Thank you Bill. I was surprised to find that the top was not independent. At least one corner had a shim between top and base. That was a surprise as well.
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Thank you Bill. I was surprised to find that the top was not independent. At least one corner had a shim between top and base. That was a surprise as well.
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Now that you have unpacked your shaper the first thing I would do is check the spindle and make sure it is perpendicular to the table! Use a couple nuts to mount a steel ruler to the spindle so the ruler is parallel to the table. Put your dial gauge magnetic base on the ruler so the tip of the dial gauge is touching the table. Sweep the gauge around one entire revolution by hand reading the dial gauge. With the gauge making a 6" circle on the table a .005" variance is a pretty good number to shoot for.
Now that your spindle is perpendicular to the table you can be assured that the profile on the cutter will be the profile you get on your stock.
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LOL, you will like your shaper, now you need a 1/2 HP stock feeder and the book I mentioned earlier.Originally Posted by Dan Chouinard
You'll find the shaper is one of the most versatile shop machines, was just using mine last night with the feeder to make rebates............Rod.
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Thanks Rod for the recommending the spindle moulder handbook. It arrived today and look forward to diving into it. Looks to be chock full of useful info.
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Congrats on the machine. I like the spindle moulder handbook, its a good one. But the Lonnie Byrd book isn't a bad one either. Its full of decent if older ideas for successful and safe shaping. I still use his panel hood design on my minimax for a few panel raisers, dust capture on MDF panels is the best I've seen. The book is full of simple fences and guides you can make as opposed to loads of anodized aluminum treasures you can buy from some European company, but its lessons are not invalid IMO, worth a review considering the meager asking price.
Last edited by Peter Quinn; 02-13-2015 at 10:25 AM.
"A good miter set up is like yoga pants: it makes everyone's butts look good." Prashun Patel
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True Cabinet saws have everything attached to the base not table.
Id go straight to a 1hp feeder and skip the much lighter weight 1/2hp feeder.
Watch for shims on your table if you remove it.
Glad its my shop I am responsible for - I only have to make me happy.
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Shapers and table saws both had the guts attached to the base rather than the top until it became cheaper to beef up the top casting and lighten the base. Hanging weight off the top was not the preferred method for the high end stuff. Some shaper bases had a top that secured the quill and the table sat on that top, doubled up. I'd also second the recommendation to go to the 1 hp feeder. That shaper will handle it. Dave
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Fast forward to 2023 and my PM2700 sits in the corner of the shop (different and vastly better shop) and it has never been used. Its shocking to me that I have owned this machine 8 years. Honest truth is that I am intimidated by it. I have continued to use a router table all these years. Recently however I have had to tongue and groove a mountain of oak for a paneling project. That was a workout. I referred to it as the "oak gym". It prompted me to purchase a power feeder as part of a year end buying spree (along with a Lamello Zeta P2). Reading this old thread today and Peters suggestion caught my eye. Find someone with a PM2700 and see it run. I am on the NH seacoast and would travel 100 miles to get a demo from some kind sole.I don't own one, I looked at them pretty close a few years back, was planning to buy one when a used minimax popped up in my area real cheap, so I went that direction. I think the PM2700 is a pretty solid offering in the "basic" small commercial size range. The fence is good, it has some nice features like built in mobility, built in digital height gauge, aluminum fence plates with hold down accommodations. Its an update to their PM27 line which I have used quite a bit. The 27 is a good solid work horse for a lot of small shops, no frills machine that works well for cabinet doors and light molding work. They didn't always age well, I used a few beat up varieties that had developed out of parallel issue with the fences, or some chatter as the bearings wore from use at or beyond intended capacity, or slop in the height mechanism from who knows what that makes precise height adjustments more challenging. I've also used a nearly 20 year old PM27 in another guys mostly one man shop and it was kept in such good condition it hardly felt like the others I had used, real tight and precise.
Honestly, I think the decision to go with a shaper and feeder is ultimately more important than which shaper you choose. The tooling is probably the more important decision. Relative to your current indicated use, 5pc cabinet doors, almost any shaper 3HP and above is capable of delivering a decent performance. I prefer 5HP for the marginal added cost, easier at resale, and this is America where bigger is always better right!You may appreciate the extra power if you ever get into passage sized doors or molding work. For me it comes down to ease of use which is largely related to the fence. You don't make money fussing with a set up, you make money pushing wood through, so you want the set up time minimized. I'd look for precise tool less fence and hood adjustments, easy speed adjustments (if that is something you actually require), ease of spindle change. These are the places the cheap imports really fall apart. I've used a few at work that I wont name here, the fences are abysmal, the speed changes are absurd, changing a spindle takes an act of congress and some bandaids. The PM2700 has solved all these issues. The spindle change issue is a non event in many cases, I've seen shapers never get changed from 1 1/4". But sometimes in the small shop you go 3/4" bore to save some valuable funds, especially at the start, lots of guys evolve away from the 3/4" size once you learn how much smoother the bigger diameter cuts, others are very content with 3/4" bore. So its a personal decision, if you need different spindles, they should be easy to swap. The one issue they haven't solved is spindle speeds...the 2700 has only two speeds, 7500 and 10K, and thats pretty fast for a molding head or a big panel raiser. They should have put something in the 6K rpm range at least, so thats a draw back and a limitation if you get into bigger cutters, like over 5 1/2" diameter.
