Attach face frames to built-in.

[Steve Wurster]

You still have the clamping issue. With your scenario (mounted on top of granite top) I'm not sure how to get the back pressure. Couple of ideas come to mind. Double-sided foam tape a board to the granite, and use wedges? Clamp a board to the granite overhang and use wedges? Mount a cross piece using the self standards or holes, and then use cauls top to bottom? If 32mm or other pin holes are present, you can mount vertical scrap wood on the pin holes braced from side to side with scrap, then use clamps from front of stile to the vertical scrap.

I just had an idea based on your feedback. Since the space above the cabinets is currently accessible, I could screw a board to the upper part of the tops and clamp against that. I could couple that with a board clamped to the granite overhang and effectively wedge a full height piece against the face frames. That might just do the trick.

[Kent A Bathurst]

I'd probably use glue, with some biscuits for alignment............

THis is the one-and-only perfect spot for a plate joiner. Do the biscuit thingy. And a few pins to hold them tight while the glue sets. If you feel the need to touch-up the pin locations, it is a very quick job.

I think I got the Porter Cable 1-3/8" (I misspoke about the 2") I found the Grex got the best reviews, but for a once-in-a-blue-moon tool, I didn't have any issues.

I started with one of the earliest ones available, 12+ years ago - and I forget the brand - it is a well-known name, though.

Then, I upgraded to one that could handle longer pins - a wider range of options, and better firing control, Cadex. Excellent tool. Gave my old one to a friend. Prashun is correct - it does not come out of the cabinet very often. The thing for me, though, is that when I use it, I am using it where I cannot afford to have anything go wrong.

[Peter Quinn]

They make clamps for this.....http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-EKT55-O...22457.....just get a few dozen and your good to go. Ouch. If you have a toe kick space you could run long caulks from the top where you have access to the bottom, secure them some how with scraps etc, then use wedges with a piece of cork to protect finish. Great clamping pressure from a wedge. If you have shelf pin holes you could run screw in to these the. Use surgical tubing as a clamp. I'm amused at how many people like micro pins....ImE you may as well duck tape the FF on, or use masking tape, micro pins aren't holding anything. As I read about this situation I can't help thinking it's best to handle this problem in the design phase. Don't build a 13' long bookcase in a single plane that then can't be installed. Break it into 3 sections, bump the middle forward 2 1/2", connect the mid section to be two wings with tongue and dado joints on the FF, scribe left, scribe right, slide middle in place, screw at top and bottom....add crown and toe kick or base molding.....I'm having a beer instead of filling in pin nail holes and repainting all the damage from clamping. I worked for a guy that is a master at designing huge built ins, we never did one in one piece and never glued Ff on site except in NYC brownstones with nasty little entry's that allow nothing through the door.

[Bill Adamsen]

Those Bessey clamps are pricey ... but they sure look like a fast and convenient solution. One could argue that some of these are no different than putting a "C" clamp on the cabinet (with padding) and dropping a wedge between the material and the "C". Bessey (and others) makes several types, does anyone have experience using the different models?

KF2
ETK55
Rockler
Claw Clamp

[Mark Bolton]

As I read about this situation I can't help thinking it's best to handle this problem in the design phase.

I would agree fully however (and no offense to anyone) but that kind of stuff gets refined over many many projects and is hard to apply when your just doing it here and there. The bump option is a great one and there are many more for flush installations. Hind sights always 20/20 though for sure.

[Steve Wurster]

The bookcase is made up of 6 individual pieces that are currently screwed together behind where the face frames will go, and screwed to the walls. In theory I could dry-fit the stiles for size purposes, and then bump out or even take down a bookcase or two at a time and physically clamp the face frames on before reinstalling. I'll have to think about that.

[john bateman]

This type of edge banding clamp aren't too expensive. Don't know if they're large enough for your purpose, though.
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[Steve Wurster]

This type of edge banding clamp aren't too expensive. Don't know if they're large enough for your purpose, though.

I think they do make those big enough for my usage. My worry with those it the small surface area and the possibility for denting. Having to use a board to avoid that shrinks the available reach of the clamp.

[J.R. Rutter]

J.R., are the clipped nails simply there for alignment, or will they actually have holding power? What gauge nail would you recommend?

Potentially both. 16-18 ga? But it sounds like you will be able to clamp/wedge it on to glue it. The clipped nails can be tricky to align on large assemblies...

[paul cottingham]

I used Miller Dowels to attach the face frames and hold them in place while glue set. Put dry fit, drill for miller dowels, take frame off, add glue to shelves and face frame, use miller dowels as clamps while glue sets. I sometimes dado or rabbet the back ofthe face frame as well.

[Max Neu]

I would pocket hole, then cover them up with a piece of 1/4" or 1/2" plywood glued and pinned. Or just use small head screws if you want access to the pocket screws for future disassemby.

[Sam Murdoch]

After the install Face Frame attachment - hard way to do it if you don't want to use trim screws or nails -

BUT - As you have set yourself up with splines AND if you have shelf holes bored I have done the following with good results:

Make up "pin board" - a 1 x 2" or 3" wide board as tall as will fit in the opening or thereabouts and bore matching shelf holes in it - at least every 6" or so. Using straight pin type shelf pins (or dowels) set your "pin board" into your cabinet side shelf holes. Glue up and tap your face frame verts in place and then hold them there with clamp pressure applied with clamps reaching to behind your "pin board(s)".

IT WOULD BE FAR EASIER if your face frames were preassembled. Leave only the very outside scribe verts loose for scribing and fitting. BUT as your top rail is one piece and you have access for pocket screws (or face screws if you are then applying some crown) the single stile at a time method can work OK. I might use "pin boards" on the mating side of 2 bookcases and use a caul across the two with clamps pulling from 2 pin boards at once. Would be a more direct pull. Of course you don't want the clamps to pull the verts tight - just to hold them there until the glue dries after you have tapped them into place with the splines. The idea is not to oversize the shelf pin holes.

With the right deep throat clamps you can sometimes hold 2 pin boards tight to the interior faces to help resist movement OR carefully screw 2 together using GRK type finish screws passing through the cabinet walls through the shelf pin holes. In this case you screw through a section of the "pin board" that has not been pre bored.

Clear as mud? Read twice and then if you are still befuddled I can try to be more lucid with my explanation. This method does work.

[Jim Becker]

I use glue and some longer 23 gage pins shot at an angle for this kind of thing. The holes from the 23 gage pins are barely perceptible. You do not want to use a brad gun for this unless you plan on filling holes and putting on an additional coat of finish.

[David Cramer]

I use glue and some longer 23 gage pins shot at an angle for this kind of thing. The holes from the 23 gage pins are barely perceptible. You do not want to use a brad gun for this unless you plan on filling holes and putting on an additional coat of finish.

Ditto.


I just got the new (newer) Senco 2" pinner a month ago. What a cool tool! I've used it several times and it already "saved" me. Jim is right, barely perceptible indeed.

David

[Max Neu]

If you have a biscuit joiner, you might want to consider using the clamex fittings. I have the zeta p2, and use their various fittings for things like this.I am pretty sure you can use the clamex fittings with a standard biscuit joiner.The Tenso fitting would be perfect with glue, but Im not sure if that can be used with a standard biscuit cutter.