


    The gauge David ordered has a special feature the allows you to lock the two metal cutter together at a fixed distance and than move them together, very convenient.

  9. #24
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    Matthew, these gauges are relatively similar and a little confusing to differentiate between. I was assuming you were interested in the Ryuma gauges Stu sells. The first picture in the second post in this thread is Derek's shot of his large Ryuma.

    I had understood from Stu a number of months back that he could not get kinshiro gauges any more. I think the maker retired or something. Ken Hatch found a few kinshiro gauges still in stock at a place or two. I think the prices have been increased though as these are probably the last there will ever be. Stu informed me that he sells a gauge that is similar. The gauge Stu mentioned is listed under precision marking gauges on his web site, precision "kebiki" gauges to be precise. I believe David ordered the gauge Stu mentioned, his 2 blade "kegaki" marking gauge.

    The Ryuma Derek mentions above uses a much more economical locking nut that Derek has apparently encountered issues with. I want try to explain the differences in the blades but the blades on the kinshiro and kegaki gauges are much better. The kegai gauge Stu now sells has a few differences from the kinshiro pictures posted here on SMC. The kegagi, at least in Stu's picture, uses a second locking nut on the section of the blades that slide over each other that the kinshiro does not have. If you look at the pictures the kinshiro gauges have grooves in the top blade that apparently serve to move/position it. Both the kinshiro and kegagi use hard Japanese wood for the fence and marking arm. The kinshiro has an even harder wood insert where the gauge might wear against the object being marked.

    David speculates in the other thread that Stu may be ordering the kegagi gauges from another location in Japan. If this is the case, the picture on Stu's page may not be exactly what David ends up with, which is one reason I was hoping to see a picture/comments form David before ordering a kegagi gauge. I like the locking nuts on the kegagi gauge picture on Stu's site but I could see these nuts and or the locking mechanism, woods...changing between "models".

  10. #25
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    I replaced the locking bolt with a ss hex head metric bolt from Lowe's. It works great.

    I couldn't find a brass one like Derek used.

  11. #26
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    Hi Lowell

    Search eBay for "knurled brass nut".

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Holbrook View Post

    David speculates in the other thread that Stu may be ordering the kegagi gauges from another location in Japan. If this is the case, the picture on Stu's page may not be exactly what David ends up with, which is one reason I was hoping to see a picture/comments form David before ordering a kegagi gauge. I like the locking nuts on the kegagi gauge picture on Stu's site but I could see these nuts and or the locking mechanism, woods...changing between "models".
    He may stock it, I don't know. The reason I made that comment is not because I expect the gauge might look different (it will almost certainly look like the picture), but because stuff that comes from another shop has to get to stu first. I don't think he stocks most of the stuff he has, but the market for tools in japan is pretty organized and it just means a couple of extra days to get the tools from either the maker or an agent for the maker. If stu's the agent for them (or effectively there isn't one), then it just comes straight from him.

    Other sellers operate the same way, like fujibato and to some extent takeshi kuroda will also take special orders if you can communicate with him. It's a little different than here where not having something stocked either means drop shipped or an unknown wait time.

    At any rate, I expect it'll be identical to the one stu shows, but I'll take a picture of it and post it here when it comes. Stu does stock the more common things (like the popular stones), and he may stock some of the other tools.

  13. #28
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    Maybe these screws & nuts Lowell?
    http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware...=3,41306,41311
    I suppose one could re-drill and tap.

    The wing nut, on the Ryuma picture I see, looks like it has a screw attached to it vs a seperate screw & nut? I suspect positioning the two blades is harder without a nut & screw or filed ridges to work with. I also suspect that for one nut to lock both blades against each other, holding them in their correct relative positions and locking them that way against the wooden fence requires additional pressure? I know it requires considerable pressure to lock my Cullen gauges up. Maybe the kinshiro gauge is just made to a more exacting standard?

  14. #29
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    I was interested why no one has said anything about these, they are dirt cheap.1750013404.jpg
    Last edited by Matthew N. Masail; 11-01-2014 at 11:21 AM.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Weaver View Post
    The lady selling them was in texas, but her husband may have been japanese. She had a double-arm marking gauge, too (which I also bought), and most of the stuff the guy had was pretty honest looking stuff (and most of it is japanese).

    I pictured the same thing, japanese guy smoking a cigarette while working - a lot of the videos on youtube show the same thing.
    My understanding is that it's like the 1960's over there, everyone wears a suit to work, drinks with the boss and smokes.
    Bumbling forward into the unknown.

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