resawing with a rip saw

[Roger Rettenmeier]

Here is a 28 in. Disston that has about 3/ 8 in of plate filed off, filed concave, and with misshapen teethP1020261.jpgP1020263.jpgP1020264.jpg . It might be a candidate for a frame saw, 28 inches with 2 inches at the toe. Here is a picture of the full plate D8 beneath the saw in photo 3.P1020259.jpgP1020258.jpg The handle photo shows my repair job. The top of the handle was busted off from the thumbhole to the back of the handle. I think this pre 1928 Disston got busted and spent 85 years in a barn, and still has a near full plate.

[Mike Allen1010]

Lots of great information here from the previous posters. I thought I would throw in my two cents.

I do a fair amount of re-sawing hardwoods by hand, particularly in wider boards because my cheesy bandsaw has a maximum re-saw capacity of about 5". I also enjoy the exercise, but am not as young as I used to be.

FWIW:

* Wood selection is key. The Harder/more dense the wood, the more difficult this job becomes and at some level of hardness is for me just not feasible. Most kiln dried domestic hardwoods are doable, but I have quit in the middle of re-sawing some dense tropical woods because was just too slow and painful.

* I have had poor results with typical frame saws, because as some of the other posters mentioned, with a relatively narrow blade it is much harder to stay consistently on the layout line (especially on the backside of the cut), as compared to a typical Western "panel style" saw.

* IMHO, the most important elements of saw selection for re-sawing are panel length/width and tooth geometry ( in order: pitch (the number of teeth per inch), rake angle, set and sloped gullets).

Personally I like long, wide, premium model saws with significant taper ground into the plate for all ripping, and particularly for re-sawing. I think these factors matter more when ripping (as compared to cross cutting) because – longer cuts, removing more would. Long/wide saw plates have more mass and for me, are easier to maintain the momentum of the teeth moving through the long kerf in re-sawing. Also long/wide plates are better able to absorb the significant heat that gets generated during a long rip cut without distorting/dramatically expanding.

Set: Premium models whose plates generally have superior tensioning, often done by hand on an anvil, and more pronounced taper grind ( thicker at the tooth line and thinner at the top line), also pay a big dividend when ripping/re-sawing because they allow you to get away with less set. Consider the numbers below (don't hold me to these, these are off the top of my head but I'm pretty sure there relatively in the ballpark):

Premium Saw: Plate with at the widest portion .035". Additional set added .006" = total kerf width .041"

Typical Vintage Saw: Plate with at the widest portion .040". Additional set added .009" = total kerf width .049".

Difference= .008", 20% reduction in kerf width/wood removed. Might not sound like a lot, but definitely makes a real difference in terms of speed and effort.


Pitch: lower is better, except in very hardwoods. 3- 4 PPI is optimal, but hard to find. This is where one of the new purpose built, re-sawing frame saws like the one from Blackburn tools Mark mentioned could really excel. I have no personal experience so couldn't comment.

Rake angle: lower is faster. The trade-off is lower rake angle (0°-5°) can be harder to start and is more likely to "catch" if you hit a knot etc. With a little practice and experience these two things are fairly easy to overcome. The Disston factory standard rake angle prior to 1928 was 5° of rake. Post 1928, their customers weren't quite as experienced with handsaw's and they went to 8° of rake, for greater ease-of-use. I file most of my coarse pitch rip saw's between zero and 5°, however I "have a bad handsaw problem", so I have other rippers with more PPI/more rake angle for when a smoother finished surface is more important than speed.

Sloped gullets: this refers to lowering the handle the file below horizontal when filing the leading edge of a tooth. These can be further enhanced by using a smaller file than otherwise called for by the pitch/PPI to further exaggerate the depth of the gullets. The net result is a sloped gullet can carry more sawdust (is deeper) than one filed straight across (saw file Horizontal). The sawdust carrying capacity of gullets is important because once the gullets fills up with sawdust, the teeth stop cutting. This is particularly relevant in re-sawing because when you have a lot of teeth buried in the cut, it's more likely the gullets will fill up before the teeth exit the kerf.

Just my two cents, YMMV.

All the best, Mike

[Winton Applegate]

induction hardened teeth that you cannot file.

See that is what happens when I don't know any better . . .
and don't know what I am not supposed to be able to do . . .
I just went a head and did it not knowing it was impossible.

I had a little help but I love these things and use them for all sorts of metal working and carbide cutters. Very lightly of course just to keep them sharp; not to take out big nicks.

I might take a look at that Blackburn wide blade though. Sounds like a good thing.
When I made my saw I looked everywhere in catalogs and stores and found nothing.
We've come a long way baby.

[Winton Applegate]

Sawing with the frame saw is a different dance than with the panel saw.
Length can be much longer with the frame saw because you rock your whole body rather than use roughly your arm length. See the photo of Bob Moran using his shop made frame saw. This photo is from his book. That is what I went by to make my frame saw and use it.

I always enjoy showing these other photos of my Heroes reasawing. Toshio Odate showing how it's done with the big 'O Japanese saw and Frank Klausz and his brother resawing a plank for old times sake. This photo was in FWW. (if I remember right).

The last photo was the absolute best I could come up with, back ten years ago or so, for coarse tooth rip/resaw saws before I built the frame saw. I refiled the Japanese saw to a full rip from a combination tooth pattern. They were still no where coarse enough. Was fun on the narrower stuff but I needed much more length for the big planks I mentioned earlier. If I could have found a saw like Toshio's I would have bought it but nada. The frame saw was totally useful . . .
but
I either needed a second person on the other end to help stay on the line on the back side or I had to keep flipping the eighty pound purple heart and bubbinga planks. That got tedious.

PS: I don't recall much heat being generated and I waxed the blade occasionally and wedged the kerf if I was getting some blade pinch.
Ultimately it was the endless flipping to stay on the line and the unwieldy length for my eight foot ceilings that brought me to sink so low as to buy the Laguna band saw.
I was looking at an eight inch power jointer or combo euro planer/jointer at the same time and wound up not getting either so give me some Neander points there.

[Roger Rettenmeier]

I searched "frame saw" on this site, and came up with a few more threads and a lot more good information.