Planing trouble, help bitte....

[John Sanford]

Tonite, I was attempting to use my new Veritas Custom Jack to take the rock out of my endcap. The rock is corner to corner, the endcap is a purpleheart/maple/purpleheart sandwich. I was unable to get more than a couple of strokes before the blade would retreat back into the plane.

What's up with that? I've never encountered a blade that won't hold it's depth setting if the lever cap was cranked down enough. I thought I was cranking this one down, but... Seems to me that if I crank down enough to hold the setting, then I won't be able to adjust the depth. Not to mention the purported risk of damaging the plane itself by setting the lever cap too tight.

Bum plane? Bad technique? Mix? Something else?

[Jim Koepke]

John,

My hands have not yet held The Veritas Custom Jack.

Surely some will disagree with my understanding of using the style of adjuster these planes use. From my view point the cap needs to be tight and then loosened when adjusting the blade.

My premium planes are from Lie-Nielsen. There instructions advise to loosen the cap on planes with this type of adjusting mechanism.

The Bailey adjustment system works with an advantage of leverage. Still the brass depth adjusters can develop a lot of slop, usually politely referred to as backlash.

When the plane loses adjustment can you tell if the depth adjustment is moving? This happens on one of my old block planes that has seen better days. The other check would be if the cap iron is moving in relation to the blade.

jtk

[Max Neu]

sounds like movement from backlash. Are you taking the preventative measures to prevent backlash?

[Brian Holcombe]

I love a low angle plane guilty of this, I like to pull the blade back up against the adjuster to prevent that movement.

[Jim Koepke]

sounds like movement from backlash. Are you taking the preventative measures to prevent backlash?

I love a low angle plane guilty of this, I like to pull the blade back up against the adjuster to prevent that movement.

Okay, Max's post almost got me to reply. Then Brian's remark tipped the scales.

My understanding is the adjustment should be set with the adjuster pushing the blade forward. If one has gone too deep and backs off, there should then be a bit of forward rotation of the adjuster to put pressure on the blade.

Of course actual practice is different than established traditions. Often one of my planes will be backed off just a little in hopes a few more shavings will "push" the blade back a micrometer or two. Wishful thinking, but it could work, maybe.

jtk

[Max Neu]

yeah, the final adjustment should be made turning the adjuster knob clockwise.

[Daniel Rode]

When I back the blade off, I finish by spinning the knob forward (clockwise) until I take up all the backlash.

I'm not familiar with the Veritas Custom Jack but in general, I want the cap just tight enough to resist movement when planing but loose enough to allow the blade to be moved with the adjuster knob. I can feel it when it's right but it's not easy to describe how tight is tight enough.

[Winton Applegate]

the adjustment should be set with the adjuster pushing the blade forward. If one has gone too deep and backs off, there should then be a bit of forward rotation of the adjuster to put pressure on the blade.

I totally agree with Jim
Also is the "blade carrier" (see photo) fully engaged with the blade ? If it is then the blade can not budge if the Norris adjuster is set in the advance side of the thread lash (as opposed to the retracting side of the lash). Part of the beauty of the Norris adjuster.

PS: I suppose your frog could be loose. John, is your frog loose ? Shame on you.
I don't have one of these; does the frog sit in a non adjustable mortis or is it able to slip around or what ?

[Jim Koepke]

Is there on line instructions for this plane?

My quick search didn't turn up any to determine what Veritas might say on this.

Most of my life was spent playing with and working on mechanical mechanisms. All the little interfaces between the moving parts look deceivingly simple to my eyes.

It is also easy to see how folks who would put me to shame in another field may not be comfortable with the interaction of blades, holders, cap irons and strange looking adjusters.

jtk

[Derek Cohen]

Tonite, I was attempting to use my new Veritas Custom Jack to take the rock out of my endcap. The rock is corner to corner, the endcap is a purpleheart/maple/purpleheart sandwich. I was unable to get more than a couple of strokes before the blade would retreat back into the plane.

What's up with that? I've never encountered a blade that won't hold it's depth setting if the lever cap was cranked down enough. I thought I was cranking this one down, but... Seems to me that if I crank down enough to hold the setting, then I won't be able to adjust the depth. Not to mention the purported risk of damaging the plane itself by setting the lever cap too tight.

Bum plane? Bad technique? Mix? Something else?

John, assuming that the blade is seated correctly, all I can imagine is that the lever cap is too loose AND the adjuster screw is not in the forward rotation. One or other is likely not enough to cause the issue you describe.

The lever cap does not need to be so tight that you cannot use the Norris adjuster. Similarly, it is usual (for all plane types) to take up any backlash in an adjuster. The Veritas has very little anyway.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Matthews]

Not for nothing, is there a film of oil on the frog or blade?

[Brian Holcombe]

One more thought;

I had this happen on my jointer recently where it would back out of adjustment. The lever cap seemed tight, but the adjuster was very easy to turn. Tightening up the lever cap was enough to solve the problem, I simply tightened it up until there was a decent resistance on the adjuster screw, if it were 1/2 a turn it would be a lot.

[John Sanford]

So, an update.

I mostly took the plane apart to clean everything up and check on the frog. The frog was nice and tight, no movement there, I did not futz with the frog at all. While I had it apart, I touched up the blade and the reassembled it. After reassembly, it behaved correctly. I now have a nice flat face on my endcap.

I think that the problem was with the cap iron. I think what was happening is the blade was slipping back UNDER the cap iron. When I reassembled it, I believe I tightened the blade carrier up more than it was previously. Note that technically, the problem wasn't actually with the cap iron, it was with the user's failure to dial the plane in correctly. (Just wanted to be clear about that, let there be no aspersions cast upon the plane.)

One interesting feature about this plane in contrast to a Bailey style is the cap iron is practically a blade in it's own right. That puppy is sharp. Seems strange to me, but it does work.

[Richard Hutchings]

John, I can't imagine how the cap tightness could make the blade slip. As long as the last adjustment you made was in the forward position and the blade was properly seated over the adjuster arm, it can't slip. Are you sure this was engaged properly when you first tried it? How else could it slip. I still don't get it.

[Jim Koepke]

John, I can't imagine how the cap tightness could make the blade slip. As long as the last adjustment you made was in the forward position and the blade was properly seated over the adjuster arm, it can't slip. Are you sure this was engaged properly when you first tried it? How else could it slip. I still don't get it.

Loosen the cap iron screw on one of your blade assemblies, put it in the plane and try and plane some wood. Unless your lever cap screw is overly tight, the blade will slip while the cap iron is held by the adjuster.

jtk