If you are going to spend close to $4K plus feeder on this purchase its probably a good idea to check out your options. That puts some more industrial used machines in range, not a choice for everybody, but definitely worth consideration. Most value priced used industrial tools require at least some work, cleaning or tuning. You trade sweet and time for lower cost. You sort of have to predict the future, will your range of work grow over time? Could you use a tilting spindle or is that a waste of your money? Will you use a sliding table, or is that a waste of space? Rod suggested the fully equipped modern euro shapers, I really like the versatility they offer but don't consider those options to be essential or their purchase a forgone conclusion for every wood worker. Sometimes a good basic shaper that spins a cutter is just as much as you need. I have a small slider on my minimax, it never gets used for cabinet doors, but for lots of other things I do it has proven invaluable. I can think of a few cases where a tilting spindle would have been a great help....but for basic cabinet work? You might actually forget its there. Before you make the purchase you might want to reach out to some professionals in your area and check out their set ups, maybe even find somebody with a PM2700 and see it run, at least go to see one in person at a vendor if possible, check out other options too. Hammer, laguna, jet, minimax, used industrial, etc.
Thanks and Happy New Year
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Dan, my recommendation would be to sign up for the Alpine Technical workshop in Ouray, Colorado, run by Joe "the gentle giant" Calhoon and Greg Godbout (from Rangate). I did it in 2012 when i got a 2700 with power feeder. The knowledge and exposure changed my fear factor into a healthy respect and understanding of how to use it. It is a full 4 day class and you will leave being competent on the shaper. You will be hard pressed to find anyone with more shaper knowledge and experience than Joe, plus he is one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. Greg Godbout lives and breathes shaper tooling; the combination is hard to beat. JMHO, YMMV Patrick
[OP]
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I like the sound of that Patrick. Perhaps there is even some snow in Colorado. Sure is non here in NH.
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You can learn what you need about using your shaper without tracking down another owner of that specific model. I'm sure you would be well served by Joe Calhoon's workshop, but there are plenty of resources closer at hand. You must be familiar with some neighboring shops with shapers that would give you the nickel tour. You might try contacting Jeff Duncan through this site.
A worthwhile investment is Stephenson's Spindle Moulder Handbook.
Judging from your colleague's Instagram and website you shouldn't have any problem stepping up from a router table to a shaper. The principles are the same, it's just a matter of scale (and corresponding cost of tooling), and the capabilities are much increased.
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The owner of neighborhood shop where I worked very briefly a dozen or more years ago is not in good health. Good idea though Kevin. Interesting that you mentioned Jeff. I bought his SCM 50(?) planer a couple years ago when I relocated my shop to Michael's new space. It was very quickly replaced by a 24" Martin that Michael purchased. That SCM planer is up for grabs by the way. Thank you for mentioning Michael's (Graf) instagram and website. All of the cabinetry posted there I made with my router table but the time has come...
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Are there any other shops around that you are acquainted with? Not sure if you are a member on the FB cabinet industry groups but you could ask if anyone is local.
You must have some serious patience. I think I'd pull my hair out after a week of building doors on a RT.
[OP]
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Yes, patience is my greatest asset. I can setup very quickly and get very good results with my router table. But I am playing the long game. My retirement plan is to work until I am dead. Thanks for the heads up on FB cabinet group.
Hi Dan you are wise to be wary of any woodworking machine, but the shaper really is the Swiss army knife of the shop, and the time you spend getting comfortable with it, you will never regret.
I have been suggesting the spindle moulder handbook to folks for years, and it's a great way to go if you don't have a mentor. Also make sure you are using chip limiting, low kickback styles of tooling which have been required for commercial shops in Europe for years.
I've sent many folks to Joe's course over the years, but if you can't make it, Roy Sutton's video series is pretty good (though shows outdated tooling) for lower budget operations that haven't invested $20000 in Aigner jigs. A local mentor can be great, but it would be a shame if they used antiquated tooling and techniques and got you off on the wrong foot.
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